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Curio & Relic/Black Powder Curio & Relics and Black Powder Firearms, Old School shooting fun! |
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#1
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Unsafe Garand food
Oooops! Looks like some new Garand shooters may have screwed the pooch.
"The CMP advises to not use .30/06 ammunition in M1 Garands, 1903s, and 1903A3s that is loaded beyond 50,000 CUP and has a bullet weight more than 172-174gr. These rifles are at least 70 years old and were not designed for max loads and super heavy bullets. Always wear hearing and eye protection when firing an M1 Garand, 1903 and/or 1903A3 rifle. This warning is an update/addition to the Ammunition section in the Read This First manual enclosed with each rifle shipment (M1 Garand manual-page 6 and M1903 manual-page 10). Civilian Marksmanship Program" Wonder if there are any new Garand Kboom vids on youtube... |
#3
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Might be in response to this
https://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=279785 Some blowhard over on CMP forums insisting commercial ammo is fine through a Garand Apparently he got an article published on the same topic in the Garand Collectors Association magazine and they ended up doing a retraction in a subsequent addition |
#5
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The adjustable gas plug allows for 30-06 ammo to be used in your Garand. Installed the plug, but kept it backed out enough so that the rifle would not cycle. First shot, had to manually move op rod to eject. Adjust plug a quarter turn and fired second shot, manually move op rod to eject, etc ... slowly tightening the gas plug until the rifle fully cycles. The adjustable gas plug prevents the build up of too much pressure, which could bend the op rod.
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God, Corps, Country ... Semper Fi |
#7
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Lots of guns out there
Lots of Rules out there - verify correct ammo for firearm... If you don't want to read the book.... I guess you get to possibly pay for new parts...
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Rule 1- ALL GUNS ARE ALWAYS LOADED Rule 2 -NEVER LET THE MUZZLE COVER ANYTHING YOU ARE NOT PREPARED TO DESTROY (including your hands and legs) Rule 3 -KEEP YOUR FINGER OFF THE TRIGGER UNTIL YOUR SIGHTS ARE ON THE TARGET Rule 4 -BE SURE OF YOUR TARGET AND WHAT IS BEYOND IT (thanks to Jeff Cooper) |
#9
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Mine burned Federal Classic 165gr boat tail rnds for years, the old red and white box that is. Don't hunt with it anymore, so now it gets 150 gr already loaded on clips from the shows, ya know, the stuff with the cardboard cover over the rnds. But, most of that went bye bye years ago, just a few cans of it left now. Never got a bent op rod.
Psalm 1 Last edited by Garand Hunter; 04-20-2021 at 3:15 PM.. Reason: spelling |
#11
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#12
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IIRC, weren't there some heat treat problems with some years of the 1903? I think they were occasionally blowing up for awhile.
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"Show me a young conservative and I'll show you a man without a heart. Show me an old liberal and I'll show you a man without a brain." - Sir Winston Churchill "I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue!" - Senator Barry Goldwater |
#13
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That was pre-1918 1903s. The CMP website has a serial number cut-off for those. I used to have a 1918 1903 that was post the cutoff and it shot modern heavy ammo without a problem. The 1903A3's were WWII era. I think mine are 1942 built.
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#15
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M1 rifle Port Pressure - is not the same as Chamber Pressure.
Fast powders - can create high chamber pressures, but, after the short burn, "vent" into the Bbl., resulting in cooler gas and lower port pressures. Slow powders - especially in conjunction with heavy bullets, are capable of creating low or spec chamber pressures, but, through the long burn, extend those chamber pressures all the way down to the gas port, resulting in hot, energized gas and excessive port pressures. And while the Fast powders can generate above spec port pressures, the area under the curve at the port is generally broad - a push to the gas system. Slow powders, on the other hand, with their still burning and energized gas at the port, generate a spiked pressure curve - a kick to the gas system. And while both may generate both spec. or excessive Op-rod speeds - it is the kick generated by the slow burn rate powders that stresses the Op-rod. M1 rifle Op-rod and Powder Burn Rate - Gus Fisher GR
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“...Cogito, ergo armatum sum..." (I think, therefore I am armed.) -- Lt. Col. Dave Grossman -- |
#16
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I've seen a couple of op rods bent from the use of current commercial ammo, but never saw a Garand self-destruct. A Schuster adjustable gas plug solves the issue.
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I'm retired. That's right, retired. I don't want to hear about the cop who stopped you today or how you didn't think you should get a ticket. That just makes me grumpy! |
#17
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I've always used 30-06 ammunition made specifically for the M1 Garand. The way I understand it was 30-06 ammunition was made for bolt action rifles and the "M1 Garand 30-06" ammunition was made for semi automatic rifles.
IMG_A8CB3E036A26-1.jpg |
#18
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#19
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No, I remember when I was overseas in the late 60's, the Air Force would use old crates of brand new minty 1903's to practice air drops over the field. When they hit the ground, some of the crates would bust open. But, all the crates and guns were destroyed after the drops. When asked why, a General in the stands said they were all bad heat treat manufactured lots and were too dangerous to use, lend, or sell. So they were all destroyed afterwards. That's why they were used for practice drops. They were considered junk.
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"Show me a young conservative and I'll show you a man without a heart. Show me an old liberal and I'll show you a man without a brain." - Sir Winston Churchill "I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue!" - Senator Barry Goldwater |
#20
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#21
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Good article on low numbers https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/...safe-to-shoot/
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#23
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Some .30 WW1 ammunition was of poor quality and after several years started experiencing case base failures. When the base failed some brittle receivers came apart. A good 03 receiver channels the gas into the magazine and the magazine plate would blow off but the receiver would hold. The service failures stopped when the ammo was withdrawn from use. Low number rifles were used in WW2.
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#24
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RL15 and H4895 150g M2 pulled bullets Same load for everything.
If you can see it you can hit it to 500 yards. But if you look for trouble you WILL find it.
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WTS As new M47 Madsen 3006 w/bayonet. WTS NIB Mosin 91/59 I will deliver or ship, details to be arranged with buyer. The Spartans do not ask how many the enemies are but where they are. |
#25
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So he says Garand were designed for M1 ball so most stuff is good to go without modification?
https://youtu.be/UOSdswZHJUc This video from 6 years ago. Russian steel cased ammo. At the time, people were perplexed as to why someone will would use steel case on a Garand. I expect to see more with the scarcity of factory 30-06 ammo available within spec. https://youtu.be/TleMPyDq56s Sent from my SH-PXCRQBWBR using Tapatalk
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Last edited by PogoJack; 05-09-2021 at 11:36 AM.. |
#27
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surplus French and some Austrian .30-06 ball suffer base failures from brittle brass. That will wreck the stock at least on an M1. Same with Some WW1 U.S. ball but that stuff has to be all gone by now. |
#28
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Would the brittle surplus French/Austrian ammo be older 1950's corrosive?
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...a fool and his money were lucky to get together in the first place... |
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