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Calguns LEOs LEOs; chat, kibitz and relax. Non-LEOs; have a questions for a cop? Ask it here, in a CIVIL manner.

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  #1  
Old 05-31-2012, 4:49 AM
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Default "Hi-Cap mags" ?

I was pulled over by a CHP officer on Inerstate 15 and yes i was speeding. The officer noticed that i had my gun cases in the back of my truck and asked if could make sure they were "free and clear".(I Know never agree to a search, I learned) Thinking i was good i asked if i could step out and accompany him. There were no issues but i have a a 10/22 that i purchased recently out of state. (I am active duty military and recently transfered into Cali). The 10/22 came with the ruger BX-25 round magizines. The officer told me i was carrying High Capacity magazines. I explained to the officer that they came with the weapon and are just stored with it. I also had two ten round mags next to it as well. He let me keep my bx-25's and gave me a warning.
So my question is am i allowed to transport my firearms with no amunition in the gun or magazines but have my 25 round mags for the 10/22 in the gun box i transport my firearms in?
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  #2  
Old 05-31-2012, 4:53 AM
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the best advice:
take apart your bx25 and it will no longer be a "mag" but a "kit" instead
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  #3  
Old 05-31-2012, 5:28 AM
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It sounds like to me that you admitted to the officer that you (perhaps unknowingly) committed a crime, importing a magazine into the state that holds more than ten rounds. You can't import mags into CA that have a capacity of more than 10 rounds.

It also sounds like he was a pretty cool guy and wan't too concerned you or about your 22 rimfire mag. He took the opportunity to educate you a bit instead of royally screwing up your life, which I think he could have done.

In my experience every cop I've ever encountered falls in to this category. I've never met one of these evil cops that some keep talking about.
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  #4  
Old 05-31-2012, 5:39 AM
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As long as you possessed those exact +10 round mags in Ca prior to 1-1-00, it's perfectly legal to have them here now. Since you admitted that you recently got them (and the fact they were not made then), you admitted to a crime.
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  #5  
Old 05-31-2012, 8:41 AM
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confused you should be i was unaware of any law against "transporting hi-caps" unless its into california
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  #6  
Old 05-31-2012, 8:57 AM
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If you going to be a gun owner I highly advise knowing the laws
What you choose to do with that knowledge is your own decision

But know the system,work the system

you very easily could have just said that they are you magazines and left it at that
It is good to know the laws because you unknowingly admitted a crime to a cop...
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  #7  
Old 05-31-2012, 12:13 PM
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You purchased the 10-22 outside of California and later became a California resident (perhaps temporarily) by PCSing. Given that you are active duty and just recently here the officer was kind enough to cut you a major sprout. Bringing that >10 round capacity magazine into California completes a felony crime for which he could have arrested you on the spot.

Since, essentially, you copped out to the officer that you had (perhaps unknowingly) committed a felony.... and you have also copped out to it on a public web forum, you are now fully aware that the importation into California of the magazine in question was and continues to be a felony.

My advice.... lose the 25 rounder. Mail it to your family out of state to hold for you or break it down to parts. While possession is not against the law, importation is. Don't mess with potentially catching a felony which would lose your gun rights to you forever.... and which probably wouldn't make your command very happy either.
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  #8  
Old 05-31-2012, 6:53 PM
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Well thank you guys, I was given different advise before i left my last duty station. They have officially been mailed home to family until i PCS again.
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  #9  
Old 06-01-2012, 5:37 AM
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You got lucky since you basically admitted to a crime.

However I am glad he cut you loose. As a former Soldier and current LEO, I would have done the same thing. I'm not going to ruin the life of one of our nation's best because of an unintentional error like that.
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  #10  
Old 06-01-2012, 6:48 AM
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Now don't go and bite the hand that freed ya and file a complaint against the officer for something else and say he didn't arrest you because he had nothing. That's what always happens with people you cut a break to, they file a complaint.
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  #11  
Old 06-01-2012, 11:34 AM
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Take it apart and make it a kit like previously stated. That way if youre asked about your mag again, its just a kit.
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  #12  
Old 06-01-2012, 3:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby Ricigliano View Post
You got lucky since you basically admitted to a crime.

However I am glad he cut you loose. As a former Soldier and current LEO, I would have done the same thing. I'm not going to ruin the life of one of our nation's best because of an unintentional error like that.
The only error was admitting importation. Possession is not illegal.
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  #13  
Old 06-01-2012, 11:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CalCop View Post
The only error was admitting importation. Possession is not illegal.
Indeed, this is true. The crime I was suggesting was the admitted importation, not the mere possession.
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  #14  
Old 06-01-2012, 11:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A-J View Post
Personally, I will never consent to a search. Of course, I never do something that'll get me pulled over when I have guns in the car. Sounds like you got the right officer on the right day, given some experiences of others here on the board.
Luckily for me, I have usually developed the independent PC to conduct a non-consensual vehicle search prior to asking for consent, if it is a vehicle I want to search.

If it is Joe Calgunner coming to and fro with his properly secured firearms I have no interest in tossing his vehicle anyway. Most cops know the difference between Joe Citizen and Joe Dirtbag. It is Mr. Dirtbag that gets all my attention.
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  #15  
Old 06-01-2012, 11:40 PM
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If you have guns bouncing around in the bed of your truck, it's plain view as to the gun cases but he can't open them and search for magazines without your consent unless you make statements otherwise.
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  #16  
Old 06-02-2012, 12:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bohoki View Post
confused you should be i was unaware of any law against "transporting hi-caps" unless its into california
re-read csc's posting.... the OP admitted it himself to the CHP....
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  #17  
Old 06-03-2012, 9:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Notorious View Post
If you have guns bouncing around in the bed of your truck, it's plain view as to the gun cases but he can't open them and search for magazines without your consent unless you make statements otherwise.
Agreed. Just because you see gun cases in the bed of the truck does not mean there is reasonable suspicion of a crime. I hate it when some cops assume when gun cases are involved there must obviously be a crime in one of them....or they think they are allowed to open the cases to find out. Now, if there is a silencer on the back seat, okay, search the cases. But, if all they were doing is speeding....you do NOT have RS or PC of anything gun-related and you shouldn't be searching the cases.
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  #18  
Old 06-03-2012, 9:50 AM
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What about:

Quote:
CALIFORNIA CODES
PENAL CODE
SECTION 25850

25850. (a) A person is guilty of carrying a loaded firearm when the
person carries a loaded firearm on the person or in a vehicle while
in any public place or on any public street in an incorporated city
or in any public place or on any public street in a prohibited area
of unincorporated territory.
(b) In order to determine whether or not a firearm is loaded for
the purpose of enforcing this section, peace officers are authorized
to examine any firearm carried by anyone on the person or in a
vehicle while in any public place or on any public street in an
incorporated city or prohibited area of an unincorporated territory.
Refusal to allow a peace officer to inspect a firearm pursuant to
this section constitutes probable cause for arrest for violation of
this section.

...
If the LEO knows you have a firearm, the firearms can be checked.
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  #19  
Old 06-03-2012, 9:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MistDaemon View Post
What about:
If the LEO knows you have a firearm, the firearms can be checked.
Possession of gun case does not equal possession of firearm.
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Old 06-03-2012, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doc8404 View Post
So my question is am i allowed to transport my firearms with no amunition in the gun or magazines but have my 25 round mags for the 10/22 in the gun box i transport my firearms in?
Yes, if you don't admit importation.
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  #21  
Old 06-03-2012, 5:46 PM
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Guns bad ,large cap mags worst!
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  #22  
Old 06-03-2012, 6:21 PM
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sounds like to me you got extremely lucky it was that particular chipy that pulled you over.he sounds like a very cool cop that gave you a huge break.
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  #23  
Old 06-03-2012, 8:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CalCop View Post
Possession of gun case does not equal possession of firearm.
Especially if you use the covert cases or other non-gun case looking containers, there is no PC, period.
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  #24  
Old 06-12-2012, 2:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CalCop View Post
The only error was admitting importation. Possession is not illegal.
The ONLY way you can have a BX-25 in California is by importing them. They were not made before 1-1-2000 when you would have had to be in possession prior in order to have legal possession today.

Dan
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  #25  
Old 06-12-2012, 2:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bergmen View Post
The ONLY way you can have a BX-25 in California is by importing them. They were not made before 1-1-2000 when you would have had to be in possession prior in order to have legal possession today.

Dan
Incorrect. You can use a BX-25 to rebuild your existing 25 round magazines, or as in my case, I bought a bunch before I retired from LE where I purchased them from a local store that specializes in LE sales. I spent $300+ on magazines the morning I had to turn in my active LE credentials for my retired credentials.

Maybe you should spend some more time reading this forum before spouting off incorrect information.
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Old 06-12-2012, 3:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bergmen View Post
The ONLY way you can have a BX-25 in California is by importing them. They were not made before 1-1-2000 when you would have had to be in possession prior in order to have legal possession today.
Possessing them does not mean YOU imported them. And neither receiving, nor finding, nor possession of the mag is illegal.
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  #27  
Old 06-12-2012, 3:24 PM
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They can legally be sold from an armored car company.
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  #28  
Old 06-12-2012, 6:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rromeo View Post
They can legally be sold from an armored car company.
You mean, you can legally buy them if you are a properly licensed armor car guard. That is listed in the penal code as an authorized purchaser.
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Old 06-12-2012, 6:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Notorious View Post
You mean, you can legally buy them if you are a properly licensed armor car guard. That is listed in the penal code as an authorized purchaser.
the exemption is not limited to purchases by armored car guards.


32435. Section 32310 does not apply to any of the following:
(a) The sale of, giving of, lending of, importation into this
state of, or purchase of, any large-capacity magazine, to or by any
entity that operates an armored vehicle business
pursuant to the laws
of this state.
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Old 06-12-2012, 6:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ke6guj View Post
the exemption is not limited to purchases by armored car guards.


32435. Section 32310 does not apply to any of the following:
(a) The sale of, giving of, lending of, importation into this
state of, or purchase of, any large-capacity magazine, to or by any
entity that operates an armored vehicle business
pursuant to the laws
of this state.
This was the sentence referenced by my post:

Quote:
They can legally be sold from an armored car company.
Which, although true, is not relevant to the original situation where the OP admitted importing them, which then got into a question of how he came into possession of them via other legal means, which then would follow that the crux of it turns on the ACQUISITION by the OP, via legal means, rather than who sold it or how it was sold, which is irrelevant to the situation.

Which is why I concentrated on how the OP, as an individual, may legally purchase a regular capacity magazine in CA.
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Old 06-12-2012, 6:39 PM
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Actually, that's not what I mean.
(27) the sale of, giving of, lending of, importation into this state of, or purchase of, any large capacity magazine TO OR BY entities that operate armored car businesses pursuant to the laws of this state.
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Old 06-12-2012, 6:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rromeo View Post
Actually, that's not what I mean.
(27) the sale of, giving of, lending of, importation into this state of, or purchase of, any large capacity magazine TO OR BY entities that operate armored car businesses pursuant to the laws of this state.
I understand that, but I am trying to keep it to where the OP, as an individual, is the main concern, not if the OP may or may not be an armored car business owner and got the mags for his business. I am saying trying to figure it on an individual basis.
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  #33  
Old 06-12-2012, 9:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rromeo View Post
They can legally be sold from an armored car company.
Armored car companies are allowed to buy them. The exemption does not say the armored car company can sell them


Quote:
Originally Posted by ke6guj View Post
the exemption is not limited to purchases by armored car guards..

32435. Section 32310 does not apply to any of the following:
(a) The sale of, giving of, lending of, importation into this
state of, or purchase of, any large-capacity magazine, to or by any
entity that operates an armored vehicle business
pursuant to the laws
of this state.
Where does this say the armored car company can sell?
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  #34  
Old 06-12-2012, 9:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron-Solo View Post
...Where does this say the armored car company can sell?
If you read just the bolded parts you will see how it says armored car companies can sell.

Quote:
The sale of any large-capacity magazine by any entity that operates an armored vehicle business pursuant to the laws of this state.
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  #35  
Old 06-12-2012, 11:01 PM
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The BX 25s are illegal. They were made after the hi cap ban so there is no way you can have one assembled and be legal.
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  #36  
Old 06-12-2012, 11:46 PM
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Default Sticky situation..

Thank God the Chp officer didn't charge you with a crime. Not that I think you should have been charged, but you really lucked out...IMHO. Thankyou for your service to our great country and I hope your time here in California is filled with happy times and good memories.
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  #37  
Old 06-13-2012, 12:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike's Custom View Post
The BX 25s are illegal. They were made after the hi cap ban so there is no way you can have one assembled and be legal.


Helllloooooo.........

Have you been paying attention?

You can rebuild legally owned hicap mags using parts from a BX-25, and you can eventually use all the parts from the new mag, as long as you don't end up with more completed mags than you started with.

I bought numerous BX-25 magazines before I retired, and now I legally possess them.

Your entire statement is 100% WRONG! For someone who claims to be a "Firearms Dealer" in your profile, you seem to be carrying on the tradition of gun store FUD.

Can the average Joe Citizen walk into a California gun store and buy a completed BX-25? No.
Can LE buy them? Yes.
Can Joe Citizen buy a disassembled BX-25? Yes.
Can Joe Citizen assemble said magazine except when rebuilding a lawfully possessed hicap mag? No
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  #38  
Old 06-13-2012, 12:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mssr. Eleganté View Post
If you read just the bolded parts you will see how it says armored car companies can sell.
Technically, you are right, but they can't sell them to individuals that are not exempt, which was my point. I probably could have worded it better.
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  #39  
Old 06-13-2012, 6:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Ron-Solo View Post
Technically, you are right, but they can't sell them to individuals that are not exempt, which was my point. I probably could have worded it better.
Which is the main point... about the OP, as an individual, acquiring said magazines. Not about which mysterious seller or entity or unholy alliance could have sold it somewhere out there.
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Old 06-13-2012, 9:25 AM
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bergmen bergmen is online now
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Originally Posted by Ron-Solo View Post
Incorrect. You can use a BX-25 to rebuild your existing 25 round magazines, or as in my case, I bought a bunch before I retired from LE where I purchased them from a local store that specializes in LE sales. I spent $300+ on magazines the morning I had to turn in my active LE credentials for my retired credentials.

Maybe you should spend some more time reading this forum before spouting off incorrect information.
Okay, let me be more specific:

LEO's are in a different class and it should be obvious that there are exemptions that are not being discussed here.

Maybe you should spend more time reading this forum to understand that the discussion has centered around the legal posession of BX-25 magazines, in California by the general shooting public, NOT LEO's.

It is illegal for non-LEO's (or specially licensed FFL's) to possess BX-25 magazines in California PERIOD. They were introduced after the 1-1-2000 legislation which means that possession involved an illegal transfer of ownership in some manner form, illegal importation from out of state or illegal manufacture by assembling parts from a kit.

Is that clear now?

Dan

Last edited by bergmen; 06-13-2012 at 9:27 AM..
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