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  #1  
Old 05-23-2018, 8:08 PM
Califpatriot Califpatriot is offline
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Default More on the Bakersfield Farmer Charged With 12 Gun Charges

More on the Bakersfield farmer and CalGuns member arrested and charged with 12 felonies.

Based on the police report, this is what happened:

1. On April 10, 2018, Sean Provost--Special Agent with the California DOJ's Bureau of Firearms--was told by his supervisor, Special Agent Fred Frausto that on December 7, 2017, Scott submitted an electronic application via CRIS to register an assault pistol and provided multiple photos of the same. It was a fully assembled firearm with a bullet button. On the CRIS form, Scott said he did not build the firearm. Scott said it had an 8 inch barrel and shot a 300 win mag round. (The model of the lower was an SD15-ITG, which appears to be a standard AR-15 lower, so how it shoots a 300 WINMAG is a mystery.)

2. Frausto and Provost then looked at the DROS record for that serial number, which showed the pistol having been purchased in 2013 as a fully assembled and functioning firearm.

3. In November 2017, Scott went to the Bakersfield Get A Gun with the lower only, which was transferred on the DROS form as a "frame only." Get A Gun's owner confirmed to Frausto that the transfer had indeed been of the frame only.

4. The same April day, Special Agent Greg DeLa Cerda and Provost drove to Scott's house and obtained a description for it in order to obtain a search warrant, which included the ability to search any safes and seize the assault pistol, and other assault weapons, large capacity mags associated with assault weapons, and any receipts indicating sales of firearm parts associated with the assault weapons.

5. The following day, Brian McNamara, Kern County Superior Court Judge, issued the search warrant.

6. Six DOJ BOF officers went to conduct the search the residence. They were wearing body cams. They included Provost, Frausto, another Supervisor Isaias Rivera, and 3 other special agents. Scott answered the door and Provost told him that they were there to investigate the Sun Devil AR pistol he had previously attempted to register, and that he wanted to inspect it. Scott said he wouldn't do anything without his attorney present. Scott asked about the specifics of the gun; Provost said it was a Sun Devil lower chambered in 300 Winmag or 300 BO.

7. Scott states that he was recently divorced and that the weapon was purchased by him and his wife mutually and that he did a pawn return on the weapon (whatever that means) and then attempted to register it "after the one year thing" (whatever that means.) Provost asked to enter the residence but was denied. He told him that they had a search warrant and Scott complied. He agreed to help the agents locate the firearms on the premises.

8. Scott was shown the search warrant and explained his wife purchased the firearm prior to their recent divorce. Afterwards, he began registering firearms in his name.

9. He opened a case for the Sun Devil. SAS Frausto advised that in order to render the firearm safe, he had to depress the rear take down of the firearm and separate the lower and upper receivers in order to remove the magazine. Upon doing so, the firearm was rendered safe, but now met the criteria of an·assault weapon in that it had a standard magazine release button that then allowed the user to simply insert a magazine into the magazine well and remove by depressing the release mechanism. At this time, SAS Frausto closed the firearm and returned it into its original configuration, minus the magazine. As such, this firearm now met the criteria of an assault weapon in that it was a semiautomatic pistol that does not have a fixed magazine, but has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip. SAS Frausto advised a that the firearm would be seized pending review by the district attorney's office in order to determine if charges are warranted for this specific firearm.

10. They then found another assault pistol with no bullet button with a 40 round mag. It was a Noveske N4 lower, listed as being chambered in 300 win mag. Is it really possible to chamber 300 win mag in an AR-15 lower? I assume not because of the size of the round, but they listed that for both the Sun Devil lower and Noveske lower. Maybe they mean 300 BO?

11. They then went through and found a number of non-featureless ARs without bullet buttons. They had telescoping stocks, standard mag releases, pistol grips. No mention is made on whether they had the dreaded flash hiders. 8 such ARs were identified. Two of these were commie caliber rifles, with fully and partially loaded 10 and 20 round mags attached. One of these commie ARs had a slidefire stock. Some of the other rifles were chambered in 223/556 with 20, 30, and 60 round mags attached.

12. They then found 10-inch AR pistol. They initially believed it was an SBR and he was in fact booked for an SBR. But Provost later realized that because the stock was made by Shockwave Technology and designed as a pistol stabilizer, this was not an SBR. However, since it had a standard mag release, it was still an assault pistol.

13. Frausto noticed on one of the rifles carbon buildup suggestive of a silencer. Sure enough, they founda a Surefire Socom 762-RC and M4-200, and ATF paperwork for both.


14. They met with Scott, Mirandized him, and asked him if he'd be willing to speak with them. He said he'll listen to their questions. Frausto asked him if he knew they were illegal, and Scott did not respond. Frausto asked him if the desk and chair in the safe room (he had a walk in safe) was where he worked on his firearms, which Scott confirmed, and joked he was "working down the line" to make his rifles compliant. They gave him DOJ property receipts, confiscated the above rifles, and arrested him.

15. They later checked all the firearms against the registration system, and none were RAWs.

16. The 230 rounds of whatever it was was simply the ammo loaded in the mags in the confiscated firearms. Scott had a ton more guns and ammo that they didn't take during this search (whether they took it later, I have no clue.)

17. DOJ recommended manufacturing charges, but the local DA didn't bring them. The standard and high-capacity magazines did not appear to be a concern at all in the police report.


Gun owners in Kern County need to put pressure on the DA to drop the charges. Prosecutorial discretion has become a very popular concept--should work in favor of patriotic Americans, not just illegals and druggies.

Last edited by Califpatriot; 05-23-2018 at 8:10 PM.. Reason: Added Paragraphs
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Old 05-23-2018, 8:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Califpatriot View Post
SAS Frausto advised that in order to render the firearm safe, he had to depress the rear take down of the firearm and separate the lower and upper receivers in order to remove the magazine. Upon doing so, the firearm was rendered safe, but now met the criteria of an·assault weapon in that it had a standard magazine release button that then allowed the user to simply insert a magazine into the magazine well and remove by depressing the release mechanism.
Permissible per the wording of the DOJ Regs.
Quote:
At this time, SAS Frausto closed the firearm and returned it into its original configuration, minus the magazine. As such, this firearm now met the criteria of an assault weapon in that it was a semiautomatic pistol that does not have a fixed magazine, but has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip.
By closing the action without a magazine, Frausto himself "manufactured" the AW.
Quote:
17. DOJ recommended manufacturing charges, but the local DA didn't bring them. The standard and high-capacity magazines did not appear to be a concern at all in the police report.
Given that he DID purchase the pistol in 2013 and simply did a pawn-and-return in 2017, manufacturing may be the only charge that would stick.
If he can show that the 2013 and 2018 configurations are identical, then there may be no case there.

It does appear that he had a 2017-compliant magazine release, so it is curious why he attempted an AW registration.

There are some interesting holes in this account that a good attorney can drive a truck through... this could be a good test case.
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Old 05-23-2018, 8:42 PM
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Here's the problem: what's the explanation for the silencers, slidefire, and non-BB non-featureless, non-fixed mag ARs?
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Old 05-23-2018, 8:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Califpatriot View Post
Here's the problem: what's the explanation for the silencers, slidefire, and non-BB non-featureless, non-fixed mag ARs?
The "non-BB" may have already been converted to 2017-compliant (but not fitting with the definition of Frausto).
Slidefire has always been questionable... Never clearly declared as illegal, but strongly advised against mere possession by Bill Weise and Gene Hoffman.

The silencers are, of course, a problem.
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A just government will not be overthrown by force or violence because the people have no incentive to overthrow a just government. If a small minority of people attempt such an insurrection to grab power and enslave the people, the RKBA of the whole is our insurance against their success.
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Old 05-23-2018, 9:01 PM
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Sounds like this fella is up the creek without a paddle. Funny how everyone was so quick to condemn the agents and suggest it was all trumped up. Prosecutorial discretion is one thing, selective enforcement of the law is an entirely different matter and should be of concern to every citizen and will be seen as an abuse of authority and looks bad for the officer and/or the agency.
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Old 05-23-2018, 9:07 PM
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Old 05-23-2018, 9:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous_Ghost View Post
Sounds like this fella is up the creek without a paddle. Funny how everyone was so quick to condemn the agents and suggest it was all trumped up. Prosecutorial discretion is one thing, selective enforcement of the law is an entirely different matter and should be of concern to every citizen and will be seen as an abuse of authority and looks bad for the officer and/or the agency.
Well, nobody forced the officers to take jobs for CalDOJ's BOF. There's plenty of LEO jobs where you're not taking away guns from decent, law abiding folks.
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Old 05-23-2018, 9:14 PM
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So this entire thing gets rolling due to wrong caliber selected in the drop down form of the doj and the pawning and then buying back of one of their ARs?

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Old 05-23-2018, 9:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Cokebottle View Post
The "non-BB" may have already been converted to 2017-compliant (but not fitting with the definition of Frausto).
.
I assume you're referring to a patriot pin or armaglock or some fixed mag solution like that. Maybe, but the police report is entirely silent on that. Refers to "traditional magazine releases" and that's it.
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Old 05-23-2018, 9:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Strykeback View Post
So this entire thing gets rolling due to wrong caliber selected in the drop down form of the doj and the pawning and then buying back of one of their ARs?

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I don't think the caliber had anything to do with it.
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Old 05-23-2018, 9:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Califpatriot View Post
I assume you're referring to a patriot pin or armaglock or some fixed mag solution like that. Maybe, but the police report is entirely silent on that. Refers to "traditional magazine releases" and that's it.
Exactly.

To "make it safe" he had to open the action.
He then dropped the magazine, "but now met the criteria of an·assault weapon in that it had a standard magazine release button that then allowed the user to simply insert a magazine into the magazine well and remove by depressing the release mechanism"

If he HAD to open the action, then it suggests that it was fitted with a compliance device.
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Originally Posted by dantodd View Post
A just government will not be overthrown by force or violence because the people have no incentive to overthrow a just government. If a small minority of people attempt such an insurrection to grab power and enslave the people, the RKBA of the whole is our insurance against their success.
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Old 05-23-2018, 9:35 PM
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All i see is the cops went to his house to get a descriptikn of his gun. then they came back the next day with a warrant. scott had a full night to make his house legal and he failed. was it because he thought all his stuff including suppressors with atf approvals were legal or was he just a bad guy with no brains?

he has the money to minimize the issue.
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Old 05-23-2018, 9:39 PM
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he has the money to minimize the issue.
True.
We could say that we couldn't ask for a better test case.
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Originally Posted by dantodd View Post
A just government will not be overthrown by force or violence because the people have no incentive to overthrow a just government. If a small minority of people attempt such an insurrection to grab power and enslave the people, the RKBA of the whole is our insurance against their success.
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Old 05-23-2018, 9:45 PM
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So what was the basis for the search warrant?

And once they had the Sun Devil pistol in their hand, what further search was there to perform?
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Old 05-23-2018, 9:49 PM
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Not guilty, my vote

Total farce, I would donate money to fight it.
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Old 05-23-2018, 9:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiophil2 View Post
All i see is the cops went to his house to get a descriptikn of his gun. then they came back the next day with a warrant. scott had a full night to make his house legal and he failed. was it because he thought all his stuff including suppressors with atf approvals were legal or was he just a bad guy with no brains?

he has the money to minimize the issue.
From what I'm reading they went to get a description of his house. I don't think that he had any notice.
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Old 05-23-2018, 9:55 PM
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So what was the basis for the search warrant?
Pistol was transferred in 2017 as a frame only.

CFARS application reflected completed pistol build.

It is a comedy of errors, reflective of Scott attempting to comply with this state's laws.
They were married in 2013, therefore, the guns in her name were still legally his.
He executed "pawn and return" to establish him as the registrant in AFS, though it was not technically required.
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A just government will not be overthrown by force or violence because the people have no incentive to overthrow a just government. If a small minority of people attempt such an insurrection to grab power and enslave the people, the RKBA of the whole is our insurance against their success.
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Old 05-23-2018, 9:58 PM
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From what I'm reading they went to get a description of his house. I don't think that he had any notice.
oh. I misunderstood.
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Old 05-23-2018, 10:00 PM
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From what I'm reading they went to get a description of his house. I don't think that he had any notice.
Correct.
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Old 05-23-2018, 10:01 PM
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Pistol was transferred in 2017 as a frame only.
So what if he just pawned and returned only the frame?
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Old 05-23-2018, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Cokebottle View Post
Exactly.

To "make it safe" he had to open the action.
He then dropped the magazine, "but now met the criteria of an·assault weapon in that it had a standard magazine release button that then allowed the user to simply insert a magazine into the magazine well and remove by depressing the release mechanism"

If he HAD to open the action, then it suggests that it was fitted with a compliance device.
Yeah, I think you're right on the Sun Devil AR pistol. I can't tell for sure, but I don't see anything to indicate the regular ARs (16+ inch barrels) were outfitted with compliance devices.
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Old 05-23-2018, 10:08 PM
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Originally Posted by God Bless America View Post
So what if he just pawned and returned only the frame?
By assembling a frame/lower into a pistol, he created an assault weapon. For this to be true, it would require that the mag is not fixed--which Cokebottle seems to suggest is not the case, but instead Agent Frausto not understanding what a fixed mag is under the regs.

There's also an issue over whether he owned a complete AR pistol prior to end of 2016. It may be that his wife was the owner--I think Librarian needs to chip in on how community property and AR pistol rules work.
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Old 05-23-2018, 10:09 PM
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Instead of eating our own we should really be asking ourselves how B.S. these laws are in the first place?!?

I mean really....


Ooooooh he (allegedly) had AR15’s how they’re designed, with that evil magazine release and pistol grip and the dreaded flash hider and don’t even get me started on the telescoping scope and bayonet lugs which in damn near any state other than this one those are completely legal and safer than the exclusions of certain characteristics which make the weapon LESS SAFE, and cans with ATF papers this case is a fat #NothingBurger in a free state.

Might be time for some good old civil disobedience...

So does that mean that all of those brake-action style compliance parts are non-compliant?


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Old 05-23-2018, 10:12 PM
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And once they had the Sun Devil pistol in their hand, what further search was there to perform?
The search warrant allowed them to search for other assault weapons everywhere in his house and his vehicles.
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Old 05-23-2018, 10:19 PM
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Good information. Thanks for sharing.
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Old 05-23-2018, 10:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Califpatriot View Post

9. He opened a case for the Sun Devil. SAS Frausto advised that in order to render the firearm safe, he had to depress the rear take down of the firearm and separate the lower and upper receivers in order to remove the magazine.

Upon doing so, the firearm was rendered safe, but now met the criteria of an·assault weapon in that it had a standard magazine release button that then allowed the user to simply insert a magazine into the magazine well

and remove by depressing the release mechanism.

At this time, SAS Frausto closed the firearm and returned it into its original configuration, minus the magazine.

As such, this firearm now met the criteria of an assault weapon in that it was a semiautomatic pistol that does not have a fixed magazine, but has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip.

SAS Frausto advised a that the firearm would be seized pending review by the district attorney's office in order to determine if charges are warranted for this specific firearm.
I'm going to pick on those words in bold.

Several years ago a LE friend told me to always keep an empty magazine in my bb'd rifle. His reason was that if a mag was already in it, it meets "his" definition of being a "fixed" mag rifle, which made it legal.

Any LE can interpret this differently, and lets face it there are little consequences for them being wrong with something like this!

so, if it didn't have a mag in it, then it could meet the definition of "readily accept a magazine", which could be considered an assault weapon.

I know, sounds stupid but if you think about it it could be enough to get you in trouble.

We all know these laws have become so complicated that it's hard to keep track of them, however, you have to stay legal. In this case, his world is turned upside down!

Stay legal!
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Old 05-23-2018, 10:53 PM
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Seems like these guys don't understand that DES/CRIS has an option for .300 caliber, and doesn't distinguish between .300 aac/blackout and /300 win mag (or many other unlisted 30 cal chamberings)

Also, this whole "capacity to accept a detachable magazine" BS has been settled, and published multiple times. Empty mag wells do not negate Bullet Buttons or Juggernaut Hellfighters.

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Old 05-23-2018, 11:30 PM
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Originally Posted by smittty View Post
I'm going to pick on those words in bold.

Several years ago a LE friend told me to always keep an empty magazine in my bb'd rifle. His reason was that if a mag was already in it, it meets "his" definition of being a "fixed" mag rifle, which made it legal.

Any LE can interpret this differently, and lets face it there are little consequences for them being wrong with something like this!

so, if it didn't have a mag in it, then it could meet the definition of "readily accept a magazine", which could be considered an assault weapon.

I know, sounds stupid but if you think about it it could be enough to get you in trouble.

We all know these laws have become so complicated that it's hard to keep track of them, however, you have to stay legal. In this case, his world is turned upside down!

Stay legal!
frausto was focusing on the wrong words. A removable mag is fixed so long as it can't be removed with the action closed. Probably doesn't matter in the big scheme of things
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Old 05-24-2018, 1:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Califpatriot View Post

9. He opened a case for the Sun Devil. SAS Frausto advised that in order to render the firearm safe, he had to depress the rear take down of the firearm and separate the lower and upper receivers in order to remove the magazine. Upon doing so, the firearm was rendered safe, but now met the criteria of an·assault weapon in that it had a standard magazine release button that then allowed the user to simply insert a magazine into the magazine well and remove by depressing the release mechanism. At this time, SAS Frausto closed the firearm and returned it into its original configuration, minus the magazine. As such, this firearm now met the criteria of an assault weapon in that it was a semiautomatic pistol that does not have a fixed magazine, but has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip. SAS Frausto advised a that the firearm would be seized pending review by the district attorney's office in order to determine if charges are warranted for this specific firearm.
To me, it sounds like he may have had a Franklin Armory DFM mag installed. The officer removed it after separating the two halves and turned it into an assault weapon himself after reattaching the two halves back together again.
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Old 05-24-2018, 4:46 AM
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Originally Posted by lwbyo1 View Post
To me, it sounds like he may have had a Franklin Armory DFM mag installed. The officer removed it after separating the two halves and turned it into an assault weapon himself after reattaching the two halves back together again.
Hopefully it was legal before the officer touched it.

Point is, don’t get yourself into a situation that could allow a story like this to happen.

Even if you’re innocent, you’re stuck with the legal headache and attorney costs.

Like was said earlier, make sure your house is in order.
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Old 05-24-2018, 5:02 AM
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What a **** show. Remove non-compliant mags from the premises.

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Old 05-24-2018, 5:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Califpatriot View Post
By assembling a frame/lower into a pistol, he created an assault weapon. For this to be true, it would require that the mag is not fixed--which Cokebottle seems to suggest is not the case, but instead Agent Frausto not understanding what a fixed mag is under the regs.

There's also an issue over whether he owned a complete AR pistol prior to end of 2016. It may be that his wife was the owner--I think Librarian needs to chip in on how community property and AR pistol rules work.
Oops I spaced on the 2016/2017 thing. The 2017 stripped xfer was the flag.
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Old 05-24-2018, 5:39 AM
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What a **** show. Remove non-compliant mags from the premises.

.
Or get one of these and make them legal. It's cheaper than a lawyer.

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Old 05-24-2018, 5:59 AM
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The mags weren't an issue at all fwiw
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Old 05-24-2018, 6:15 AM
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That guy is f'd

CADOJ and law enforcement wouldnt miss a chance in the world to make an example out of him
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Old 05-24-2018, 6:44 AM
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12. They then found 10-inch AR pistol. They initially believed it was an SBR and he was in fact booked for an SBR. But Provost later realized that because the stock was made by Shockwave Technology and designed as a pistol stabilizer, this was not an SBR. However, since it had a standard mag release, it was still an assault pistol.
Another example of the DOJ acknowledging the legitimacy of Arm Braces.

Sounds like this guy was skirting around the law & trying to be cleaver. Even one of his prior threads seem to prove this. And it all started with trying to register a lower DROS'd to him after 2016.

So as stated in another thread, it doesn't sound like he had a "approved and registered" AW letter on this firearm. I'm pretty sure no one is getting AW approval letters on "questionable" AW's. After all, that's part of the "approval" process. My two Cheek rest pistols took longer than others, as they we're probably determining the legality of such devices. The DOJ seems to be scrutinizing these registrations fairly well before handing out "approval" letters.
Although it doesn't mean they can't change there mind on things.
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Old 05-24-2018, 7:01 AM
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Quote:
9. He opened a case for the Sun Devil. SAS Frausto advised that in order to render the firearm safe, he had to depress the rear take down of the firearm and separate the lower and upper receivers in order to remove the magazine. Upon doing so, the firearm was rendered safe, but now met the criteria of an·assault weapon in that it had a standard magazine release button that then allowed the user to simply insert a magazine into the magazine well and remove by depressing the release mechanism. At this time, SAS Frausto closed the firearm and returned it into its original configuration, minus the magazine. As such, this firearm now met the criteria of an assault weapon in that it was a semiautomatic pistol that does not have a fixed magazine, but has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip. SAS Frausto advised a that the firearm would be seized pending review by the district attorney's office in order to determine if charges are warranted for this specific firearm.
This is the most disturbing part.. so the DOJ agent created the "assault weapon" which gave them the probable cause to search further.

Hmm.. guy needs a really good lawyer that can go for the "fruit of the poisoned tree" deal or he's really screwed.
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Old 05-24-2018, 7:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Steve1968LS2 View Post
This is the most disturbing part.. so the DOJ agent created the "assault weapon" which gave them the probable cause to search further.

Hmm.. guy needs a really good lawyer that can go for the "fruit of the poisoned tree" deal or he's really screwed.
No, judge McNamara issued a search warrant before they ever entered his house that allowed them to search for all AWs, not just the AR pistol that led to all this
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Old 05-24-2018, 7:34 AM
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This is what it sounds like to me.


Guy has .300BO pistol that he owned in 2013 as a complete ar pistol with a BB.
In 2016 he pawned it and did a lawn return after 2017.

He attempted to register the gun with a BB

DOJ noticed this gun was transferred after 2016 from the own return and went to his etc, got the search warrant etc.

Upon inspection of the gun, a DFM magazine was inside. After opening the action and removing the DFM, the doj noticed it had a standard mag release.

Upon inspection of other firearms, they also had standard mag releases.

My bet is he only had one DFM magazine that he intended to share with the other rifles as he took them out and never expected anyone had any reason to have a search warrant for his firearms until he figures out which complaint device he wanted to use for each gun.

Doj nabbs him for 9 assault weapon charges

Doj also finds the suppressors with paperwork (still a no-no in CA)

One of the rifles has a slide fire stick and they add the MBTA charge as well


** my assumptions are made on two things : 1) it was a DFM because his other listing showed an AR10 pistol with a DFM and 2) it’s the only way a standard mag release works when the magazine is removed

There will be plea deals and dropped charges in this thing so don’t expect it to come out with answers.. I think they will drop the first charge where the doj agent made him pull out the DFM but will negotiate bargains on the other 8 AW charges. They will attempt to prosecute to the full extent of the law on the suppressors. And the mbta is a toss up because they both have a lot to lose if it goes the wrong way
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Old 05-24-2018, 7:57 AM
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The receiver was DROS'd as a frame. There are no circumstances in California that would allow that frame to be assembled into a pistol. (maybe if you were exempt from the roster)
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