Buying weapons in another state if you own property there

[workerOfTheWorld]

So, I'm not a gun owner yet, but I'm looking into my options. Ca is super restrictive with this ****, so I had a few questions about some legal ****.

1. If I buy property in say arizona, and then buy a gun (let's say an AR) in arizona, and I leave that firearm on that property, is that legal? I want to own an AR, but I don't want to go through all that bullet button and RAW bull**** I see talked about so much on here.
2. 30 round mags are legal in arizona, (afaik) and as long as I leave them in that state, I'm fine right?
3. I'm looking into prepping, and part of that would be buying an additional property out of state to bug out to. I'm looking at handguns, as I'd probably want to escape by motorcycle, and it's a bit hard to conceal a rifle that way. If I buy say a glock 17, it's mandated to come with 10 round mags instead of the usual 17 round mags. This is quite a difference. Is there any way to tell by a serial number or other inscription on the magazine when it was purchased? I know this is illegal, but one of my distant relatives was talking about importing 30 round mags for his AR before 2017, when he went on business trips to AZ. Is there any way to tell when and where a mag was purchased? On a different note, if I was to carry a handgun (let's say the glock again) with a 10 round mag, while in CA, and then out of the state, I was to switch to a 17 rounder, would that be illegal, presuming I hadn't been carrying the 17 rounder on me while in CA?
4. As I said before, I don't own a gun yet. If I was able to buy a gun in arizona on account of owning property there, what identification would I need to provide? My drivers license would be from Ca. Could I use mail or other proof of residency, or some other method in order to be able to buy a firearm, assuming I'm a dual-state citizen?

I like Ca, but the gun laws are ridiculous.

[johnk518]

[realbadlarry]

Or you have an AZ Id card........just sayin..

[G-forceJunkie]

1. If I buy property in say arizona, and then buy a gun (let's say an AR) in arizona, and I leave that firearm on that property, is that legal? I want to own an AR, but I don't want to go through all that bullet button and RAW bull**** I see talked about so much on here.

There is no such thing as dual residence when it comes to firearms purchases. An AZ gun Dealer will not sell you a gun with a CA DL.

2. 30 round mags are legal in arizona, (afaik) and as long as I leave them in that state, I'm fine right?

Correct. Buy and keep them in Arizona.

3. SNIP If I buy say a glock 17, it's mandated to come with 10 round mags instead of the usual 17 round mags. This is quite a difference. Is there any way to tell by a serial number or other inscription on the magazine when it was purchased?

No, most magazines are not marked with a manufacture date.

I know this is illegal, but one of my distant relatives was talking about importing 30 round mags for his AR before 2017, when he went on business trips to AZ. Is there any way to tell when and where a mag was purchased?

No. Hopefully your relative was just talking because importing anything over 10 rounds has been illegal for nearly 19 years.

On a different note, if I was to carry a handgun (let's say the glock again) with a 10 round mag, while in CA, and then out of the state, I was to switch to a 17 rounder, would that be illegal, presuming I hadn't been carrying the 17 rounder on me while in CA?

As long as the 17 rounder never enters California your good.

4. As I said before, I don't own a gun yet. If I was able to buy a gun in arizona on account of owning property there, what identification would I need to provide? My drivers license would be from Ca. Could I use mail or other proof of residency, or some other method in order to be able to buy a firearm, assuming I'm a dual-state citizen?

You cant buy a gun in Arizona legally as a California resident. Some people illegally get around that by obtaining an AZ ID.

I like Ca, but the gun laws are ridiculous.

Thats an understatement.

[P5Ret]

If you are able to somehow accomplish this, keep in mind that any handgun you purchase outside of Ca will have to be on the roster. In the case of a Glock 17 that will have to be a Gen3 model, and I don't think those are too widely available in gun shops outside of Ca.

[SkyHawk]

Say, anyone else remember the last CA resident who played AZ resident and bought guns? He just plead guilty to a federal felony, and lost his firearms rights - forever. When AZ agents visited the empty lot he claimed was his ‘AZ residence’, the jig was up.

https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/4953242/Kipper-Complaint.pdf

Good times...

Are you sure you want to play this game?

I know this is illegal, but one of my distant relatives was talking about importing 30 round mags for his AR before 2017, when he went on business trips to AZ.
...

I like Ca, but the gun laws are ridiculous.

And pre-2017 has *nothing* to do with legal / grandfathered standard cap mags in CA. It is pre-2000

Mr Kipper also thought CA gun laws were ridiculous. He tried to game them and lost his rights to ever handle a firearm again. Good luck to you. This forum is regularly monitored by law enforcement and you just laid out your conspiracy to violate the Gun Control Act of 1968, in writing.

[johnk518]

[workerOfTheWorld]

As I said, I haven't done anything yet, and don't plan to violate any laws. I was just wondering what the laws around this were.

As for my distant relative, now that I think about it it was a lot further back than 2017. I might have also not remembered things correctly; it was an awful long time ago.

I was also not planning on purchasing any guns in Arizona and bringing them back to Cali; the laws around that seem awfully complicated and I'd prefer not to mess with that.

So, I'd need to legally be a citizen of Arizona in order to buy firearms in that state. That seems like an awful lot of work just to have an AR that I don't have to register, along with mags with greater capacity than 10 rounds. I've heard horror stories about people getting 2 driver's licenses, and doing stuff like that to get around the laws, and I'd prefer not to end up in federal prison. I'd also really not prefer to work in AZ, as there aren't many jobs in my field. So, that's probably out of the question.

I think I'll just stay in CA for now, and I'll read up on RAW and featureless rifles. I'll also look into guns not regulated by the magazine limit. The 1911 looks cool, and with a mag capacity of 7 rounds, is perfectly legal in CA. Iirc, the mosin nagant is pretty cheap and has a non-removable internal magazine of ~5 rounds (I forget exactly), and is bolt action, so there's not much for the lawmakers to complain about there.

Is there anything else you guys would suggest? I like the standardization of 9mm, but having a smaller round and then empty space at the bottom of a magazine just seems like a waste. I also like cheap, and from what I've seen 7.62x54r is pretty budget.

[SonofWWIIDI]

I’m not gonna call “alphabet agency”, but “alphabet agency”



And or



If I’m wrong, my apologies.

[johnk518]

[Cokebottle]

Yes and no.
For long guns, the Fed only requires that the purchase go through an FFL.
As a Californian, you can not bring one purchased out of state back into California, but you could buy a long gun and store it out of state.

For handguns, you do have to be a resident of that state.

[Quiet]

I've heard horror stories about people getting 2 driver's licenses, and doing stuff like that to get around the laws, and I'd prefer not to end up in federal prison.

Federal laws (REAL ID Act of 2005) prohibits a person from having more than one valid driver's license. [6 CFR 37.29]



6 CFR 37.29
Prohibition against holding more than one REAL ID card or more than one driver's license.
(a) An individual may hold only one REAL ID card. An individual cannot hold a REAL ID driver's license and a REAL ID identification card simultaneously. Nothing shall preclude an individual from holding a REAL ID card and a non-REAL ID card unless prohibited by his or her State.
(b) Prior to issuing a REAL ID driver's license,
(1) A State must check with all other States to determine if the applicant currently holds a driver's license or REAL ID identification card in another State.
(2) If the State receives confirmation that the individual holds a driver's license in another State, or possesses a REAL ID identification card in another State, the receiving State must take measures to confirm that the person has terminated or is terminating the driver's license or REAL ID identification card issued by the prior State pursuant to State law, regulation or procedure.
(c) Prior to issuing a REAL ID identification card,
(1) A State must check with all other States to determine if the applicant currently holds a REAL ID driver's license or identification card in another State.
(2) If the State receives confirmation that the individual holds a REAL ID card in another State the receiving State must take measures to confirm that the person has terminated or is terminating the REAL ID driver's license or identification card issued by the prior State pursuant to State law, regulation or procedure.

[RickD427]

Yes and no.
For long guns, the Fed only requires that the purchase go through an FFL.
As a Californian, you can not bring one purchased out of state back into California, but you could buy a long gun and store it out of state.

For handguns, you do have to be a resident of that state.

Not quite true. It is possible for a person to purchase long guns outside their state of residence, but the federal law also requires that the out-of-state transfer of the long comply with the laws of the purchaser's home state. Since California law requires the DROS of long guns, and so far as I know, has not enrolled any out-of-state dealers in the DROS system, that makes it impossible for a California resident to purchase out of state.

[M1NM]

You can buy a gun out of state. But it must then be sent to a CA FFL for you to fill out the paperwork and 10 day wait. Move to AZ get a license, register to vote, buy a bunch of guns, off roster ok, decide you don't like living in AZ, move back to CA, get a license, register to vote, volreg your arsenal.

[jeremiah12]

The ATF does have a provision for dual residency.

https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/retrieveECFR?gp=&SID=7c7b0f92fae38ecb9809b970d6c49f84&n=sp27.3.478.b&r=SUBPART&ty=HTML

State of residence. The State in which an individual resides. An individual resides in a State if he or she is present in a State with the intention of making a home in that State. If an individual is on active duty as a member of the Armed Forces, the individual's State of residence is the State in which his or her permanent duty station is located, as stated in 18 U.S.C. 921(b). The following are examples that illustrate this definition:

Example 1. A maintains a home in State X. A travels to State Y on a hunting, fishing, business, or other type of trip. A does not become a resident of State Y by reason of such trip.
Example 2. A maintains a home in State X and a home in State Y. A resides in State X except for weekends or the summer months of the year and in State Y for the weekends or the summer months of the year. During the time that A actually resides in State X, A is a resident of State X, and during the time that A actually resides in State Y, A is a resident of State Y.

This is for people who legitimately own two homes and spend part of the year in one state and part of the year in another..

For those of us in CA, in order to bring the gun back into CA, you would first have to have it shipped to a CA FFL.

Now, Kipper screwed up on many accounts, he did not have a legitimate residence in AZ, he did not send his guns through a CA FFL when bringing them back to CA, he owned a gun range that pissed of the locals because they were shooting guns at all hours, day and night and many believed they heard automatic weapons being fired, and he was obviously selling firearms for a business. He just pissed off the Feds and they were out to get him for everything. The news account I read did not mention any automatic weapons being found during the search of his property. It did mention that he did not comply with CA law when bringing the guns back to CA, so CA alerted the ATF because because he was the owner of a gun range and a supposed gun owner but had no guns registered to him. CA had reason to believe he was bringing guns in from AZ to sell in CA.

The other issue that will interfere with this is the real ID act. Years ago, my step-father had a DL from OR and a summer home there and a ID from AR where his winter home was. He bought guns in both states. He has since passed away, but with the real ID act, he could not have both a DL and ID card.

Personally, as a CA resident, I just would not chance it.

If you want an AR to keep in AZ, buy a featureless one here, take it to AZ, and then add the features you want there and keep it there. It is legally the safest way to handle it.