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Calgunners in Service This forum is a place for our active duty and deployed members to share, request and have a bit of home where ever they are.

View Poll Results: Rangers vs. SEALs
Rangers: "Rangers Lead The Way!" 86 22.51%
SEALs: "You can run, but you can't hide". "Justice has been done". 296 77.49%
Voters: 382. You may not vote on this poll

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  #121  
Old 03-07-2012, 3:38 PM
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The army also usually only involved in jump school for seals. oher than that mostly taught by seal instructors. Not trying to saying anyone was wrong just thought i would give you best answers. Also in regards to Joint Tasks force Tons of people may be involved but doesnt mean they are standing shoulder to soldier in the field and yes uniforms are different ALWAYS
  #122  
Old 03-07-2012, 3:45 PM
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honestly i would just rather see Seals vs rangers compete in a death match with simunition, also chris costa vs travis haley I would PPV that
  #123  
Old 03-07-2012, 3:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hydrogenmaker View Post
Neither. Coordinates known? Yes, then it'd be a 19 year old 130lb Coke bottle bespectacled FC3 on an Arleigh Burke assisting a slightly overweight (but she's on a diet) Ensign Strike Officer who graduated from Cornell Suma Cum Laude with a degree in Etymology that launch a Tamahawk from 1500 miles away from the cold confines of the CIC at 3AM, that land dead nuts on top of the fighting duo in their battle to the death!!!!

ETA: Son, if you really need to ask this, then I'd suggest the Air Force.
I love it Leave it to senior to tell it haha. Yeah join the airforce. Hope all is well DCCS(SW)
  #124  
Old 03-07-2012, 4:30 PM
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The only answer to this is the new upcoming Expendables squad. Chuck would kill everyone with his beard, if that doesn't work he'll round house deflect bullets back at his attackers while Jet Li does some back flips. Arnold and Sy will walk around without their shirts showing off their 60 year old roided muscles and Terry Cheeseburger Eddie Crews will just run amuck. Van Dame and Bruce can be the calvary driven by Jason Stratham.

What armed combatants would want to go up against that?
  #125  
Old 03-07-2012, 6:00 PM
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Originally Posted by RMP91 View Post
As some of you may know, I will be enlisting in the Army by 2014 (When I am around 23-24), I am actively changing my diet and exercise routine so that I will be prepared for BCT.
You doing all this for two years for Army bootcamp ? You're not that 700 pound dude from Livermore are you ?
  #126  
Old 03-07-2012, 6:05 PM
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Just a little FYI for the fanboys of each...the Rangers and the Seals each have units that are open to members of other services from a variety of specialities. So you'll see Navy, Marines, and Air Force guys serving as actual Army Rangers just as you will see Army, Air Force, and Marines serving as actual Navy Seals. Sounds really strange and most people who are NOT a Ranger or a Seal don't know that or believe it when they are first told. But it is true.

I dont know why you think this, you are totally wrong. There is no one issued a trident unless they are a SEAL. period.. cant speak for rangers, but Im right about this....
  #127  
Old 03-08-2012, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by biglou View Post
You doing all this for two years for Army bootcamp ? You're not that 700 pound dude from Livermore are you ?
OK, that made me laugh. No, I'm from San Carlos, and the only reason I haven't signed up yet is because of family and school commitments. Once those are out of the way, there's no stopping me from enlisting, war or no war.

On a side note: Jesus, is this thread still going on? I must've opened a big-*** Can O' Worms with this one...
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  #128  
Old 03-08-2012, 11:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chan View Post
The only answer to this is the new upcoming Expendables squad. Chuck would kill everyone with his beard, if that doesn't work he'll round house deflect bullets back at his attackers while Jet Li does some back flips. Arnold and Sy will walk around without their shirts showing off their 60 year old roided muscles and Terry Cheeseburger Eddie Crews will just run amuck. Van Dame and Bruce can be the calvary driven by Jason Stratham.

What armed combatants would want to go up against that?
At that point, why have a couple million AD servicemen/women do what just these guys could do by themselves?

Joking, thanks for all your service!
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  #129  
Old 03-08-2012, 12:30 PM
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These two groups specialize in different types of missions. Rangers are experts at conducting raids, ambushes and long range patrols. SEALs are a little more low key and covert. The two forces aren't really comparable. America needs them both.
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  #130  
Old 03-17-2012, 5:46 PM
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I highly disagree from experience, support and being attached has nothing to do with operations. Believe me seals go in alone most of time if they need or want support your looking at SWCC if by water and most likely marines(Marsoc) Rescue is different and is based on who is closest and available but as you can read seals will always support seals before anyone else IF all Possible. Again I am speaking just from experience with what I was involved with and with my own eyes. I have friends on the Teams and also speak from them.
im not talking about support although the support is also mixed.

I am talking about Joint task force units that get labeled as seals or rangers.

to get a better idea..think of COD modern warfare ( they were based on us, task force 16 / black/ 626 /121...name keeps changing ), It was a mixed unit of specops and OGA's... and yes we had SAS and MI6 until late 2009 all working together.
Edit/Delete Message


"It drew on elite troops from the Joint Special Operations Command, whose elements include the Army unit Delta Force, Navy's Seal Team 6 and the 75th Ranger Regiment. Military reservists and Defense Intelligence Agency personnel with special skills, like interrogators, were temporarily assigned to the unit. C.I.A. officers, F.B.I. agents and special operations forces from other countries also worked closely with the task force" - NYtimes

- was classified but some Airforce bloke wrote a book and then some other guys spilled the beans, ..ultimately red cross and intl. press ended up breaking the secrecy..mostly.

Last edited by whisperingdoom; 03-17-2012 at 6:08 PM..
  #131  
Old 03-23-2012, 9:37 PM
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These are two very well trained units. But if you give a squad of Marines some hand me down weapons from the Army and split that squad up it will give the Seals and Rangers a chance.
  #132  
Old 03-23-2012, 9:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanguard View Post
These two groups specialize in different types of missions. Rangers are experts at conducting raids, ambushes and long range patrols. SEALs are a little more low key and covert. The two forces aren't really comparable. America needs them both.
THIS ^^^^ Also, why not throw in USMC Force Recon? I agree with Vanguard, each unit has their purpose. We need them both, God Bless them all!
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  #133  
Old 05-19-2013, 10:59 PM
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Smile Craziness

This post isn't as crazy as one would think. First, SEALs and Rangers have very different ideologies about fighting. SEALs typically go in dark, do the deed and exfil. Rangers can do this also, but when Murphy strikes they can convert into a typical infantry unit...which is something the SEALs cannot do so well. Am I saying a Navy SEAL is inferior to a Ranger...NO!!

In my family we have a Green Bennie, a Tan Bennie and a Frogman. The Frogman is a little older than I, but it still works. We all have interesting job specs, mainly what we do. You cannot tell me that the training a SEAL gets is "better" than anyone else...it is not. As far as training goes, it DOESN'T END for any of the SPECOPs units. Just because you have a Ranger Tab does not make you a Ranger. It makes you a graduate of the United States Army Ranger school, nothing more nothing less. It is an absurdly crazy school, that balances the physical and the psychological challenges that face small units around the globe. But a Ranger is someone who is placed in the Bn.

Ranger's do not get enough credit for what we do, but without the Zoomies/Frogmen/or GB's the whole mission would not be completed.

So before anyone comments one is better than the other, please make sure you have done at least one of them, just so your opinion actually has some substance to it.
  #134  
Old 05-19-2013, 11:29 PM
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Originally Posted by RMP91 View Post
As some of you may know, I will be enlisting in the Army by 2014 (When I am around 23-24), I am actively changing my diet and exercise routine so that I will be prepared for BCT.

But that aside...

I have been thinking about this match-up for quite a while, and I was surprised that the TV show "Deadliest Warrior" didn't do such a match-up on them head-to-head(They did the Rangers and SEALs against separate fighters though). And while I highly doubt the show's accuracy when it came to statistics and techniques, it definitely got me thinking...

If the US Army Rangers were to go up against the US Navy SEALs in either a one-on-one or squad-based fight in which there were almost no restrictions as to what weapons, vehicles, or equipment that could be deployed. The only exceptions are heavy armor (M1A2 tanks, light armor such as the Bradley is OK), fast-mover support (Jets) bona-fide WMDs (Nukes, ICBMs etc. the big stuff).

Who would come out on top? Or would it be too close to call considering they are both Special Operations groups and pretty much have equal training and adaptability?

Both can operate on any terrain, any body of water, any airspace (Though the SEALs are heavily water based as far as their training goes from what I've seen).

Both can deploy within a very short period of time to almost any location on the planet.

Both are 2 of the finest groups of warriors this world will ever know.




Your thoughts?
You can't compare the two like that. They perform different roles. It's apples and oranges.
  #135  
Old 05-20-2013, 12:07 AM
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Bet you like watching Spike.
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  #136  
Old 05-20-2013, 12:17 AM
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Clearly properly trained (Call of Duty) mall ninja's are our nations real protectors. They win hands down.
  #137  
Old 05-20-2013, 3:17 AM
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The cogs in the community are more complex than one could think. It is not an Army vs. Navy [specops] thing anymore, the lines have been blurred for some time now and will continue to integrate in the near future.

In a article by Steve Magnusson in this month's issue of National Defense, it was stated that NSW/SF/MARSOC/AFSOC/ETC have been so integrated that they have seen:
1. Missions are usually joint (TF 121 is a personal example I am very familier with)
2. [Units] Perform missions they are not meant to do

So the issue is not which unit is "best" for the mission, but how a mission can tailor ANY COMBINATION of units to succeed.

The DOD has been hammering out ways to make this happen for years, whether it is stupid or not is something we will have to evaluate in the next big conflict (or 50 years from now). One of the suggestions is to take the warfighting of specialized units (SEALS, Rangers, SF, ETC) and TEACH conventional ground forces to perform the same missions. Of course, everyone (non-operators) currently hate the idea because it removes autonomy of BIG conventional units.

To think that these units operate "alone" is asinine. Logistics, intel, and support make these units run. One is not BETTER than the other, they are not meant to be. And with regional JSOC [commands] as an example, most missions are joint nowadays. For example, a Ranger unit may secure an airfield, while AFSOC CTTs coordinate air support, while DEVGRU & Delta/CAG folks pickup a HVT, etc.
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Last edited by NiteQwill; 05-20-2013 at 3:19 AM..
  #138  
Old 05-20-2013, 4:53 AM
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Ok i guess ill play. I was stationed in 29 palms for 3 plus years with 3/7 marines. We were MEUSOC while deployed and did some good training with other units. Worked with Seals and Force Recon in Somolia and Rangers in Ft Irwin. Like its been said before each has there own specialty. We had SAS come train out in 29 stumps in august 120 plus degrees in our world and we caught them sleeping in the shade and wiped them out, boy was there commander pissed. Later that night they got us back when they did a raid on us. So this just showed me most any well trained unit can take out any other if the scenario is right. As for the ops question though I'd take Seals in 9 out of ten fights with Rangers. They have the best small unit tactics I've ever seen. Delta would be more 50/50. However op you should know before u enlist Delta is usually picked from the best of the best from Rangers, green berets and airborne. Just like Devgru Seal team Six is best of all Seal teams and Force Recon is best of Recon guys. If you tell a delta guy that Rangers are no. 1 you might be "corrected" in a rough way. Anyway good luck on your enlistment and my advice is to have fun, volunteer for special schools and try to learn something while in that you can make money at in the civilian world. Unless you stay in til retirement there's not alot of use for a guy who shoots guns and blows s..t up for a living, unless you become a contractor or cop later. Most of my buddies I got out with are Air Marshals, contractors, or swat at there local pd.
Good luck, keep your head down and watch ur six.
  #139  
Old 05-20-2013, 6:50 AM
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Superman would kick all their asses.
  #140  
Old 05-20-2013, 8:15 AM
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rangers are masters of the basics - that's all. ranger bat pulls security for delta force; they're glorified regular infantry.

navy seals are second only to delta force in our country, unless you're counting the special activities division which you can't, really. you might be able to make an argument about non-actions on army special forces vs army rangers, but rangers are synonymous with having high motivation for doing relatively stupid things, not being elite. no disrespect to rangers; they're definitely ****ing cool guys to hang around, but they do not deserve to be compared to navy seals.

delta force ( air force pjs )
navy seals
actions on/direct action special forces units(marsoc is dead)
ranger bat/force recon
eod/low tier sof
regular combat arms - infantry, airborne, mps, cav scouts etc

combat arms in itself is the 1% of the 1%, making it inherently elite but the closer you get to the top, the more professional and humble the operators become. that's unilateral.

that's a widely agreed upon combat arms coolguy spectrum. anyone who tells you otherwise is biased based on personal experience or just doesn't know.

and i am not trying to talk ****: the difference between a ranger in ranger bat and a navy seal is a navy seal gets tons of autonomy, works in a tight knit team and is tier 1. an infantryman ranger is part of a platoon, pulls security just like regular infantry and masters the fundamental battle drills.

a team of navy seals would waylay a ranger platoon - it's asymmetrical warfare vs symmetrical warfare, no contest.
  #141  
Old 05-20-2013, 8:22 AM
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Gay
This.
  #142  
Old 05-20-2013, 8:24 AM
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Bet you like watching Spike.

and also probably wears Tapout/Affliction shirts and being an all around D-bag.
  #143  
Old 05-20-2013, 8:25 AM
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Also, Jedi Ninjas would kick all asses.
  #144  
Old 05-20-2013, 8:28 AM
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I bet the Men In Black or MIB would take them all. My vote is this because I think they will wipe their minds and tell them with mind tricks that it was just a vacation they were on, and none of it really happened.


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  #145  
Old 05-20-2013, 9:25 AM
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This was one of those threads that, in hindsight I was better off not making...

You should have let sleeping dogs lie.

Please delete this thread ASAP, thank you!
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  #146  
Old 05-20-2013, 11:18 AM
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It would probably be a better comparison if you looked at 1st Special Forces Operational Detachment-Delta ( 1st SFOD-D) or Delta Force as they are commonly called instead of a standard Ranger unit. They are the most elite Army unit and perform similar roles to the Seals. There are Seal Units that compare pretty evenly with Ranger units. But when most people think of Seals, they think Seal Team IV (forget their new name).

These units perform wargames on a regular basis in theater. Unfortunately I don't know much more about those training missions other than that they occur. While somebody has to play Ops-4, I would bet the purpose of these missions is to see how well they work together, and not to see which is the better team. They are not going to spend millions on an ego boost - they want to win wars.

My very limited experience with these things tells me that more often than not in an emergency it really comes down to which unit is both closest, and operational at the time the incident occurs. You go with what you've got. Which is why there is so much overlap in the training. The world is a very big place, and there are only so many teams to go around. Factor in leave, illness, and the size of the globe, and the sheer number of missions they are required to perform - and it becomes something of a crap shoot who gets what. Of course Bengazhi raises some serious questions about whether or not emergencies even get addresses in this administration, or if they just get ignored.

When they plan the mission months or even years in advanced, as with the raid on Bin Laden, then you can pick and choose which team to use. At which point it seems like the liberals go with the Seals every time. It is as if they've never heard of Delta or any of they other special operations we have. It seems like the Seals have an extraordinary PR department. More than once in the past I've seen the Seals get credit for daring rescues but the pictures of those events show guys with insigina from other branches of service. They are very good at getting credit for things. Not their fault the press is incomptent, but still. It is annoying.

These specialized units from the various branches can do all work in concert with each other. The invasion of Panama is a perfect example. Special Operators from all the branches of service fought side by side in a coorderated effort that took the country swiftly, though not without casualties. There is interservice rivalry, but in today's world they have to work together. It is pretty rare these days that a mission is 100% Seals or 100% Delta, especially in Afghanistan. Air Force Combat Controllers and Pararescue often get tasked to accompany them. Infact if you look at the medals issued to Air Force Special Operators you'll find they were present at almost every major skirmish our military has been in since Vietnam. I was surprised to learn they faught in the Battle of Mogadishu. None of the books or movies about that incident mentions them, but sure enough Pararescueman Staff Sergeant Scott Fales won a Silver Star for his role in that battle. There were similar medals issued in Vietnam, Panama, Iraq and Afghanistan. The book KILL BIN LADEN by Dalton Fury also makes mention of Air Force Special Operators playing a part in the first attempt to kill or capture Bin Laden. So things are never really as cut and dry as they look on the surface.

Last edited by tacticalcity; 05-20-2013 at 11:39 AM..
  #147  
Old 05-20-2013, 11:57 AM
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  #148  
Old 05-20-2013, 7:53 PM
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and also probably wears Tapout/Affliction shirts and being an all around D-bag.
Lol.
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  #149  
Old 05-20-2013, 8:00 PM
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I think these comparisons are stupid. However, Rangers would win. They would win simply because they are founded on Infantry tactics, where as a Navy SEAL are not. This isn't based on which I like better. It's based on what the job of them actually is.

SEALs are great at what they do. Rangers are highly trained light infantry and would **** all over SEALs in a gun fight. Just this guys opinion.
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Old 05-20-2013, 8:34 PM
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I had the pleasure of working with both. There is no comparison, they have different and unique missions. I would be at ease to have Either cover my six, devoted bunch of men. They do the jobs most would die even trying, me included. Best to all who served and are serving.
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Old 05-20-2013, 9:19 PM
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They do have different missions. However, this thread specified a certain mission. In that mission, Rangers would dump on them. Just saying. Doesn't make one better than the other.
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Old 05-20-2013, 11:54 PM
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This is not a CoD forum right? ...
  #153  
Old 05-21-2013, 8:17 AM
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Whats that operation where the Seal's went in and got ambushed and Rangers came to rescue and they got hit too? I forgot what its called....


Anyways, just goes to show that everyone needs each other. No need to wave their cock around saying "Im better then you!"
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  #154  
Old 05-21-2013, 8:33 AM
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You talking about where Neil Roberts was killed? I'm not saying anyone is better than anyone, I am saying that Rangers have a much greater understanding of infantry operations because of their mission.

You will have a rough time disputing that fact.
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Old 05-21-2013, 8:17 PM
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Seriously, who do you think the Rock or Hulk Hogan?
Batman or the Green Hornet?
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Old 05-21-2013, 10:07 PM
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It's just the navy in general, in my opinion. Like that corpsman saying that regular 0311s are just as good as full-fledged airborne rangers - please, dude. You would get called a leg and laughed at for your entire 6 month deployment if you pulled that **** in the wrong circle, which you wouldn't. Marines love to brag, but don't love to stay in Fallujah for 16 months. Interesting distinction!

It's always "the marines" and "seal team 6" while you know SFOD-D is always working, and you never hear about them. That's honorable, that's humble - they don't need praise. Those operators very rarely write books about how they used to be navy seals but now they're in debt and Obama won't help them. It's dishonorable. Very dishonorable.

Rangers have one thing above all others: esprit de corps. Above anyone, even marines(most of whom are rear echelon, mind you.) That doesn't make them the best, there are very obvious tiers where units are rated on and rangers aren't tier 1 which nobody in this thread was knowledgeable enough to bring up. Rangers are motivated, they are rugged, they are tough: that's what they're supposed to be. They're still on a knee in the open pulling security because that's what the doctrine from Vietnam says. We are talking about ACTUAL RANGER BAT, not someone with a Ranger Tab which most respectable operators have.

And whoever said the "operation where the seals were in trouble and the rangers came in and got hit" - that was ****ing Black Hawk Down. DELTA FORCE(army), AIR FORCE PJS(csar, half air force half army) and ARMY RANGERS(army), and that was the first time the Medal of Honor was given out since Vietnam. The Battle of Mogadishu I think is what you're referring to.

I love the hubris shown by a ****ing corpsman. You're a medic. You're barely combat arms. Do not disparage people above your station - Rangers in Ranger battalion are certainly above you. That would be just like you saying regular 0311s are just as good as Force Recon. You're in the navy, just like the marines. There isn't anybody in SFOD-D, CSAR or SOAR running around acting like that. They are some of the coolest, most humble ****ing dudes you will ever meet.

Leave it to the marines to pretend their infantry who go away from home for 6 months are the tip of the spear - meanwhile, army infantry units have had the worst of both theaters for the duration of both wars. There were army infantry battalions in the Korengal for 16 months that took contact every single day. I remember when I was a lowly private running around with a god damn m16 with iron sights taking contact at least every third patrol and when I'd go to VBC to restock there'd be POG marines with M4s with ACOGs with dust covers on them, slung on their backs.

Rangers would aspire to become Delta Force, or Seals or whatever - Navy Seals don't aspire to join Ranger Bat. That sums up the entire argument. There's a reason MARSOC died; maybe you should learn about that before you go around saying 0311s in the corps are basically all ****ing astronauts. I watched a corporal from a marine infantry company shoot at our convoy with a 240b for almost 35 seconds through an m14 scope while we were talking to them on the radio.

good thing he couldn't shoot for ****, h3h

if anybody disagrees with me, you guys could take it up with my buddies in 2/75. just run up to their barracks around 0600 any given morning and let them know that you're infantry in the marines, and they're just airborne rangers. I'm sure your marine hand-to-hand combat training will be very useful. Oh wait, you don't have any of that - you're just a corpsman.
  #157  
Old 05-22-2013, 9:24 AM
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Girls, girls, girls,......your both pretty, can we go home now?
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  #158  
Old 05-22-2013, 10:43 AM
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Back in the Active duty Marine Corps I noticed a lot of Navy Corpsmen wanted to be Navy SEALS so they wouldn't have to be called Corpsmen.
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Old 05-22-2013, 10:45 AM
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Well I think we can all agree that all the Hollywood exposure has been on the SEALS, so much for "Quiet Professionals", lol.
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Old 05-22-2013, 10:48 AM
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Also, I don't take anything away from the Army Rangers serving in the actual Ranger Battalion, they are consummate Professionals, not just people that attended the school. As they themselves say it, Ranger Batt is a way of life, Ranger school is a school.
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