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Ladies Forum A place for our female Calgunners to discuss, share and interact without the 'excess attention' sometimes found in online forums.

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  #121  
Old 07-02-2013, 9:30 PM
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women rock. I live in a house with all women and all of then shoot ( except the two dogs those b1tch3$ just watch ) - but can your 89 year old grama rack the slide?
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  #122  
Old 07-03-2013, 7:21 AM
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I have a serious question for the ladies here with experience with heavy recoil spring guns.

Do you or would you trust them in a defensive situation? Depending on condition of carry you might have to initially rack the slide and although I admit rare, you may have to clear a jam, stovepipe or ftf. Given the high stress of the moment, is the heavier recoil spring going to be an dangerous liability?

I am not at all asking this as a sexist question. I've asked myself the same question and for that reason either keep a full-size auto or revolver on my night stand if I ever need it.

Further, the reason I ask this question is there is a big difference between range time "practice" and "practice" for a defensive situation. Racking an 18# slide when the heat is on can be a much scarier event for some. For me, its a variable I'm not currently interested in bringing into my equation.
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  #123  
Old 07-03-2013, 7:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoshnasi View Post
I have a serious question for the ladies here with experience with heavy recoil spring guns.

Do you or would you trust them in a defensive situation? Depending on condition of carry you might have to initially rack the slide and although I admit rare, you may have to clear a jam, stovepipe or ftf. Given the high stress of the moment, is the heavier recoil spring going to be an dangerous liability?

I am not at all asking this as a sexist question. I've asked myself the same question and for that reason either keep a full-size auto or revolver on my night stand if I ever need it.

Further, the reason I ask this question is there is a big difference between range time "practice" and "practice" for a defensive situation. Racking an 18# slide when the heat is on can be a much scarier event for some. For me, its a variable I'm not currently interested in bringing into my equation.
Based on my experience in a personal defense situation (unfortunately), its my stance that if your gun malfs during a shootout, you're hosed. Even pros like Travis Haley take 5 seconds to clear a double feed-and 5 seconds in a defensive incident feels like 5 years.

While malfunction drills are a beneficial training skill to have, in a real life incident if your gun fails you're screwed. You'll be shot or assaulted by your attacker holding a broken gun in your hand.

Fortunately , most civil defensive incidents conclude without a shot being fired. As such, worrying about racking the slide under stress is an irrelevant concern.
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  #124  
Old 07-03-2013, 8:43 AM
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Originally Posted by SilverTauron View Post
Based on my experience in a personal defense situation (unfortunately), its my stance that if your gun malfs during a shootout, you're hosed. Even pros like Travis Haley take 5 seconds to clear a double feed-and 5 seconds in a defensive incident feels like 5 years.

While malfunction drills are a beneficial training skill to have, in a real life incident if your gun fails you're screwed. You'll be shot or assaulted by your attacker holding a broken gun in your hand.

Fortunately , most civil defensive incidents conclude without a shot being fired. As such, worrying about racking the slide under stress is an irrelevant concern.
This is a good point, however doesn't answer much of my question specifically regarding a heavy recoil spring gun.

Also, you're assuming most people share yours and Travis' opinion on malfunction drills.
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But then again I think of the mayors nephew, his face distored with tears and terror, the GAP employees who asked for my autograph, and had to settle for a cover identity’s signature, the flashbangs, and their acrid scent, the small of napalm in the evening breeze, as I crouch behind a shopping cart in the parking lot,
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  #125  
Old 07-03-2013, 9:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoshnasi View Post
I have a serious question for the ladies here with experience with heavy recoil spring guns.

Do you or would you trust them in a defensive situation? Depending on condition of carry you might have to initially rack the slide and although I admit rare, you may have to clear a jam, stovepipe or ftf. Given the high stress of the moment, is the heavier recoil spring going to be an dangerous liability?

I am not at all asking this as a sexist question. I've asked myself the same question and for that reason either keep a full-size auto or revolver on my night stand if I ever need it.

Further, the reason I ask this question is there is a big difference between range time "practice" and "practice" for a defensive situation. Racking an 18# slide when the heat is on can be a much scarier event for some. For me, its a variable I'm not currently interested in bringing into my equation.


When the stakes are high and lives are on the line, I cannot say 100% for sure that I would ace a personal defense situation. No one truly can. Though, I suppose that military personnel and LEOs will have higher success rates for shooting and clearing weapons while under high stress.


That said, I believe that my Glock 19's recoil spring rating is 16#. Just taking your question at face value, and speaking as a woman, I do not believe I would have any trouble racking the slide during an emergency situation. I have never had trouble racking the slide, not even from day 1.


I have had some training and I know how to clear a malfunction. Because I practice, I keep that skill fresh and it stays committed to my "muscle memory". Muscle memory is important because it allows me to engage the action without having to employ too much thought. So, if my Glock were to "jam", I know I will immediately slap the bottom of the mag and then rack the slide. Though, like others have said, there's the very real possibility that, if my pistol jams, I won't have enough time to clear it before getting hammered by my attacker. I am aware of that and acknowledge that drills can only help so much.


Now, if I owned a pistol that had a heavier recoil spring, it wouldn't generally be a problem for me as I am quite strong for a lady. BUT, I would not choose that pistol as my self defense pistol to start with. The thing needs to work and it needs to work at the moment I need it the most. That's why I chose the Glock 19. I didn't choose it because everyone else had one or because it was a "good choice for the ladies", etc. I chose it because it's reliable, easy to operate and it fit very well with my grip and shooting technique. That's why I specifically chose the Glock 19 for my self-defense pistol. Getting a big, heavy gun is rad; but, if I'm going to be farting with it while some dude tackles me. Then it's not a good choice.


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  #126  
Old 07-03-2013, 3:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoshnasi View Post
I have a serious question for the ladies here with experience with heavy recoil spring guns.

Do you or would you trust them in a defensive situation? Depending on condition of carry you might have to initially rack the slide and although I admit rare, you may have to clear a jam, stovepipe or ftf. Given the high stress of the moment, is the heavier recoil spring going to be an dangerous liability?

I am not at all asking this as a sexist question. I've asked myself the same question and for that reason either keep a full-size auto or revolver on my night stand if I ever need it.

Further, the reason I ask this question is there is a big difference between range time "practice" and "practice" for a defensive situation. Racking an 18# slide when the heat is on can be a much scarier event for some. For me, its a variable I'm not currently interested in bringing into my equation.
Thank you for very reasonable questions after the former bru-ha-ha... I enjoy the 1911 as my favorite go-to gun, but I understand myself well enough in a stressful situation to have a revolver too. As one of the other ladies stated, I have no idea what the spring is except the .45's slide is pretty tight.

I don't profess to know everything, but in an emergency, I believe I can be level-headed
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  #127  
Old 07-03-2013, 3:33 PM
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My wife has a VERY difficult time racking my Kahr CW9, and is 5'2" 114 (don't say I said this) or so, and I am not surprised some women can't rack some of these stiff subcompacts.

I think a lot of it is that some women aren't all that comfortable around guns, and handing them a difficult gun for them to rack makes things even worse.

Most women can handle about ANY gun with a bit of showing them how to properly handle it, but most men like to step in an "BE A MAN" and show them how to do this the RIGHT way. Nothing against either one, but men usually have a complex at a range and being more accurate, faster, better, etc, and women typically go into it with no preconceived notions of how they need to do. That usually makes women more relaxed at the range, and shoot better often times.
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  #128  
Old 07-03-2013, 6:20 PM
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It may be the way my aging wrists work, but I can't rack my Glocks holding the gun perfectly vertical. However, I can get the job done nicely by tiiping it slightly to the left.

More than one way to skin a Glock, I always say.
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  #129  
Old 07-05-2013, 12:37 AM
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Oh, my........its just such a shame that Annie Oakley and 'Plinky' Topperwein aren't still living.............It would be interesting to read their views on the subject......... : )

cheers

Carla
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  #130  
Old 07-05-2013, 4:56 PM
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Unfortunately, some people are ignorant and still think women can't handle firearms at all. The Paternalistic nature of our so called enlightened society isn't as advanced as we'd like to think.
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  #131  
Old 07-05-2013, 9:22 PM
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ehh.. whatever.

you know the truth...
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  #132  
Old 07-06-2013, 6:05 AM
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I'm somewhat biased.. but a Girl that can put a .308 and an arrow on its mark is a true keeper. If she does CCW daily while being a knock-out beautiful girly girl... there are few like her.
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  #133  
Old 07-06-2013, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleOldLady View Post
I am rather small and skinny and sometimes I just cannot do what a big strapping man can do. It is a fact of life I do not have the upper body strength of a man. Just not gonna happen.

I can bet that these sub compacts with heavy springs I would have a difficult time with or couldn't pull back myself.
I should got to a store and try one out. If I can't I would say 'meh' and find one that I could use.
OMG! You mean to say that women might be different from men and may need to adjust or adapt some things in life based on differences in physiology? And that this should not in fact, constitute a reflection on their worth or a slight against their gender?

I'm shocked, shocked!

PS- nothing against the ladies here, but I know too many idiots on both sides of that spectrum.
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  #134  
Old 07-06-2013, 4:26 PM
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Originally Posted by KLD83 View Post
GRRRR....
This is justa little snip it of some a**hat's comments on another forum. Why do some guys ruin it for the lady that is trying to learn buy just shoving a revolver at them? Really? I just get so angry! I don't think I'm anything special, just a regular lady. I don't know much, but I have guts and confidence and I think if you add that into the equation, ANY gal with some training and shoot. They are talking about a Kahr CW9.... this gun by no means is a beast in any way. Super smooth and easy to shoot. I think my 89 year old grandma could handle it.
What's with guys like this??

"i think ur wife falls within the 90% of women who indeed have a very hard time racking kahrs. I think that was a real reason back when, kahr introuduced their lady PM9. It had a 16# recoil spring instead of factory 18#. evidently sales sucked or the reduction was still not enough to cintinue offering the gun. Not the best forum to be saying this but I have always felt kahrs are not for most women. If they can't go througth the hand racking, clearing a jam. unloading and loading a kahr then get them into something that they feel 100% comforatable with, and in most cases a wheelgun will fit that bill most all the time. and as ____(removed member name)___ stated a 25 is not a gun to put in a womans hands, whether she can rack it or not and sometimes again whether we will admit it or not some women just cannot handle a GUN... "
Going back to the start of this whole silly soap-opera thread, I'll offer an observation, if I may.........and you can decide for yourself as to whether it 'makes sense' or not.

We've seen plenty enough of the 'male ego' issue here......'ad nauseam', to 'put it mildly'.

Consider some history......the history of the 1939-45 war. I was a very small child, during the war, and can't actually remember the war itself, but I grew up hearing a very large number of stories about the war.

During the war, there was a tremendous propaganda campaign put on by the government, to get women into jobs in war industries.

By V-J day, in August of 1945, hundreds of thousands of women had proven themselves capable of performing excellently well in jobs previously considered 'men's work', such as heavy metalworking in the shipyards, operating heavy machine tools in many industries, doing long-haul trucking, even doing the 'ferry flights' to deliver large new military aircraft to the 'staging areas'. (they were not allowed to fly in actual 'combat zones')

You've all seen the 'Rosie the rivetter' and the 'We Can Do It' posters, right?......well, there were a great many other ones, telling us that we can do a man's job and do it well.

After V-J day, a new problem arose for our government. Now, they were bringing the men home, and needed to get the women out of industry, to give the men their jobs back.

I got to see this propaganda campaign 'first-hand'.........women who had been told 'you can do it' in industry were now being told 'your place is in the home'.....and, no, honey, we let you 'do your bit' during the war to keep up morale on the home front, but you are not really able to do a 'man's job'.

Women who had competently navigated heavy aircraft across the Atlantic Ocean were now being told.......as a 'cultural image'....they were 'woman drivers' who couldn't safely handle an ordinary car.

Television was new, then, and used a propaganda medium in entertainment, rather excellently so.......you can see, on the 'you-tube' programme, videos of old 'situation comedies' in which women were portrayed as 'ditzy fluff-heads', incapable of doing much of anything without the strong guiding hand of the father or husband.

Probably the most graphic example is Lucille Ball's work in 'I Love Lucy'.....but there were others.....'My Little Margie', 'Father Knows Best', etc., etc.

Never underestimate the power of entertainment to establish 'social normalcy'....... when its also some really high quality 'sugar-coated propaganda', which 'melts in your mind, not on your hands'.

There's more, of course.....quite a bit more, to be sure......but if you want to know just why it is that such a great many of men......particularly so-called 'conservative' men.....are misogynistic as all h*ll, just remember that 'they can't help it'........ their brains were pickled in propaganda for a lot of years.

(yeah......I know......thats no excuse......they really should know better by now.......and, yeah, I know, I just have a 'bad attitude' or something.)

cheers

Carla

Last edited by Asphodel; 07-06-2013 at 4:38 PM.. Reason: typos
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  #135  
Old 07-06-2013, 5:05 PM
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Originally Posted by warthog1984 View Post
OMG! You mean to say that women might be different from men and may need to adjust or adapt some things in life based on differences in physiology? And that this should not in fact, constitute a reflection on their worth or a slight against their gender?

I'm shocked, shocked!

PS- nothing against the ladies here, but I know too many idiots on both sides of that spectrum.
At year 60 I do have to admit that my physical strength is on the wane. I did not say I could not rack the slide on the Kahr CW9.
I need to go try it and I will next time I make the hour drive to town.
What would be gained by saying I could do something I couldn't?

My point being that if it doesn't work for me it doesn't work for me and it doesn't mean it wouldn't work for someone younger and far less breakable.
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  #136  
Old 07-06-2013, 5:30 PM
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and to further Carla's post: during WWII and rosie the riveter who was portrayed as patriotic, the government sponsored child care so she could work.
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