Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > GENERAL DISCUSSION > General gun discussions > CGN's Best Threads (Limited Posting)
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

CGN's Best Threads (Limited Posting) This forum is for storing and or easy accessing useful or important threads.

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-11-2008, 3:13 PM
bwiese's Avatar
bwiese bwiese is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Jose
Posts: 26,760
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default ATTN FFLs: Rostering doesn't apply to intrafamily xfers from outside CA

It seems quite a few FFLs are confused about handgun Rostering matters w/regards to certain interstate/ intrastate transfers.

Yes, you can't buy a non-Rostered nonexempt handgun from Joe Blow in Nebraska via Gunbroker and have it shipped to your CA FFL and DROSed to you. [We will avoid discussion of NRF frames here, as that's a separate matter.]

However, Rostering is not applicable for lineal intrafamily transfers (or inheritances) of non-Rostered nonexempt handguns.

Normally, lineal intrafamily transfers within CA do NOT need to use FFLs. Ensure your kid has a HSC card, hand the pistol to him, and tell him to fill out the DOJ form and pay $19 within 30 days (or whatever the fee is).




It gets more complex when the supplying family member is outside CA:
  • use of a CA FFL is only required to keep the *BATF* happy:
    guns can't move across state lines without an FFL (except
    for probate/inheritance)
  • despite above, there's still no *California* requirement to use
    an FFL for this matter: the intrafamily exemption says no
    licensed party required. (By that they mean FFL + DOJ CA license
    dealer)
[Formally inherited/bequested guns can cross state lines without usage of FFLs - and there's exemption in CA law for this too. Rostering not required.]

Thus, your dad/grandad/kid (lineal only) in Nebraska can ship the non-Rostered nonexempt handgun to your local CA FFL. The gun is DROSed+4473'd like a normal purchase - but on the DROS screen an exempt notation should be added: "12078PC intrafamily transfer".

It is helpful to the gun dealer if a (copy of a) letter can be added to his files for your transaction, specifying the exact gun, the lineal family relationship, and the names of the two parties:
"Gentlemen,

I want my grandson, Maximus Gunnie Jr., to
have my nice Colt 45 pistol, serial #12345.

Yours truly,
Grandma Biggie Gunnie
<date>"
That helps the FFL during any prospective DOJ audit.

This transaction is *not* a PPT: FFL fees are not restricted to $35, unlike PPTs, and the FFL can charge whatever he wants for the transfer.

The above information is not 'aggressive' and has even been told repeatedly to FFLs in the past by DOJ Firearms staffers. [Some DOJ Firearms phone clerk types do not understand this, however, and just may give a blanket answer, however.]

Here's the relevant law:
12132. This chapter ("Unsafe handgun" Rostering stuff) shall not apply
to any of the following:

(a) The sale, loan, or transfer of any firearm pursuant to Sec 12082
in order to comply with subdivision (d) of Section 12072.

Just says that private party transfers must go thru a licensed dealer
(meaning a CA FFL w/CA + local permits etc) and that Rostering is
not required for such PPTs.

(b) The sale, loan, or transfer of any firearm that is exempt from the
provisions of subdivision (d) of Section 12072 pursuant to any applicable
exemption contained in Sec 12078, if the sale, loan, or transfer complies
with the requirements of that applicable exemption to subdivision (d) of
Sec 12072.

Here it is... Rostering isn't required for guns exempt from PPT provision (12072(d))
due to a 12078 exemption. [The latter phrase "...if the sale, loan, or transfer ..."
just means that all the rules of the particular exemption from PPTing must be followed,
it's a bit of near-throwaway legalese.]

12078 is the section including a variety of exemptions from FFL use: intrafamily
transfer, inheritance, infrequent loan provisions, etc.


(c) The sale, loan, or transfer of any firearm as described in paragraph (3)
of subdivision (b) of Section 12125.

12125(b) just lists Roster exemptions for prototypes to be manufactured, imported,
submitted or analyzed for approval, exemptions for the anaylzing party, exemptions
for C&R handguns,exemption for LE agencies.


(d) The delivery of a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed
upon the person to a person licensed pursuant to Sec 12071 for the purposes of
the service or repair of that firearm.

Doesn't need to be Rostered for in-CA repair/gunsmithing.


(e) The return of a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed
upon the person by a person licensed pursuant to Section 12071 to its owner
where that firearm was initially delivered in the circumstances set forth in
subdivisions (a), (d), (f), or (j).

Doesn't need to be Rostered for return from in-CA repair/gunsmithing.

(f) <<<consignment/pawning exemptions from Rostering>>>

(g) <<<C&R exemption from Rostering, kinda duplicated>>>

(h) <<<Olympic pistol exemptions>>>



useful 12078PC exemptions include:

12078(c)(1) <covers intrafamily exemption to PPT procedures for firearms>
12078(c)(2) <covers intrafamily exemption to PPT procedures for *handguns*>
12078(c)(3) <define 'intrafamily': btwn grandparent/parent/child/grandchild>
12078(d) <covers 'infrequent loan' provisions>
12078(e) <yet another to/from gunsmithing exemption>
12078(f) <yes, you can send a gun to out of state FFL>
12078(i) <operation of law exemptions including inheritance/bequest>


__________________

Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA

CGF Board Member / NRA Benefactor Life Member / CRPA life member

No postings of mine here, unless otherwise specifically noted, are
to be construed as formal or informal positions of the Calguns.Net
ownership, The Calguns Foundation, Inc. ("CGF"), the NRA, or my
employer. No posts of mine on Calguns are to be construed as
legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.

Last edited by bwiese; 01-04-2009 at 6:43 PM..
  #2  
Old 12-11-2008, 3:33 PM
CCWFacts CCWFacts is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 5,326
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

Wow. The roster is rapidly evaporating into a puff of oily smoke.
__________________
NRA life member

Exposing Leftists
Zomblog
The future of California?
  #3  
Old 12-11-2008, 3:34 PM
bwiese's Avatar
bwiese bwiese is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Jose
Posts: 26,760
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CCWFacts View Post
Wow. The roster is rapidly evaporating into a puff of oily smoke.
The above has been known for a long time, unfortunately many FFLs are not aware of it.

Even the DOJ BoF will admit to the above when you get a more knowledgeable individual on the phone.
__________________

Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA

CGF Board Member / NRA Benefactor Life Member / CRPA life member

No postings of mine here, unless otherwise specifically noted, are
to be construed as formal or informal positions of the Calguns.Net
ownership, The Calguns Foundation, Inc. ("CGF"), the NRA, or my
employer. No posts of mine on Calguns are to be construed as
legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.
  #4  
Old 12-11-2008, 3:37 PM
10001110101's Avatar
10001110101 10001110101 is offline
Junior Member
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Torrance, CA
Posts: 64
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Perhaps it's time to ask Grandma for a REALLY nice christmas present.
  #5  
Old 12-11-2008, 4:15 PM
halifax's Avatar
halifax halifax is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Mendocino County
Posts: 4,420
iTrader: 11 / 100%
Default

Yep. Done it a few times and this, Bwiese, is very good advice:

Quote:
It is helpful to the gun dealer if a copy of a letter can be added to his files for your transaction:
"Gentlemen,

I want my grandson, Maximus Gunnie Jr., to
have my nice Colt 45 pistol, serial #12345.

Yours truly,
Grandma Gunnie
<date>"

That helps the FFL during any prospective DOJ audit.
__________________
Jim


  #6  
Old 12-11-2008, 4:45 PM
AlohaRover AlohaRover is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 625
iTrader: 40 / 100%
Default

So my wife can give her dad all of her SIG P250s?
__________________
Shadow River Productions, LLC
Colorado Springs, CO
NFA Manufacturer and Dealer
FFL-07 & SOT
We are a CA-DOJ registered FFL and do out of state transfers

www.EvilBlackRifleShop.com

Please email all questions to
sales@EvilBlackRifleShop.com
  #7  
Old 12-11-2008, 4:59 PM
glockman19's Avatar
glockman19 glockman19 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 9,704
iTrader: 18 / 100%
Default

Bwiese,

Thanks for the clarification.
  #8  
Old 12-11-2008, 6:51 PM
Fastnuf's Avatar
Fastnuf Fastnuf is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: San Diego, Cali
Posts: 60
iTrader: 5 / 100%
Default

bwiese, I appreciate you taking the time to clarify this for all of us. Thank you!

Last edited by Fastnuf; 12-11-2008 at 7:18 PM..
  #9  
Old 12-11-2008, 10:31 PM
Librarian's Avatar
Librarian Librarian is offline
Super Moderator
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Concord
Posts: 33,134
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Blog Entries: 6
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlohaRover View Post
So my wife can give her dad all of her SIG P250s?
Yes - but he better find 10-round mags for them, which, AFAIK, are only available for the .45 model.

And I said all of this in October.

Lead a horse to water....
__________________
Calguns Wiki, Magazine Qs, Knife laws

Unless there is some way to amend a bill so you would support it,
the details do not matter until the Governor signs or allows the bill to become law.

Ask CA law questions in the How CA Laws Apply to/Affect Me Forum
- most questions that start 'Is it legal ...' go there.

Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs.


  #10  
Old 12-11-2008, 10:57 PM
bwiese's Avatar
bwiese bwiese is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Jose
Posts: 26,760
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

Thanks, Librarian.

I'd forgotten so soon - your post was excellent.

The issue/queries had just come up again, and I figured getting some directed FFL attention here might help.
__________________

Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA

CGF Board Member / NRA Benefactor Life Member / CRPA life member

No postings of mine here, unless otherwise specifically noted, are
to be construed as formal or informal positions of the Calguns.Net
ownership, The Calguns Foundation, Inc. ("CGF"), the NRA, or my
employer. No posts of mine on Calguns are to be construed as
legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.
  #11  
Old 12-11-2008, 11:59 PM
Rumpled's Avatar
Rumpled Rumpled is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: OC
Posts: 1,635
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Maximus!!
  #12  
Old 12-12-2008, 4:54 AM
AlohaRover AlohaRover is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 625
iTrader: 40 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Librarian View Post
Yes - but he better find 10-round mags for them, which, AFAIK, are only available for the .45 model.

Lead a horse to water....
Turning the 9mm sub compacts into perm 10rds wont be an issue

But the receiving FFL can still refuse to receive it I guess.
__________________
Shadow River Productions, LLC
Colorado Springs, CO
NFA Manufacturer and Dealer
FFL-07 & SOT
We are a CA-DOJ registered FFL and do out of state transfers

www.EvilBlackRifleShop.com

Please email all questions to
sales@EvilBlackRifleShop.com
  #13  
Old 12-12-2008, 6:47 AM
DDT
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
iTrader: / %
Default

Would you have to send the magazines through an FFL? Is there any reason you can't direct ship magazines? I thought they were like barrels and scopes and lower parts kits.
  #14  
Old 12-12-2008, 8:18 AM
40caldeserteagle 40caldeserteagle is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: San Jose, Alta California
Posts: 136
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DDT View Post
Would you have to send the magazines through an FFL? Is there any reason you can't direct ship magazines? I thought they were like barrels and scopes and lower parts kits.
Wouldn't they need at least one mag for the safety demonstration ?

David F.
  #15  
Old 12-12-2008, 8:44 AM
bwiese's Avatar
bwiese bwiese is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Jose
Posts: 26,760
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 40caldeserteagle View Post
Wouldn't they need at least one mag for the safety demonstration ?

David F.
Yup. A complete pistol needs to be equipped with a magazine.

It also needs to be sold with the magazine it's been tested with when Rostered (i.e, can't use an aftermarket replacement).
__________________

Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA

CGF Board Member / NRA Benefactor Life Member / CRPA life member

No postings of mine here, unless otherwise specifically noted, are
to be construed as formal or informal positions of the Calguns.Net
ownership, The Calguns Foundation, Inc. ("CGF"), the NRA, or my
employer. No posts of mine on Calguns are to be construed as
legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.
  #16  
Old 12-12-2008, 9:05 AM
DDT
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
iTrader: / %
Default

Thanks for the education. I guess that being a newbie I really don't have adequate understanding of just how screwed up our gun laws are. The only handgun I own was purchased from a retail shop in CA. If I ever inherit my dad's back-up service weapon I hope I can bring it in. What about bringing it in as frame-only and then re-building the gun at home? Do I still need an OEM magazine for safety demonstration?
  #17  
Old 12-12-2008, 10:45 AM
bwiese's Avatar
bwiese bwiese is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Jose
Posts: 26,760
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DDT View Post
If I ever inherit my dad's back-up service weapon I hope I can bring it in. What about bringing it in as frame-only and then re-building the gun at home? Do I still need an OEM magazine for safety demonstration?
You are able to be given or willed your dad's backup handgun without dealing with it as a NRF (non-Rosterable frame).

As I pointed out, intrafamily xfers are exempt from Rostering.

The safety demo for a non-Rostered pistol transferred to you thru PPT or exempt intrafamily transfer or inheritance would not have to have an OEM magazine.

It's unclear to me if the safety demo of a *Rostered* handgun needs a factory OEM mag, perhaps not - but not that relevant, since actual DROSing & pickup appear to likely require it.
__________________

Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA

CGF Board Member / NRA Benefactor Life Member / CRPA life member

No postings of mine here, unless otherwise specifically noted, are
to be construed as formal or informal positions of the Calguns.Net
ownership, The Calguns Foundation, Inc. ("CGF"), the NRA, or my
employer. No posts of mine on Calguns are to be construed as
legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.
  #18  
Old 12-12-2008, 12:08 PM
PIRATE14 PIRATE14 is offline
Vendor/Retailer
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,027
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Default

We've done several HGs through out of state intraF xfers.....which, correctly stated they are exempt from the roster....

Just make sure it's the right family member....

Pretty sure the 1 per 30 days doesn't apply either.....
__________________
CHECKOUT...http://cwstactical.com FOR ALL YOUR CALIFORNIA LEGAL AR-AK-HK RIFLES and BUILDS...

CWS....WE CAN GO HOT ANYTIME....

CALIFORNICATION AT IT'S BEST...

BRD....BLACK RIFLE DISEASE.......SPREAD IT!!!!!!!!!

Last edited by PIRATE14; 12-12-2008 at 12:11 PM..
  #19  
Old 12-12-2008, 12:36 PM
shirow's Avatar
shirow shirow is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 363
iTrader: 30 / 100%
Default

My Mommy and Daddy live in Arizona.
  #20  
Old 12-12-2008, 12:38 PM
DDT
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
iTrader: / %
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bwiese View Post
Yup. A complete pistol needs to be equipped with a magazine.

It also needs to be sold with the magazine it's been tested with when Rostered (i.e, can't use an aftermarket replacement).
I guess that this had me a little confused. I see now where it says "sold" which doesn't apply to the topic of this thread. I "think" I understand now. Not that the law makes sense but I do understand it now anyway.
  #21  
Old 12-12-2008, 12:42 PM
Fate's Avatar
Fate Fate is online now
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Proud Member of the Quitter Club. Moscow, ID
Posts: 9,095
iTrader: 38 / 100%
Default

A good friend of mine just did this within the last month. He had been moaning about the pistol his dad wanted to give him that was off the roster and then I turned him on to Librarian's thread. Now he's got it and smiling from ear to ear. Now I need to see what I can shake loose from my old man back in Tx.
__________________
"On bended knee is no way to be free." - Eddie Vedder, "Guaranteed"

"Let your gun therefore be the constant companion of your walks." -Thomas Jefferson
, in a letter to his nephew Peter Carr dated August 19, 1785
  #22  
Old 12-17-2008, 11:03 AM
Fastnuf's Avatar
Fastnuf Fastnuf is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: San Diego, Cali
Posts: 60
iTrader: 5 / 100%
Default

Armed with all of the above information I contacted 6 FFL's (Unique, Royal, De Chiel, Gusslers, Discount and Turners who by the way doesn't do ANY out of state transfers anymore) in San Diego about doing my out-of-state intra family transfer of a non California roster hand gun, and each and everyone said it was not legal. I even quoted the info provided here but to no avail.

I had planned to wait until she came home on leave, but due to her husbands deployment schedule, we are unsure when she will be coming home.

So my question is, who here in San Diego has done an out of state intra family transfer what FFL did you use?
  #23  
Old 12-17-2008, 11:58 AM
sfwdiy's Avatar
sfwdiy sfwdiy is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Hollywood
Posts: 2,135
iTrader: 6 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bwiese View Post
Normally, lineal intrafamily transfers within CA do NOT need to use FFLs. Ensure your kid has a HSC card, hand the pistol to him, and tell him to fill out the DOJ form and pay $19 within 30 days (or whatever the fee is).
If you have a parent that lives out of state, can they come into California with the firearm, then give it to you while they're here using the above? Or does it have to go through an FFL anyway just because it's coming from out of state?

--Ben
__________________
Need data recovery? CLICK HERE for a discount on your next recovery from DriveSavers!
  #24  
Old 12-17-2008, 12:20 PM
ke6guj's Avatar
ke6guj ke6guj is offline
Moderator
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: 909
Posts: 23,258
iTrader: 42 / 100%
Default

Conventional wisdom says that because ATF does not allow for unlicensed individuals to transfer firearms between residents of different states. There is no federal intrafamily exemption to that. So, it is supposed to go through a CA FFL for federal reasons, not state.
__________________
Jack



Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA?

FrontSight Training Course certificates available $25, PM for details on them and other options.
No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.
  #25  
Old 12-17-2008, 12:41 PM
Librarian's Avatar
Librarian Librarian is offline
Super Moderator
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Concord
Posts: 33,134
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Blog Entries: 6
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fate View Post
A good friend of mine just did this within the last month. He had been moaning about the pistol his dad wanted to give him that was off the roster and then I turned him on to Librarian's thread. Now he's got it and smiling from ear to ear. Now I need to see what I can shake loose from my old man back in Tx.
I hadn't seen that until today -- I'll take that as my Christmas present!
__________________
Calguns Wiki, Magazine Qs, Knife laws

Unless there is some way to amend a bill so you would support it,
the details do not matter until the Governor signs or allows the bill to become law.

Ask CA law questions in the How CA Laws Apply to/Affect Me Forum
- most questions that start 'Is it legal ...' go there.

Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs.


  #26  
Old 12-17-2008, 12:47 PM
artherd's Avatar
artherd artherd is offline
Vendor/Retailer
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: North SF Bay Area
Posts: 5,069
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Rockso View Post
Conventional wisdom says that it must go through an FFL no matter what. There are a couple of people who will claim that once it's given to them, it becomes theirs, and all that is required is the $19 DOJ fee. I don't know the law well enough to point out if/why this is incorrect, but I'd play it safe and do the FFL thing.
Parent would have to MOVE TO and not merely VISIT CA.
__________________
- Ben Cannon.
Chairman, CEO - GPal, Inc.™
CoFounder - GeoVario™, LLC. - the hosting company that brings you Calguns™

Postings are my own, and are not formal positions of any other entity, or legal advice.
  #27  
Old 12-17-2008, 3:00 PM
Turbinator's Avatar
Turbinator Turbinator is offline
Super Moderator
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 11,260
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Default

IMHO, this information is worth a sticky.

Turby
  #28  
Old 12-17-2008, 4:15 PM
grammaton76's Avatar
grammaton76 grammaton76 is offline
Super Moderator
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 9,540
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by artherd View Post
Parent would have to MOVE TO and not merely VISIT CA.
Or of course if your parent's in the military and has maintained CA as his/her home of record, I believe this would be a more or less perma "give it to him" situation provided they've sent the DOJ their $19.

My dad filled out the handgun reg form for a CZ-40P and waited for registration to come in, then handed it to me and I sent in a notice of intrafamiliar transfer.

Of course, even if the home of record thing didn't fly, he happened to have been re-stationed at Ft. Irwin immediately prior to the reg and subsequent transfer, so no big deal anyway.
__________________
Primary author of gunwiki.net - 'like' it on Facebook at http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/Gunwiki/242578512591 to see whenever new content gets added!
  #29  
Old 12-20-2008, 7:29 PM
Pont Pont is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Silly Con Valley, CA
Posts: 194
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

I'm sure this is in a FAQ somewhere, but...

My grandfather and grandmother divorced. My grandfather remarried. He has passed away, as has my biological grandmother.

Does my step-grandmother count as a linear intrafamily transfer?
  #30  
Old 12-24-2008, 11:04 AM
ZirconJohn's Avatar
ZirconJohn ZirconJohn is online now
Rattlesnake Hunter
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Ukiah, CA
Posts: 9,363
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlohaRover View Post
So my wife can give her dad all of her SIG P250s?
Nope! - Gonna ahave to ship all them Sig P250's to ME!

Ha! Just kidding... yes.

In a nutshell... this basic info, yet also a can of worms for obvious reasons;

Intrafamilial, heirloom transfers "up the ladder, or down the ladder, not across" as in sibling to sibling etc. are exempt from the CA DOJ Roster of Handguns Certified for Sale. Additionally, you may want to have your Dealer contact DOJ on specific items etc... it's common practice at my shop. I never take State or Federal Law for granted. We git-er done the right way.
__________________
.
"A rattlesnake that doesn't bite teaches you nothing" -- Jessamyn West
"Only God has the touch to create these magnificent rattlesnakes and their signature greatness in nature" -- unknown
.
......GO HERE FOR--► My YouTube Channel

................CLICK IMAGE for full size

Last edited by ZirconJohn; 12-24-2008 at 11:05 AM.. Reason: Text correction
  #31  
Old 01-05-2009, 1:22 PM
65cobra 65cobra is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 83
iTrader: 5 / 100%
Default

sorry if I just missed it in my reading. I live in Ca and my Dad lives in Idaho. What if he gives it to me while I am visiting in Idaho. So I am the owner and I travel accross the state line to get home. Then do I just send in the form?
  #32  
Old 01-05-2009, 1:29 PM
ke6guj's Avatar
ke6guj ke6guj is offline
Moderator
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: 909
Posts: 23,258
iTrader: 42 / 100%
Default

He can't give it to you physically while you are in Idaho. That would be transfer between two unlicensed individuals of different states and would violate federal law.

In order to comply with federal law, he would need to deliver it (in person or shipped) to a CA FFL for you to DROS it from.
__________________
Jack



Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA?

FrontSight Training Course certificates available $25, PM for details on them and other options.
No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.
  #33  
Old 01-08-2009, 3:39 PM
Wizard99's Avatar
Wizard99 Wizard99 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Solano County
Posts: 381
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

I would be willing to bet that most people in this country assume that their is a Federal family transfer. Since most states either have a familial transfer exemption or any person to person transfer doesn't have to go through a dealer people just assume that the same applies across state lines.

I think a lot of people all over the US are unknowningly comitting federal felonies.

Its to bad we can't push for a Federal familial transfer exemption on the basis that families in this day and age are spread out all over the country and most people assume that its leagal for their dad to give them grandpas old dear rifle even though they live in differant states.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackwater OPS View Post
That's why I always say, "Handguns are for head shots".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kestryll View Post
Yeah! Let's put someone in who will appoint SCOTUS Justices that will gut Heller, that will show Bush, the Republicans and all those people who didn't see the glory that is Ron Paul!!

Working on the same theory, next time someone tries to mug you or beat you up, stab yourself in the scrotum first, that should keep them away...
  #34  
Old 01-12-2009, 10:31 PM
thatrogue's Avatar
thatrogue thatrogue is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: El Dorado Hills, CA
Posts: 388
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

My dad in texas needs to cap his xdm mags at 10 and gift it to me.
  #35  
Old 01-22-2009, 9:37 PM
thatrogue's Avatar
thatrogue thatrogue is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: El Dorado Hills, CA
Posts: 388
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

I have called a few houston area dealers and cant find one that will ship to my FFL here in Sacramento... Anybody know whom my dad can go to
__________________
"You will see us move very quickly to gut the remnants of the assault weapon ban in California"- Gene Hoffman
SW 1911 PD w/crimson trace
Sig p250t .40 digital camo
16" EBR
18" 1187 super mag special purpose
Ruger m77 .270

  #36  
Old 01-22-2009, 9:40 PM
ke6guj's Avatar
ke6guj ke6guj is offline
Moderator
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: 909
Posts: 23,258
iTrader: 42 / 100%
Default

Your father does not need to use a TX FFL to ship it to your FFL. It is legal for him to ship it directly to the CA FFL. Just confirm that your FFL will accept a shipment from a non-licensee.
__________________
Jack



Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA?

FrontSight Training Course certificates available $25, PM for details on them and other options.
No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.
  #37  
Old 01-22-2009, 10:28 PM
thatrogue's Avatar
thatrogue thatrogue is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: El Dorado Hills, CA
Posts: 388
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Isn't it a federal requirement to ship thru a FFL... By the way my FFL Sonoma Firearms said that it needs to be a FFL to FFL.
__________________
"You will see us move very quickly to gut the remnants of the assault weapon ban in California"- Gene Hoffman
SW 1911 PD w/crimson trace
Sig p250t .40 digital camo
16" EBR
18" 1187 super mag special purpose
Ruger m77 .270

  #38  
Old 01-22-2009, 10:41 PM
ke6guj's Avatar
ke6guj ke6guj is offline
Moderator
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: 909
Posts: 23,258
iTrader: 42 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thatrogue View Post
Isn't it a federal requirement to ship thru a FFL...
nope, just that it be shipped to an FFL
Quote:
By the way my FFL Sonoma Firearms said that it needs to be a FFL to FFL.
that would not be correct per federal or state law. However, if he personally wants to only accept shipments from another FFL, that is he perogative.
__________________
Jack



Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA?

FrontSight Training Course certificates available $25, PM for details on them and other options.
No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.
  #39  
Old 01-22-2009, 10:45 PM
ke6guj's Avatar
ke6guj ke6guj is offline
Moderator
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: 909
Posts: 23,258
iTrader: 42 / 100%
Default

Here is the info.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ATF FAQ
(B8) May a nonlicensee ship a firearm by common or contract carrier? [Back]


A nonlicensee may ship a firearm by a common or contract carrier to a resident of his or her own State or to a licensee in any State. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. In addition, Federal law requires that the carrier be notified that the shipment contains a firearm and prohibits common or contract carriers from requiring or causing any label to be placed on any package indicating that it contains a firearm.

[18 U.S.C. 922(a)(2)(A), 922(a) (3), 922(a)(5) and 922(e), 27 CFR 478.31 and 478.30]
__________________
Jack



Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA?

FrontSight Training Course certificates available $25, PM for details on them and other options.
No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.
  #40  
Old 10-14-2009, 3:30 PM
tba02's Avatar
tba02 tba02 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: W. Oakland/S.F.
Posts: 819
iTrader: 5 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bwiese View Post
[Formally inherited/bequested guns can cross state lines without usage of FFLs - and there's exemption in CA law for this too. Rostering not required.]
I've read this thread more than once, but didn't catch the above until yesterday.

Hypothetically ...

1) I moved to CA in 2004

2) I have a gun that is in another state that I have stored, of which I am the owner.
2a) *if this even matters* This was an inherited item.

3) The roster, due to 2 or 2a does not apply.

Assumed to be true -
A) I can go to said location and, following applicable TSA laws, fly home with said item (assumption is yes, please correct me if I am wrong)
B) I can ship the item via common carrier to myself (why would I if A applies, however)

Question -
Can a non-owner/non-prohibited person ship this via common carrier, from the common carrier directly to myself w/o the need to ship to a CA FFL?

I would then have to adhere to CA laws and spend $19.00, of course.

Am I missing something by believing the above to be possible?

The point is that if one doesn't have to fly to the alternate location to retrieve the item, it could be shipped direct.
Having to go through an FFL makes the plane ticket a more economical choice.

Last edited by tba02; 10-14-2009 at 3:35 PM..
Closed Thread

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 9:50 PM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2016, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.