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  #721  
Old 03-27-2011, 5:16 PM
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Originally Posted by AndrewMendez View Post
That's the price for a semi auto mini??????
If you can find one.
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  #722  
Old 03-27-2011, 6:12 PM
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Going rate or not, if I'm paying that much, I want full auto or antique.
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  #723  
Old 03-27-2011, 7:53 PM
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Originally Posted by AndrewMendez View Post
That's the price for a semi auto mini??????
Yeah, they didn't make very many of them. It's not like thousands of them were made, sold to Lilliput where they were converted to .22lr and then demilled and sold on the open market like the Izzy's did with the full sized ones.

That's only the 2nd one I've ever seen for sale. The other one went for slightly more I believe.
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  #724  
Old 03-27-2011, 8:21 PM
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When I got mine, Lakeside who took over the Tippman line, offered a vary limited number of kits with the castings and some finished parts that with some machining and a lot of hand fitting you could build oonne for about half the cost. I have over 100 hours into mine.

Lakeside, like Tippman, builds less than 50 guns a year, not all of them 1919's. They do make a 22LR belt-fed upper for an AR. They are probably the cheapest way to get into a belt fed gun.
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  #725  
Old 03-27-2011, 8:33 PM
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Going rate or not, if I'm paying that much, I want full auto or antique.
$4500, will barely buy a FA M11 or Mac10... Almost double for an UZI, and you'll be north of 12K for M16.

I do understand; $4500 can go a long ways in the milk and diaper department. I'd be hard pressed to spend on a mini 1919. But I couldn't argue, it would be major fun to own...


Anyways, just finished engraving a few KMP 80%'er plates. Here is an iphone pic...

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  #726  
Old 03-27-2011, 8:41 PM
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$4500, will barely buy a FA M11 or Mac10... Almost double for an UZI, and you'll be north of 12K for M16.

I do understand; $4500 can go a long ways in the milk and diaper department. I'd be hard pressed to spend on a mini 1919. But I couldn't argue, it would be major fun to own...


Anyways, just finished engraving a few KMP 80%'er plates. Here is an iphone pic...

Nice, very nice. Where are the numbers and initials? Mine should be there by Mon or tuesday, its packed really tight. Don't mind the drawing on the other side of the paper, the little one was bored waiting in line, so she decided to draw on it.
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  #727  
Old 03-27-2011, 8:58 PM
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Numbers and Initials to follow..
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  #728  
Old 03-27-2011, 8:59 PM
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Originally Posted by 50BMGBOB View Post
When I got mine, Lakeside who took over the Tippman line, offered a vary limited number of kits with the castings and some finished parts that with some machining and a lot of hand fitting you could build oonne for about half the cost. I have over 100 hours into mine.

Lakeside, like Tippman, builds less than 50 guns a year, not all of them 1919's. They do make a 22LR belt-fed upper for an AR. They are probably the cheapest way to get into a belt fed gun.
You can't build one from scratch? $ame internals just smaller, or is it a completely different set up?
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  #729  
Old 03-27-2011, 9:02 PM
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Numbers and Initials to follow..
Do you actually stamp them, or are they engraved at a different time?
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  #730  
Old 03-27-2011, 9:11 PM
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While it is vary similar, it is completely different. Easier to show you at the BP than try to explain it with my typing skills, especially on my phone.
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  #731  
Old 03-27-2011, 10:10 PM
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OK guys, getting back on track with the builds at hand... Here's my update along with lots of questions!

I have my 30-06 kit, KMP trigger and sear, bucking bar, rivet set & drill bits, and RSP in hand. I'm getting ready to send internals out for machining. Also getting Cali-V to engrave my serial #. I plan to have my RSP 100% complete and ready to go before the build party.

I finally unpacked my Sarco 30-06 kit and thoroughly degreased every single part. I've also figured out how to disassemble and reassemble this whole gun just by playing around with it. See...





Here are some questions:
1) My trunnion is pretty worn and the barrel shroud are badly chewed up. Is this normal or should I try to get Sarco to replace them? The pics don't really show the damage to the trunnion. There are several gouges in it.





2) The rear sight appears bent and is stamped 7.62. Should Sarco replace this too (because it is bent)? Can this be had in 30-06 calibration? Where? The Izzy sight protector weld is pretty crappy too.





3) I'm going to have my personal info engraved on the inside of the RSP. What is typically engraved? What would keep the ATF happy? Name, location, etc?

4) Regarding the trunnion hole. My trunnion is sleeved but one side is dented. Both trunnion plates are 5/8 and the RSP is 9/16. Seems the easiest thing would be to drill out the RSP to 5/8 and have the sleeve straightened out at the build party. Correct? Is there any reason to press out the sleeve, drill the RSP anyway, and run a 5/8 hole?

5) Regarding the sequence of events with bead blasting, degreasing, and assembly. Like I said, I degreased everything in solvent. Should I disassemble every last part of this thing like the sights, top cover, back plate, etc? Will we sandblast everything before assembly, after, or both? When we park, is it when fully assembled or every little part individually?

Thanks for the answers experienced ones. Hopefully everyone can benefit from them.
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  #732  
Old 03-27-2011, 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by 50BMGBOB View Post
When I got mine, Lakeside who took over the Tippman line, offered a vary limited number of kits with the castings and some finished parts that with some machining and a lot of hand fitting you could build oonne for about half the cost. I have over 100 hours into mine.

Lakeside, like Tippman, builds less than 50 guns a year, not all of them 1919's. They do make a 22LR belt-fed upper for an AR. They are probably the cheapest way to get into a belt fed gun.
I got my Razorback running much better. Lots of oil and it works much better. I'm planning on modding it to look as much like a 1919 as possible including shroud and possibly spade grips with tripod.

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  #733  
Old 03-28-2011, 12:17 AM
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cold dead hands....

1.) Without the thing in hand, I can't tell you if it will hold up or not. However, its probably fine, and if its not your kinda **** out of luck because Sarco required exchanges with two weeks or something along those lines.

2.) As far as returning...see post one. Can it be bent back? I don't think the 30 06 and 308 sights are different.

3.) The ATF doesn't care about your plate, as you are not doing anything illegal. Maybe throw the date and your initials or something along those lines. I am not pouting anything other then my own serial numbers and initials got the inspectors spot.

4.) The sleeve on mine was also dented. I grinded one side down completely, and will do the other this week, at the party, I erik drill it out, our use Bobs tool he is inventing. You can always sleeve after.

5.) Sand blasting in parts. The box of course will be over piece, but the to cover, grip, internals will all beer out...i think?
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  #734  
Old 03-28-2011, 12:55 AM
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Originally Posted by audiophil2 View Post
I got my Razorback running much better. Lots of oil and it works much better. I'm planning on modding it to look as much like a 1919 as possible including shroud and possibly spade grips with tripod.
On Lakesides form is a thread on a guy who made a custom lower with a tripod and spade grip so it looks like a 1919.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdDeadHands1 View Post
Here are some questions:
1) My trunnion is pretty worn and the barrel shroud are badly chewed up. Is this normal or should I try to get Sarco to replace them? The pics don't really show the damage to the trunnion. There are several gouges in it.

2) The rear sight appears bent and is stamped 7.62. Should Sarco replace this too (because it is bent)? Can this be had in 30-06 calibration? Where? The Izzy sight protector weld is pretty crappy too.

3) I'm going to have my personal info engraved on the inside of the RSP. What is typically engraved? What would keep the ATF happy? Name, location, etc?

4) Regarding the trunnion hole. My trunnion is sleeved but one side is dented. Both trunnion plates are 5/8 and the RSP is 9/16. Seems the easiest thing would be to drill out the RSP to 5/8 and have the sleeve straightened out at the build party. Correct? Is there any reason to press out the sleeve, drill the RSP anyway, and run a 5/8 hole?

5) Regarding the sequence of events with bead blasting, degreasing, and assembly. Like I said, I degreased everything in solvent. Should I disassemble every last part of this thing like the sights, top cover, back plate, etc? Will we sandblast everything before assembly, after, or both? When we park, is it when fully assembled or every little part individually?

Thanks for the answers experienced ones. Hopefully everyone can benefit from them.
1) Maybe, the shroud could be sanded smooth as everything is going to be reparked. Trunion is harder to see so I won't comment.

2)I won't worry about the sight. Looks like yours is a 308 gun that they swapped the parts so it shoots 30-06. But like I said, I wouldn't worry about it but if you did find a sight later, it would be easy to change at a later time.

3) ATF wants the name, location and a serial #. At least that is what they require for FFL's While home builts aren't required to have any markings, something along those lines would work. At vary least, a serial # would help with ID'ing it.

4) Yes, you can straighten the bushing and drill the RSP out to 5/8", you could lose the bushing and do it as a 5/8".

5) The receiver box is riveted, then blast and park. The other parts can be blasted separately in some Assembly's and parked. When I built mine, I assembled it and test fired it, then took it back apart to park it a few weeks later.
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  #735  
Old 03-28-2011, 6:07 PM
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Do you actually stamp them, or are they engraved at a different time?
I don't stamp them...



Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdDeadHands1 View Post

3) I'm going to have my personal info engraved on the inside of the RSP. What is typically engraved? What would keep the ATF happy? Name, location, etc?
Name, caliber, serial number, model name(optional), and location.

The engraving, is required only if, at sometime in the future, you decide to sale the firearm.

Also you can search "27 CFR 478.92"
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  #736  
Old 03-28-2011, 7:23 PM
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Question about marking/engraving: what we're doing is perfectly legal now, this could change at any time, would it be a good idea to engrave the date somewhere?
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  #737  
Old 03-28-2011, 9:31 PM
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I found this picture of the engraving on the inside of a RSP on T&S Manufacturing's website:

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  #738  
Old 03-28-2011, 9:48 PM
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I found this picture of the engraving on the inside of a RSP on T&S Manufacturing's website:

I like that a lot. I don't think the ATF will ever force a long arms bill, as it has had zero affect on anything except increasing the amount we have to pay for a gun. However, to help you sleep better at night, I think something like that on the inside is cheap insurance. Maybe somewhere visible from from the top plate?
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  #739  
Old 03-29-2011, 1:26 AM
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However, to help you sleep better at night, I think something like that on the inside is cheap insurance. Maybe somewhere visible from from the top plate?
The inside engraving pictured would be visible in the ejection port if the gun was laid on its side. Remember, while the links/belt ejects out the side the spent shell casing drops out of the bottom.
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  #740  
Old 03-29-2011, 1:06 PM
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The inside engraving pictured would be visible in the ejection port if the gun was laid on its side. Remember, while the links/belt ejects out the side the spent shell casing drops out of the bottom.
That was the hardest part of the concept to figure out. Anyone have a good side for links? I have a guy selling some to me, but its bit enough for everyone. Oh and what is thee issue with using a condom if you are using links instead if a cloth belt?
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  #741  
Old 03-29-2011, 6:36 PM
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That was the hardest part of the concept to figure out. Anyone have a good side for links? I have a guy selling some to me, but its bit enough for everyone. Oh and what is thee issue with using a condom if you are using links instead if a cloth belt?
I hadn't really thought about it but, I do have a few thousand 30-06 links around here that I'd be willing to part with. Trust me, you don't want to use them with .308 unless, you bend each one of them a bit to loosen them up.
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  #742  
Old 03-29-2011, 7:42 PM
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That was the hardest part of the concept to figure out. Anyone have a good side for links? I have a guy selling some to me, but its bit enough for everyone. Oh and what is thee issue with using a condom if you are using links instead if a cloth belt?
Years ago I bought a bunch from Ohio Ordnance Works, they have gone up sense I got mine but they still list them. http://ohioordnanceworks.com/Parts/L...ts_Loaders.cat If you buy 1,001 links it is $70.07. I got 3,000 links when I got mine but usually use and reuse about 400 of them, the rest of them are in a box for when the SHTF.

I never heard of the "condom".
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  #743  
Old 03-29-2011, 9:21 PM
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I hadn't really thought about it but, I do have a few thousand 30-06 links around here that I'd be willing to part with. Trust me, you don't want to use them with .308 unless, you bend each one of them a bit to loosen them up.
Hmmmmm, I have to do something about my memory, I think I already knew that. I swear that I read somewhere that you could do something besides mess with each one.
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Old 03-29-2011, 9:26 PM
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Years ago I bought a bunch from Ohio Ordnance Works, they have gone up sense I got mine but they still list them. http://ohioordnanceworks.com/Parts/L...ts_Loaders.cat If you buy 1,001 links it is $70.07. I got 3,000 links when I got mine but usually use and reuse about 400 of them, the rest of them are in a box for when the SHTF.

I never heard of the "condom".
Not a bad price at all. 6 cents each for over 10000....group buy??????
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  #745  
Old 03-31-2011, 11:54 AM
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Hello everybody
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Old 03-31-2011, 1:50 PM
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Anyone else....it would cost about 60 bucks per 1000 add a couple bucks maybe for shipping.
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Old 03-31-2011, 1:52 PM
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READ THIS TWICE PLEASE.




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There are two types of 1919 links to choose from. USGI links which are for 30-06 and will also work for 8mm if the seating depth is adjusted (hard to do consistently) but will not work for .308. And then there is the Israeli links which are for .308 and will work with 8mm fully seated but will not work for 30-06. Hope that is not too confusing. Ohio Ordnance Works had the best prices for the Izzy links.
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  #748  
Old 03-31-2011, 2:10 PM
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There are two types of 1919 links to choose from. USGI links which are for 30-06 and will also work for 8mm if the seating depth is adjusted (hard to do consistently) but will not work for .308. And then there is the Israeli links which are for .308 and will work with 8mm fully seated but will not work for 30-06. Hope that is not too confusing. Ohio Ordnance Works had the best prices for the Izzy links.
I wonder why mine will work with .308? They don't work well unless you stretch them out just a bit but, they do work.
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Old 03-31-2011, 9:13 PM
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M60 link work? Dang it! I gave about 5K to a friend who has a NFA HK21.
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  #750  
Old 03-31-2011, 9:27 PM
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i have a bucking bar and rivet head forming tool i can contribute to the party. at the very least i will ship them to you if i cant make it so you can use them at the party. i think i am going to be able to make it now to help (read the dates wrong before....dohh)but ill let you know for sure as it gets closer.
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  #751  
Old 04-01-2011, 2:59 AM
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M60 links will work with the finger chopped off and I guess you could bend the 30-06 links and stuff .308 into them but I was talking out of the box and perfect function loading with a linker.
I haven't ever seen anyone use links from an M60 in a standard 1919. I have seen the Izzy links used for 30-06. They are a little loose on 06 but they will work. same as USGI links on 308, they are a little tight but can work.
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Old 04-01-2011, 3:11 AM
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I talked with Bolt2Bounce today and it looks like he can make it. He hasn't talked to his wife about it yet though. That means I will bring my truck down so I will have some extra room for tools.

CSACannoneer and AndrewMendez- Should I bring another blast cabinet down? Do you have enough air for a second cabinet? My compressor is a large upright with a 220V motor. I have a 100ft cord for it if we have power where I could leave it in the back of the truck. Not the best to transport but I could if needed. Think about it and let me know.
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Old 04-02-2011, 12:41 AM
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I have a compressor, but no truck to haul it over. I put it in my car, with not so good end results. Glad B2B is on board, the more members, the better. I am going to go thru the thread when I get a quick minute to relax.....when ever the hell that is, and make a final list for parts and the like. IIRC, Greg now was 2 Blast cabinets.
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Old 04-02-2011, 12:19 PM
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I will be driving my truck and going past you (I think), I could easily stop by and load up your compressor (& you if you want).

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I have a compressor, but no truck to haul it over. I put it in my car, with not so good end results. Glad B2B is on board, the more members, the better. I am going to go thru the thread when I get a quick minute to relax.....when ever the hell that is, and make a final list for parts and the like. IIRC, Greg now was 2 Blast cabinets.
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Old 04-02-2011, 1:26 PM
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My second blast cabinet is not online yet. I don't know if I'll find the time to get it ready before then. Also, if someone could pick up a 44lb(?) jug of abrasive media from Harbor Freight, I'm sure you'll be reembursed from the BP fees. I've got a couple other things that I need to devote my time to right now.
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Old 04-02-2011, 3:11 PM
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Decide if I need to bring my compressor down, it is a 60gal upright with a 6.5hp motor. I talked with CSACannoneer and it will work. I just need to know a few days before the BP so I can load it in my truck (takes two people).
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Old 04-02-2011, 9:21 PM
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I will be driving my truck and going past you (I think), I could easily stop by and load up your compressor (& you if you want).
I am off the 210 and 57 freeway.
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Old 04-03-2011, 9:16 PM
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Andrew, I should be in to watch / hang out / drink beer / eat, I can pitch in a few bucks and/or bring something. I think the only thing from making it a for sure, is the fact that I would have to wake up and drive to BFE.

Chuck
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Old 04-05-2011, 3:29 PM
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Count me in for the last stanby spot. Thx
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Old 04-06-2011, 7:45 AM
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Bob, Chuck D is bringing my compressor to thee party, if you can comfortably being it, please being your blast cabinet. A buddies dad may have a working one if not, but still working getting in contact with him.
Alright guys, I still want this to be done in one day, one long long day. We now have two alternative spots filled, and I also want them to be able to finish their firearms.

Food...what do you guys want to eat. Come to the party with your own breakfast, we will have a safety briefing, you can eat then if you didn't already. I need everyone to sign a waiver giving me your first born. Ok, is just a release of liability. If you have any questions about what it says, please let me know prior, and I can get you a copy.

IF YOU ARE COMING TO THE PARTY TO WATCH, HANG OUT, DRINK BEER, PLEASE LET ME KNOW VIA PM OR IN THE THREAD, if you have not already told me.
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