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Calgunners in Service This forum is a place for our active duty and deployed members to share, request and have a bit of home where ever they are. |
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Opinions on Army or Air Force Commission Officer
Army vs Air Force Commissioned Officer
Hello, I am planning on applying for OCS/OTS soon, and would like some opinions based on your personal experiences. Info about myself - Currently 27 years old, 5'6", 170 lbs - B.S. in Management Information Systems - 3.4 GPA - Slightly bad shape (2 mile run - 22 minutes, can do push ups and situps requirements) - Currently, planning on making the military long term career - Have a wife, no kids, but would like some in the future Based on research, these are the fields that interest me, but I believe I won't have a choice going in as an officer Air Force - 13XX - Space, Missile, and Command & Control Utilization Field - 15NX - Weather Field - 21XX - Logistics Field - 31PX - Security Forces Field (Read a lot of negative reviews on this one) - 33SX - Communications & Information Field (Not really interested, but closest to my degree and previous job skills) Army - 12x - Armor (Specifically 12C, Cavalry) - 25x - Signal (Again, not really interested, but similar to my current skill set) - 88x - Transportation - 91x - Ordnance - 92x - Quartermaster |
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Join the army!!!! Go to http://www.armyocs.com/ they have a wealth of good information. When I was in basic, a platoon of 2 LT's came and did PT with us one morning. I talked to one of them while I ran and he told me that 60% of males going through OCS go into a combat arms branch. He told me that he could figure out no pattern as to why people were put into the fields they got. You definitely need to improve on your run.
I went it to basic in pretty good shape and I got pneumonia for over half the time I was in basic. If it weren't for the fact that I was already in shape, there is no way I would have been able to pass the PT test there. I would say, before you go in be able to score at least a 60 in each event if not higher. |
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You wont get to choose your field (in the Army) until the completion of OCS, then it is based on class ranking.
You will need to pass (and excel) on the APFT to be considered for reccommendation. Its importaint that you have a recruiter who knows how to put together an OCS packet or it will be a longer and more painful than nessacary process. Do you have any criminal history? Financial issues? These are just a couple of things you will need to have straight if you plan on making it. **FYI** I am a detailed Army recruiter that has put in many OCS candidates in the last 2 years, if you need to talk, PM me and Ill shoot you my number. |
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Need to cut that run time in half and be able to max push ups and sit ups.
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God, grant me the serenity To accept the things I cannot change; The courage to change the things I can; And the wisdom to know the difference. |
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No criminal record, no problems with financial history. Biggest hurdle is getting physically fit and choosing which branch to serve. Thanks for the offer CavTrooper, I'll send you a PM soon, I'm still researching so I have as many questions to ask the recruiter when I go see them.
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I was going to say almost the exact same thing sgt.
Airforce! But I'm biased Honestly though, ever thought about enlisting before becoming an officer? you will get a **** ton more respect in the Army at least in combat MOS. Ask most veteran sgts. I'm lucky, I'm not in a combat zone so I just smile and nod at the officers knowing the decision of a college kid isnt going to kill me The bad *** thing is also warrent officers. those guys get a lot of respect in the Army.
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Buy my EO Tech XPS3-0!!! For those nutjobs who like to use the word "gouge" Note: I did not write the above article. Any carpenters in Socal want a side project? |
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Yes, I realize that going in straight as a commission officer doesn't carry the respect level that an enlisted person who becomes an officer gets, but I heard that it is difficult to try to become an officer after enlisting, since you will have to get the OK from your superior before trying. This is just what I've heard from other people's experience going this path.
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Complete B.S. Get your commission now. An officer is an officer. You respect the rank - every once in a while you respect the man. Most the former enlisted officers I served with were too arrogant to listen to their NCOs when they needed to. Not all, but a lot of them. Your men are not going to "relate" to you because you used to be enlisted. Either you are good officer or you're not. The rest is pure B.S. You go get your bars. Good for you.
Avoid the following careers like the plague. Not only does the work just plain suck, the civilian counterparts suck. You worked hard for that degree, build on it. Don't just piss it away with a crappy career field. Transportation Supply Logistics Refuling Armory Get those off your list. If they are on your short list of career fields you will accept, you will get the crappiest on on the list. Put only jobs you would kill for on your list. If you're really lucky, you'll get one of them. Don't have a single "I'd settle for this if I had to" job on it or that is the job you'll get. Guarenteed. Why? Because you're the only idiot who had it on his list! Meanwhile everybody and their brother wanted the ones you really wanted. So go fight for the jobs you really want to do, and only those jobs. If they are gonna give you a crappy job, let them pick it. The crappy jobs are pretty much all the same...boring. Seriously, the majority of the fields you selected really suck. I should know, I worked in both Air and Ground Transportation in the USAF. Never met a single person doing it, officer or enlisted that was happy being there. Crappy career fields man. Really crappy. I was lucky enough to spend some time assigned to a Mobile Aerial Port deployed all the time, but that is like winning the lottery for that career field. Very few people in those fields do anything remotely interesting. They are hating life. Very few choose to continue after their initial term of service as a result. Only two on your list would make my list of jobs I wanted. 1) Space, Missile, and Command & Control Utilization Field would be great and the civilian counter part would be great. 2) Armor would be great but there really is not a good civilian counter part. Hey, you never know until you in if you're gonna wanna be a lifer or not. Compared to your other Army options, this one is a no brainer though. I would look into the following, as they are best jobs in the military... 1) Aviation 2) Intel Pilots and Intel officers have the most opportunities in the military. All officers in the USAF have to serve in a non-flying common role for at least 4 years, so you will do more than just fly. Command positions go to pilots first, even in non-flying careers. Intel officers get assigned to a wide variety of units in all services, so for a few years you could be in an infantry unit, another few in armor, and another few in DC, you just never know. Both have very well paying counterparts in the civilian world, well beyond the obvious ones. For Security Police you would want to be enlisted. As an officer it is all paperwork and it does not translate to civilian life, as police departments do not recognize it as actual law enforcement. If you are interested in law enforcement look into... 1) Office of Special Investigation (OSI) USAF. Think FBI but for the Air Force. 2) Criminal Investigation Division (CID) Army. Same thing. The guys I knew that loved their jobs in the USAF were Avionics (enlisted), Pilots, OSI, Intel, Security Police (enlisted not officer), Loadmasters (enlisted), and Special Ops (don't rule this out...you are no so out of shape you couldn't get in shape easily). The rest of us loved the Air Force, but hated what we were doing for it. Just my $0.02. Last edited by tacticalcity; 12-03-2009 at 4:14 PM.. |
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And from talking to a prior-E SF guy turned comm officer, being an AF cop is tough if it's not 100% your thing. If you're not a meathead and don't enjoy writing tickets and checking IDs, and if you want to have a family anytime soon, cop is not the way to go. They're 6 deployed, 6 in garrison and neither side is particularly exciting. I'm not a tech guy by trade, but if you are, the AF's comm field is going interesting places. I know you say you're not interested, but the cyber mission is the future...even I'm excited despite being totally out of place with this AFSC. Either way you choose, best of luck and thanks for making the decision to serve. |
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I read the title and just posted away.
I changed my post once I actually read his post and realized he wants to be an officer and is not a fitness buff. I do know a lot of guys his size, which is not very big, that whipped themselves into shape and made it through various selection processes, but it doesn't sound like it is his thing. As for being mostly for enlisted, not really true. I thought the same thing until I read up on it. Combat Control, Delta, Special Forces, and so on all need officers to apply...more than they need enlisted applicants. The reason being few officers apply compared to a large number of enlisted. Few officers want that life style by comparison to guys who enlisted specifically for it. Yes there are a lot fewer slots available, but there are fewer people going after those slots. Not saying it is easy, just saying they are more likely let him try if he asks. Making through selection is an entirely different matter. Still, it doesn't sound like his thing. My revised post should be more helpful. My views on Air Force Security Police is that it is great if you are enlisted because it is a gateway into OSI, and you get to "play Army". There are counter sniper positions and all kinds of cool oportunities beyond what you read about in the job description. But as an officer, it would be a waste of time. It's strictly desk duty, and it does not carry any weight in the civilian world. As I understand it, officers can go straight into OSI, which would involve realistic law enforcement duties and could lead to a career with a federal law enforcement agency someday. So if he has law enforcement in mind, OSI is a much better career for somebody with bars on his shoulders. Odds are he doesn't enough know they exist! Most people don't. As for Transportation, Logistics and Supply...those jobs really suck. Somebody should warn him. So I did. If you get put into those jobs, it is not the end of the world...but don't just up and volunteer for them! Last edited by tacticalcity; 12-03-2009 at 4:29 PM.. |
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Thanks for the great insight everyone. I feel a little embarrassed as the possible choices I listed seem to be the bottom of the totem pole when it comes to the desired MOS or AFSC.
I’m definitely not a gung ho, lets go get em type guy, but if I had to deploy and put myself into danger, I have no problem with that. My wife understands I want to serve my country, and is sticking by my side regardless of what I choose. After talking to some recruiters over the phone, I am leaning towards USAF at the moment, but nothing is final just yet. And I'm still training to get the mile time down, it's pathetic but I know I can get faster with a little more running. Tactical City: You were right, I never heard of the OSI option, but it does sound like something I would be interested in, since FBI was a possible choice later if I chose not to be a lifer. The way you described Intel sounds much more interesting than the website’s description. USAF_Vito: I think I’ll start looking more into Communications & Information Field as well. Thanks everyone for the personal insight, this was exactly what I was searching for. Something more than just the basic descriptions from the websites and brochures. Please keep adding your personal experiences, I appreciate any you can provide. |
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http://www.airforceots.com/portal/index.php
OTS is highly impacted right now. The last acceptance rates for the "non-rated" career fields you mentioned were around 10%. This is on top of holding non rated boards about twice a year - if that - with the first one of this fiscal year canceled all together. They'll increase in the next few years with the ebbs and flows of things but unless something increases the demand (military build up for whatever) or decreases the supply (wipes out the officer core) it's not going to be drastic. OCS by contrast I hear, while competitive (it's not like enlisted for the Army where they'll take almost any warm body), is remarkably easier to get into and they hold boards every month (at least when I was looking). If you have a clean record (nothing above a few tickets) there's a near 100% acceptance rate. On that note BTW if you have any criminal background you will be turned away by pretty much every service. As far as the career fields (AFSC's) you mentioned for the Air Force here's the skinny. Space and Missiles are two separate tracks (space and missiles) and the majority are missilers for their first tour, which means no deploying, but long hours on and off sitting in a hole in a part of the country deemed too worthless to nuke. Security Forces I hear also has long hours and has a high ops tempo and from the divorce and casualty rates mirrors the Army and Marine's in many respects. At home it's mostly cop work and deployed its now picking up the Army and Marine missions (convoy's) because they don't have enough personnel for the tasking. As far as you're physical performance, what is your waist size at 5'6" 170lbs? A 34" waist, or a 35" waist come July, is an automatic failure in the Air Force. What waist size has to do with physical fitness is irrelevant since those are the standards. Moreover at 2 miles in 22 minutes you will fail the AF PT test which is now 50% and soon to be 60% running. Awesome people run 3 miles in 18 minutes. I don't mean to be a jerk but what you described is hardly slightly out of shape. Even if you met the bare minimums you can expect to be harassed your entire career for being a slacker. On a tangent - I think the whole enlisted first perspective is a load. Being prior can help but it is hardly necessary or an automatic advantage. In either the AF or the Army, competence and basic social skills, will pay dividends beyond if you were prior or not. Any S/NCO that lords their experience over junior officers is probably not a good S/NCO - a dynamic that works both ways. I've seen several priors that make great, as well as horrible, officers - just like everyone else. Last edited by holasrmateo; 12-03-2009 at 6:01 PM.. |
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Pilot's for example, have a 10 year service commitment, after their winged since UPT is about a million dollars and about about half to one million for training in a specific airframe like an F-22 (gas isn't cheap) - not to mention the TS security clearance the medical tests, OTS, further training as an officer. You add a 20 year career and a 30 year old (the cut off for fliers) becomes 50. At 42 (I don't know what the AF age standard is for enlisted) this would push a 20 year pilot to 62 and Generals are forced to retire at 65 (and you're not making General anything after 20 years). |
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In July, with the new standards, the waist actually gets EASIER with the max score given for being under 35" (for age <30), although there is now a fail rate, somewhere around 40". The waist will only be worth 20% starting in July with the new standards. There are minimum pushups and situps now, at 33 and 42 respectively, so if you can get to those numbers, you'll pass those. You wanna be around the 50-50 range at least, and 67 pushups-62 situps are the max. Each event is worth 10%. The run is the biggest factor, at 50% now and 60% with the new standards. There is currently no minimum (meaning slowest allowed) run time, but again, the 75 overall score to pass is still king. With the new standards, I believe the fail rate is somewhere in the 13s, but don't quote me on that. To max out the run, it's currently 9:37 or faster, and will get harder in July at 9:12. Drebin: For comparison's sake, I'm 5'9 185, about a 50-45 guy with a 34" waist running in the 10:50 range. I'll never be a PT superstar, but they definitely want a young Lt like me to get better; I score in the low to mid 80s currently. Definitely work on that run above the rest, because it's heavily weighted towards that. The AF is LOADED with officers...they're cutting down lately, so it might be a little tough. I did ROTC, so I'm no expert on OTS, but I definitely believe what holasrmateo said about it. Again, good luck... |
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At OTS, I think the standard is 80 or below and you're on special monitoring status (SMS - it impacts your performance there and how you are treated) and extra work out, and since it's training it's pretty obvious if you blow it off. I'll be honest though that I didn't work out the composite minimums since you don't want to have only 15 pieces of flair in any organization because it goes into impressions and negative subjectivity. If it's obvious you're borderline or over, let alone if they have regular PT sessions for applicants, recruiters won't bend over backwards for you or encourage you to not waste their or your time. In any event, running is the single most important component. You don't have to be a Kenyan but you lose points fast and unless you're just tall. Waist correlates with weight which correlates with speed. |
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For anyone who cares, the attrition rate at OTS when I went was 20%, which was abnormally high (I've heard 10% is the norm). It was about equal as far as prior/non-priors were concerned. But you really have to not try or quit to fail because they give you a billion chances if you're showing improvement and the case they have to build to toss you out. Also our top grad and second were non priors and the only two documented alcohol incidences (which will get you booted from the AF faster than if you crashed a plane) were committed by priors.
Last edited by holasrmateo; 12-03-2009 at 7:29 PM.. |
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I'm glad somebody finally said what needed to be said. Nothing is more unprofessional than an officer trying to be buddy-buddy with the enlisted just because he was prior service. You follow orders from your superiors, no questions asked. Do yourself and your unit a favor: If you're a brand new LT, you better NOT be a wuss and let people run you over because of the myth that you don't get respect because you're inexperienced. Don't come to us NCOs and tell us "I don't know what I'm doing" because we will lose respect for you. There are ways to utilize our on-the-job experience without seeming like a panzy. YOU are the boss, don't forget that. Leaders need to be confident in themselves and their ability to lead and make the right decision.
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Last edited by Army GI; 12-03-2009 at 7:25 PM.. |
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well sgt, how about all the times you HAD to tell the lt what to do because of dear in the headlight look on his face and not because he asked for help?
as far as respecting the rank and not the man, that looks good for recruiting I guess. Yes enlisted are going to salute an officer but respect is earned and not given. You arnt going to respect someone who is going to lead you with no experience just because he has a degree, we follow because we HAVE to. Yes platoon leaders have the rank but patoon daddys run the show. He's been there, done that, knows how to do it the right and wrong way and will be the one who brings the joes home.
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Buy my EO Tech XPS3-0!!! For those nutjobs who like to use the word "gouge" Note: I did not write the above article. Any carpenters in Socal want a side project? Last edited by Maddog5150; 12-04-2009 at 6:45 AM.. |
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Wait, did it change? Last time I checked, I was a 19C. What happened?! When!?
You can't specify 19C (or 12C or whatever). You will get branched 19A, general armour. The Army does not distinguish when making assignments between 19A, 19B and 19C, the training is pretty much all the same. 19C may be only after completion of the Scout Leader's Course/Cavalry Leader's Course (itself being renamed soon), but the difference in MOS is more of an additional skill identifier, not basic MOS. Thus, for example, a new 19A right out of BOLC-III could find himself a platoon leader the cav squadron of an airborne light infantry brigade (i.e. 73rd Cav), attend jump school and SLC as requirements of the position (and be reclassed 19C), and then his next assignment could be as a tank compnany executive officer in 1st Armored. Then he could be a staff officer in a heavy cav squadron with Bradleys, before taking command of a Stryker recon troop. It's not like enlisted wherein if you're a 19K, you stay in tanks and MGS your whole career. On the plus side, when you go through BOLC-III, you'll get to shoot tanks, Bradleys, and HMMWVs, as well as play dismount. They did have a few Strykers at Knox last year, but just as ride-ins, not crewing). If you absolutely want to stay cav your whole career (Light? Stryker? Armoured? Tank?) the only way to guarantee it would be as a National Guard officer. You can identify the unit you want to go into in advance, usually when they branch you they will follow your request unless the State is seriously short on some other branch. Once comissioned, after a while you can transfer to Big Army if you want to make a profession out of it, you won't be able to guarantee perpetual cav postings (2/3 of Armor officer slots are cav), but you will at least still wear the sabres on your collar. We had a Cadet who was a prior service 19K tanker, and a good one. The Army, in its infinite wisdom, decided it needed a Transportation Officer. Suffice to say, he was pissed. Quote:
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Last edited by Army GI; 12-04-2009 at 8:17 AM.. |
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I think I’m starting to see what you guys are talking about with respecting the rank and/or the man behind that. In my searching, those who enlist first and become officers later seem to be coveted, but this is from the internet postings, so I take it with a grain of salt. As a side note, I read somewhere these guys are referred to as “Mustangs,” does that make any sense?
And yes, I know my run time is piss poor, but I am working hard on that, I was never the best runner, and my motorcycle accident made it worse on my fitness, but I know I can at least get down to 16 minutes after more training. As of right now, I can do about 60 pushups, 70 crunches, 5 pull ups, two minutes each; and granted it’s not back to back right after the run, and I rest in between events, but this is just the beginning for me. I'm not sure about my waist, but my jeans are a 32" waist, a little snug, but doable, so that's about all I have for reference at the moment. Is it true that in the Air Force I’ll only have to run 1.5 miles, and Army 2 miles? As for updated MOS/AFSC that I should put down on my wish list, I revised the list based on my interest and the recommendations you all kindly provided. I plan on training full time until I get closer to the required PFT standards before I apply, but I’m afraid that would mean missing the Air Force deadline for OTS. I think someone said Army OCS is monthly, is that also true? Air Force 33sx - Communication and Informations Officer 13dx - Control and Recovery Officer 14nx - Intelligence Officer 71sx - Special Investigations Officer 13xx - Space and Missiles Operations Office Army 12x - Armor 25x - Signal Corp 35x - Military Intelligence I found these codes online, I may be mistaken, and I apologize if I did. I understand what you are saying about Armor, I am just partial to those Bradleys and LAVs, but this is from a civilian point of view who likes monster trucks. |
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Glad to see somebody is learning from my mistakes. Lord knows I never did. ;-)
Don't worry about the lack of prior service. Nobody is gonna care. Just learn your job well and don't be affraid to take advice when offered, or when it is obvious it is needed. People will respect your rank automatically. With luck, you'll earn their personal respect as well. It becomes second nature. When I see an officer in uniform I still call them sir, and stand up a little straighter, even if it is some 23 year old butter bar. Usually envokes a smile or two. All of those careers sound interesting, and for the most part have some pretty good transitions over to civilian life should you and your wife decide the military life is not a permanent career choice. Bear in mind after 20 years you will only be 57 years old. Given today's life expectancy, that is pretty damn young. So you'll be looking for work when your done no matter how long or short that time frame is. Still, the most important thing is getting to serve. So if it truly sounds exciting to you, put it on your list. Odds are they're will at the very least be a civilian contractor in that industry looking to hire experienced officers for management positions in whatever field you end up in. Next thing to consider is duty assignments. I can only speak for how the USAF handles this. Don't expect to be close to home. It is very rare. Korea you can't take your family (at least not on Uncle Sam's dime) same goes with assignments to the middle east, but if I remember correctly those are usually only a 2 year assignments so don't fret too badly if you get them. A lot of guys bring their wives over on their own dime to Korea, not so much with Turkey. Odds are it won't happen. Too many single guys like me volunteer for it. You have a better chance of winning the lottery. Japan or Europe are more likely, though not as likely as a stateside assignment. Vast majority of people spend their entire careers stateside, and at most get a couple temporary duty assignments (a month or two at most) overseas. For those of us who desperately wanted to serve overseas this was frustrating. Since you are from California you will like be assigned to something either on the East Cost or overseas. Divide the US in half. The computer is gonna wanna put you on the other side of that line. So pick the best places on the other side of that and make those your stateside preferences. Go ahead and put something close to home on the list, or even a couple somethings close to home. Just don't waste all your choices on stuff close to home, since it is very unlikely it will happen. I had all California bases on my list, ended up at McGuire AFB, New Jersey for my first permanent duty station, and Luke AFB, Arizona for my second. While at McGuire I was fortunate enough to get a ton of overseas temporary duty assignments, but that is very rare. This is not meant to discourage you. Getting away from home only sounds bad until you actually do it. In reality, it will be a great thing for both you and your wife. You just don't realize it yet. You and your wife will make plenty of friends...especially if you get assigned overseas. The military will provide lots of activities and events for you guys to make friends, you just have to take advantage of them. My closest friends in life, are guys I met 20 years ago in the USAF. Needless to say...I am really envious. I wish I had made this choice when I was younger. I was just too busy enjoying all the trappings of civilian life to go back into the military. In hind sight, I would do exactly what you are doing. The National Guard will still offer me a commission for another 4+ years, but I'd be a really, really, really old butter bar. Would have to drop 50lbs as well...which just gets harder and harder to do. Still, it is always in the back of my mind. Nagging at me. Last edited by tacticalcity; 12-04-2009 at 11:12 AM.. |
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Nothing wrong with being an old butter bar. I've met lots of 30-something 2LTs in the reserve. Besides, promotions to Captain are automatic and usually take 3-5 years.
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On a side note, officers who previously served in the Army had two strikes against them. Not only were they officers, but they were stupid enough to join the Army. Not saying those opinions had any basis in reality, that is just how they were viewed by their men. I personally have no problem with Army or any other branch of service. But the inter-service rivalry extends to prior service guys. Unless they were a Marine, they had better be from the same branch of service or they catch heat for it. It's not a big deal. In the end they respect your rank no matter what. It just gives them one more thing to ***** about. Personally if I were to become an officer I would have done it in either the Army or Marines. I would want to be a shooter, Intel or work investigations. I enjoyed deploying with those guys and I enjoyed the glimpse I saw of their life. So I have a lot of respect for those services. I am also fully aware of the hell I would have caught for being former Air Force. Nobody likes the guy in charge, especially when things are not going their way. There is always going to be a little bit of resentment. Never the less, there is respect as well. Last edited by tacticalcity; 12-04-2009 at 11:39 AM.. |
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If you're interested contact a Officer Accessions Recruiter because it takes time to put everything together, as well as be selected, and then shipped. All told you'll probably be another year and a half out - maybe two before actually going to OTS. If you can't pass the PT reqs in two years you won't make it in the military. I am the one who said that Army boards for OCS, not OCS itself, meet monthly (as well as ship you faster). That was a little while ago however. Quote:
Space and Missiles like I said before is really just missiles your first tour. That is, a hole in the *** end of nowhere (Minot, Maelstrom, FE Warren) with I believe 12 hour shifts and 72 hours if the silo is locked down (which happens often enough). Comm in the AF and Signal corps in the Army I hear have emphasis, which I have heard are both expanding to meet cyberwarfare demands. Each service though I imagine views cyberwarfare different with the AF taking the idea further than probably the Army. I'm not sure how to articulate it, but consider how each service views the ultimate purpose of airpower. The Marines for example wholly believe that you need control of the air but only to the extent that it is necessary to ultimately support the ground. For the AF, control of the air is everything. Services are not created equal and one will dominate cyberwarfare and the associated funding that comes with a new mission. Career advancement for this field I would be in the AF over the Army hands down. Last edited by holasrmateo; 12-04-2009 at 1:08 PM.. |
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No it really is that bad. Moving there just confirmed what I knew already. I exaggerate but states like Texas and Florida are way overrated.
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I meant the not being around your family and friends everyday and basically having to start a new life. I found that to be a major plus when I joined. Not having my father to turn to everytime I screwed up forced me to grow up. Some of the places they sent me kinda sucked compared to the Bay Area, but no matter where they sent me I could always find something to do to stay entertained. I always made new friends to hang with. Hell, I had a great time in Arizona, and on the surface it sounded terrible. And for the record...Florida rocks!
The upside to getting you away from home is it forces you to stand on your own two feet, and to take advantage of all the benifits the base offers. If you could run home to mommy every weekend...then you're not really getting the full military experience, and will probably not be as good of an Airman, Marine, Sailor or Soldier. Part of joining the military is getting away from home and forcing you to stand on your own two feet. Not everybody needs it, because not everybody has it to begin with. But for those of us who have strong family ties, the military makes ya learn to stand on your own. Last edited by tacticalcity; 12-04-2009 at 1:48 PM.. |
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I overwhelmingly disagree about Florida. The locals tell me they moved here for the beach and the weather and I have found both to be inferior to California. There are worse places in the world. Don't get me wrong. But in line to become the third largest state in a few years? The place is such an effing tourist trap that half the cities are either geriatric wards or composed of entirely non-locals (which equates to no community). There's nothing special about Florida. I can think of at least a dozen states that beat Florida in anything this state has to offer. |
#31
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Career-wise, is the Air Force a viable choice if you are not a pilot? My father was an AF Flight Surgeon, and he always said that you get little respect and even less advancement opportunity if you aren't (or were at one time) a pilot.
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My friends and family disavow all knowledge of my existence, let alone my opinions. |
#32
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However what you said depends on what you qualify as a career. If you're asking if you can be a finance officer and become a four star general then no you won't. But the length of service upon which one can retire rather than separate is 20 years. If you can make Major, thus putting you past 20, then you have yourself a career. If career advancement is the concern, then the AF isn't exactly the service I would join. If you take CENTCOM for example, the majority of the commanders are Army. The AF it would seem has become less important as there are less people to nuke and our current enemies are either too poor to fly or bury their airplanes in the sand. |
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