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  #161  
Old 10-13-2022, 9:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Capybara View Post
Cheek rests are not pistol braces.
I did the same with my AR pistol quite a spell ago as I could see the slippery slope with braces. I'd rather not have the worry. Or at least until the Sacramento or ATF goon squads decides that cheek rests are the next evil feature.
We clearly know that the mere existence of AR and AK pistols make the Civilian Disarmament Industrial Complex foam at the mouth. It's just a matter for time until they decide their next flimsy, idiotic, made up regulation to try to ban them. Honestly the ATF and the CADOJ are just like petulant, bratty children, it's not that hard to forecast their next moves when we know their mandate for pushing hard for civilian disarmament and making up bull**** regulations that aren't laws.
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  #162  
Old 10-13-2022, 10:31 AM
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Folks all of this discussion is somewhat Irrelevant in California. All the discussion with ATF has nothing whatsoever to do with a cow doj and California law. Caldoj has not opined as to braces and I assure you if you are stopped with one they will consider it to be a short barrel rifle and give you no quarter. Well I am happy to represent you in the criminal trial, I refuse to be a defendant. Keep your pistols as pistols and rifles over 30 in unless registered Etc
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  #163  
Old 10-13-2022, 1:03 PM
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Folks all of this discussion is somewhat Irrelevant in California. All the discussion with ATF has nothing whatsoever to do with a cow doj and California law. Caldoj has not opined as to braces and I assure you if you are stopped with one they will consider it to be a short barrel rifle and give you no quarter. Well I am happy to represent you in the criminal trial, I refuse to be a defendant. Keep your pistols as pistols and rifles over 30 in unless registered Etc
I agree with what you say, but back to CADOJ and or local LEA, if you have an AR pistol with only a buffer tube or Thordsen Cheek Rest, can you think of PC that the DA will be able to successfully charge you with? As of today, AR and AK pistols, as long as configured correctly with a maglock, are legal. Correct?
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  #164  
Old 10-13-2022, 7:06 PM
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^^ yes as of today, braced pistols with a maglock are legal.
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  #165  
Old 10-13-2022, 8:23 PM
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So if I can get an SBR stamp for my AR pistol, and if I leave a brace on it, I can have a braced pistol legally in CA?
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  #166  
Old 10-13-2022, 8:51 PM
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CAL.BaR is there a calguns discount?
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  #167  
Old 10-13-2022, 9:00 PM
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So if I can get an SBR stamp for my AR pistol, and if I leave a brace on it, I can have a braced pistol legally in CA?
From everything I've read and seen, maybe. Braced pistols, unless some laws are changed or they can meet the new ATF made up regs, will no longer be legal in California as far as SBR'd versions because California forbids modern SBRs unless you have a California Dangerous Weapons Permit. if your braced pistol meets the ATF guidelines, I believe you don't have to Form 1 it. But very limited braces and very specific criteria meet the new ATF regulations.
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  #168  
Old 10-14-2022, 5:18 AM
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If you keep up with the new decisions by the supreems, the ATF is quickly losing it's ability to makeup new restrictions. My bet is that by December, they will not have the power to enact the brace ruling.
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  #169  
Old 10-14-2022, 6:36 AM
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If you keep up with the new decisions by the supreems, the ATF is quickly losing it's ability to makeup new restrictions. My bet is that by December, they will not have the power to enact the brace ruling.
The current administration has already acknowledged things they planned to do won't stand up in court, but they did them anyway. See the rent moratorium and sweet & sour sniffles shot mandates as examples.
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  #170  
Old 10-14-2022, 8:49 AM
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If you keep up with the new decisions by the supreems, the ATF is quickly losing it's ability to makeup new restrictions. My bet is that by December, they will not have the power to enact the brace ruling.
Only if someone in a black nightgown says so. Are there any suits going on now?
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  #171  
Old 10-14-2022, 10:22 AM
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If you keep up with the new decisions by the supreems, the ATF is quickly losing it's ability to makeup new restrictions. My bet is that by December, they will not have the power to enact the brace ruling.
I agree with you. But in a world where NY, CA, Mass, NJ and Hawaii simply ignore SCOTUS and SCOTUS decisions, who will hold the tyrants who ignore the ruling accountable? Laws are only worthwhile if people actually obey them. Apparently Gav Boy, Bonta and the Ca Legislature are blatantly ignoring the ruling. Whose gonna arrest them?
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  #172  
Old 10-14-2022, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Capybara View Post
I agree with you. But in a world where NY, CA, Mass, NJ and Hawaii simply ignore SCOTUS and SCOTUS decisions, who will hold the tyrants who ignore the ruling accountable? Laws are only worthwhile if people actually obey them. Apparently Gav Boy, Bonta and the Ca Legislature are blatantly ignoring the ruling. Whose gonna arrest them?
It's much worse than states ignoring the Supremes, it's a Federal agency that ignoring them (AFT).
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  #173  
Old 10-26-2022, 9:03 AM
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I just started reading about this as I never jumped on the brace bandwagon here in CA.

I suspect that the folks who thought they were being clever during the BBAW registration period in 2016-2018 by registering their photos of their BBAW pistols sporting a brace may find themselves on the radar. Sorry folks.
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  #174  
Old 10-26-2022, 9:55 AM
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There was no pictures required of registieing 80% pistols.

What is a bbaw pistol? There is no such thing.
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  #175  
Old 10-26-2022, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by gunn View Post
I just started reading about this as I never jumped on the brace bandwagon here in CA.

I suspect that the folks who thought they were being clever during the BBAW registration period in 2016-2018 by registering their photos of their BBAW pistols sporting a brace may find themselves on the radar. Sorry folks.
Just remove the brace, no?
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  #176  
Old 10-26-2022, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gunn View Post
I just started reading about this as I never jumped on the brace bandwagon here in CA.

I suspect that the folks who thought they were being clever during the BBAW registration period in 2016-2018 by registering their photos of their BBAW pistols sporting a brace may find themselves on the radar. Sorry folks.
Aside from there being no such photo requirement, braced firearms were entirely legal in 2017-2018, just as they are now. If the legality of braced firearms someday changed, a photo from a time when braced firearms were not illegal would have no bearing on the legality of the firearm’s present configuration.
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  #177  
Old 10-26-2022, 3:38 PM
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Originally Posted by seaweedsoyboy View Post
If the legality of braced firearms someday changed, a photo from a time when braced firearms were not illegal would have no bearing on the legality of the firearm’s present configuration.
But it might win you a surprise call or visit to verify said firearm's present configuration isn't still the old one. That's the concern. DOJ may tell some investigators - "go visit all the owners of these photos". Now, in truth they don't even have the resources to go collect firearms from convicted felons that they know have guns, so this seems pretty low likelihood.
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  #178  
Old 10-26-2022, 3:50 PM
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Again.......THERE WAS NO REQUIREMENT TO SEND PICTURES OF 80%PISTOLS...with or without braces.


There is no such thing as A bbaw pistol.

No pictures of braces....

Some here are confused about some folks registering bbaw RIFLES and getting requests for pictures..... not pistols.
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  #179  
Old 10-26-2022, 11:38 PM
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What is a bbaw pistol? There is no such thing.
A BBAW pistol was a pistol built before 2017 which would be an AW if it were not for the magazine being fixed with a bullet button.

The definitions of fixed magazines have changed and a bullet button no longer satisfies the requirement but there was an option to AW register such pistols in 2018 so that you could keep the bullet button instead of having to go to a more complicated fixed magazine solution that requires the action to be disassembled in order to change magazines.

BBRAW's can use large capacity magazines while the new "disassemble the action" fixed magazine pistols are limited to low capacity magazines of 10 rounds or less.
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  #180  
Old 10-26-2022, 11:41 PM
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Again.......THERE WAS NO REQUIREMENT TO SEND PICTURES OF 80%PISTOLS...with or without braces.

There is no such thing as A bbaw pistol.

No pictures of braces....

Some here are confused about some folks registering bbaw RIFLES and getting requests for pictures..... not pistols.
The 2018 AW registrations would not be processed without the necessary photos.
I remove my pistol braces for the AW photos but there's no laws on the books prohibiting me from installing them after the photos were taken.
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  #181  
Old 10-27-2022, 7:31 AM
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Yes, certain pistols were allowed to be registered as BBRAWs.
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  #182  
Old 10-27-2022, 9:27 AM
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Well that is interesting. I'm still not 100% believing that.

You can own an AR pistol with a BB if it was registered with photos? First I heard about that. Maybe I was too fixated on having to register my 80% pistol builds and I was surely not sending photos in.

I was under the impression the photos were for only folks who wanted to still have a BB rifle.
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  #183  
Old 10-27-2022, 9:29 AM
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CAL.BaR is there a calguns discount?
LOL there actually IS. I have represented a number of CalGunners in the past and always worked with them on fees for weapons issues etc.

But... don't be THAT guy.
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  #184  
Old 10-27-2022, 9:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Capybara View Post
I agree with you. But in a world where NY, CA, Mass, NJ and Hawaii simply ignore SCOTUS and SCOTUS decisions, who will hold the tyrants who ignore the ruling accountable? Laws are only worthwhile if people actually obey them. Apparently Gav Boy, Bonta and the Ca Legislature are blatantly ignoring the ruling. Whose gonna arrest them?
So... how will YOU be arrested on felony weapons charges help THAT cause? States can't be arrested....YOU can.

Again, PLEASE remember, you are in CA, not MT. Guns as MASSIVELY unpopular here. Really. We are a VERY small minority and do not enjoy ANY support from the general population of CA. If you are looking for jury nullification on your case, you are looking in the wrong place.
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  #185  
Old 10-27-2022, 9:33 AM
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Originally Posted by CAL.BAR View Post
LOL there actually IS. I have represented a number of CalGunners in the past and always worked with them on fees for weapons issues etc.

But... don't be THAT guy.

Don’t be that guy… That’s the best legal advice you’ll ever get

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  #186  
Old 10-27-2022, 9:35 AM
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I plan on never meeting you with a tie on. Hahha

Thank you
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  #187  
Old 10-27-2022, 9:38 AM
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Originally Posted by sigstroker View Post
It's much worse than states ignoring the Supremes, it's a Federal agency that ignoring them (AFT).
But let's be real, it's a given though that all of the alphabet agencies have become the Potato Administrations personal minions, carrying out vendettas and personal prosecutions at the behest of the Potato. There is no mandate to effect justice in any of them, they have become weaponized tool of the Left's government.
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  #188  
Old 10-27-2022, 9:42 AM
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Originally Posted by CAL.BAR View Post
So... how will YOU be arrested on felony weapons charges help THAT cause? States can't be arrested....YOU can.

Again, PLEASE remember, you are in CA, not MT. Guns as MASSIVELY unpopular here. Really. We are a VERY small minority and do not enjoy ANY support from the general population of CA. If you are looking for jury nullification on your case, you are looking in the wrong place.
I 100% obey the law, even when the AG is breaking it by doxxing me. I'm a law abiding subject (can we really say we are citizens, living in this state?) and my goal is to be in compliance with all laws here. And I know that by being a firearms enthusiast in Commifornia, I am an outlier that the state likes to humiliate, inconvenience and punish at their whim and that fellow Californians look upon as a societal outcast.
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  #189  
Old 10-27-2022, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by BrokerB View Post
Well that is interesting. I'm still not 100% believing that.

You can own an AR pistol with a BB if it was registered with photos?
Yes.
I AW registered AR, AK and HK pistols with bullet buttons.





Quote:
Originally Posted by BrokerB View Post
I was under the impression the photos were for only folks who wanted to still have a BB rifle.
Your impression was incorrect.

Fun fact: as a registered AW, the 10 round limitations that non-AW's have does not apply so I can use my AW's with full capacity mags.
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  #190  
Old 10-27-2022, 11:53 PM
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I'm curious about something, If someone was to destroy a brace in a way that it could not be be used as a brace or shouldered, could that person then keep this new Buffer Tube cover (Former Shockwave Brace) strictly for aesthetics? Asking for a friend.
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  #191  
Old 10-28-2022, 11:49 AM
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MAGPUL just released a new brace

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  #192  
Old 10-28-2022, 4:58 PM
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I'm curious about something, If someone was to destroy a brace in a way that it could not be be used as a brace or shouldered, could that person then keep this new Buffer Tube cover (Former Shockwave Brace) strictly for aesthetics? Asking for a friend.
They would probably prosecute you if they saw you with it, unless it had the right number of "points". They would say an altered Shockwave is still a Shockwave. You could probably present a logical reason why it shouldn't but that won't matter at all when they're interrogating you, and won't matter much in court.

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MAGPUL just released a new brace

Looks sketchy. No straps to secure it to the arm, not even slots for a strap.
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  #193  
Old 10-28-2022, 5:03 PM
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Originally Posted by BrokerB View Post
Well that is interesting. I'm still not 100% believing that.

You can own an AR pistol with a BB if it was registered with photos? First I heard
Believe it
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  #194  
Old 10-30-2022, 2:07 AM
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i registered an AR pistol and an AK pistol, both with BB, and neither of them has any brace, blade etc on the photo
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  #195  
Old 10-30-2022, 9:20 AM
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i registered an AR pistol and an AK pistol, both with BB
You must be lying too because this guy does not believe it:

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Originally Posted by BrokerB View Post
Well that is interesting. I'm still not 100% believing that.
I got my AFS report back this week.
Lo and behold, my AR pistol and my MP5 pistol are on the same page so it was easy to take a picture of the two at the same time and then a took a photo off the top of the first page letter showing where the AFS report comes from.
The guy at the top of the first page is probably lying too right?


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  #196  
Old 10-30-2022, 11:39 AM
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Assault weapons cannot exist in California because they’re illegal.

Only hammers are allowed.
Since hemp jewelry makers need protection.
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  #197  
Old 10-30-2022, 1:42 PM
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Well I'm almost sad that I dont have a bb pistol. I still find it weird I never saw that option when we were being forced to register 80% builds. But I have zero regrets not sending the jackboot a holes in Kalifornia pictures of my guns. Bb still has to use gimped magazines correct?

Meh..the BB is not faster by anything past a tenth/hundred of a second on a mag change compared to some of then "action open" stuff. I know..but those may not be legal!!

Who is using a bb/mag locked for immediate self defense anyways?!

I do appreciate the correction. A bit harsh to say I was calling anyone "liars".
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  #198  
Old 10-30-2022, 4:01 PM
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Originally Posted by BrokerB View Post
Well I'm almost sad that I dont have a bb pistol. I still find it weird I never saw that option when we were being forced to register 80% builds. But I have zero regrets not sending the jackboot a holes in Kalifornia pictures of my guns. Bb still has to use gimped magazines correct?

Meh..the BB is not faster by anything past a tenth/hundred of a second on a mag change compared to some of then "action open" stuff. I know..but those may not be legal!!

Who is using a bb/mag locked for immediate self defense anyways?!

I do appreciate the correction. A bit harsh to say I was calling anyone "liars".
Starting 01-01-2017, the CA definition of a "fixed magazine" was amended so that "bullet button" style magazine release no longer met the CA legal requirements for a "fixed magazine".

Firearms with a "bullet button" style magazine release were required to be reconfigured so that they no longer met the CA definition of an assault weapon or destroyed or taken out-of-state for storage/transfer or registered as assault weapons before 07-01-2018.

Starting 07-01-2018, if the firearm still has a "bullet button" style magazine release and restricted features, then it is either an illegal assault weapon or BBRAW.

CA laws/regulations requires a BBRAW to retain the "bullet button" style magazine release, in order to maintain its legal status as a RAW. [PC 39000(b)(5) and 11 CCR 5477(a)]

Beyond retention of the "bullet button" style magazine release, the RAW can be legally reconfigured in a manner that does not violate CA SBR/SBS laws.

Which means it is CA legal to utilize large capacity magazines with a BBRAW.
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Last edited by Quiet; 10-30-2022 at 4:11 PM..
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  #199  
Old 10-30-2022, 7:03 PM
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ar15barrels ar15barrels is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrokerB View Post
Bb still has to use gimped magazines correct?
Incorrect.
You can use any magazine you want in an RAW.
The 10 round limitation only applies to fixed magazine non-AW's.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrokerB View Post
Meh..the BB is not faster by anything past a tenth/hundred of a second on a mag change compared to some of then "action open" stuff.
Show me how fast non-AW AK's and HK roller locked guns can change magazines...
Then you will see the value of a bullet button.

Last edited by ar15barrels; 10-30-2022 at 7:06 PM..
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  #200  
Old 10-31-2022, 12:27 PM
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BBRAW can use 30 round mags which are the most popular pmags

Show me how fast you can change the mag with action open fixed mag xxxxx
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