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Calguns Concealed Carry County Information Forum Information on how to get a LTC in yourCounty

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  #81  
Old 01-04-2019, 7:23 PM
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Originally Posted by sfpcservice View Post
Snap! Has a calgunner applied using "self protection" to this county?
I live in Marin and had my life threatened in writing by the ex husband of a woman I dated, stating he would kill me some day.

I took the letter to the police and they have a copy.

Alas I am moving to Washington in less than 1 month.
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Last edited by UberPatriot; 01-04-2019 at 7:46 PM..
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  #82  
Old 01-05-2019, 7:28 AM
Robotron2k84 Robotron2k84 is offline
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Originally Posted by Paladin View Post
I can't find any CCW info on their website: https://www.marinsheriff.org/ Where did you get their policy? Is that policy still current (in 2019 vs 2014 when you posted this)? Can you post the exact language used re. what I bolded?

FWIW, no, I don't live in Marin Co either....
It's their stated policy and they will tell you when you meet with the Undersheriff. As long as Doyle is there, the policy won't change. Same in 2019 as 2018.

The only thing they have on the website is the standard DOJ app:

https://www.marinsheriff.org/assets/...ds/ccw_app.pdf

Last edited by Robotron2k84; 01-05-2019 at 7:35 AM.. Reason: Added link
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  #83  
Old 01-05-2019, 8:53 AM
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It's their stated policy and they will tell you when you meet with the Undersheriff. As long as Doyle is there, the policy won't change. Same in 2019 as 2018.
So, they don't give you a copy of their CCW Policy? Did you ASK for a copy?

Are there ANY Marin Co CGNers who aren't broke, financially and emotionally, and who want to try to improve things in Marin Co???

Yet once again, I don't even live in Marin Co....
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Last edited by Paladin; 01-05-2019 at 8:56 AM..
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  #84  
Old 01-05-2019, 11:25 AM
Robotron2k84 Robotron2k84 is offline
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I did not ask for their policy in writing. As I've said in the past, the initial meeting is not recorded and is advisory. If you choose to have a determination made by the sheriff, it will be on file, a record created for you and if you are denied, (99.9% likely, given the sheriff in question), it will go into your record that will be reviewed at any subsequent application.

In addition you now get to claim a recorded denial on your out of state renewal applications. Which may or may not be a problem depending on the jurisdiction.

For those of us that have OOS permits and live in Marin, it's a real problem.
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  #85  
Old 01-05-2019, 11:52 AM
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I did not ask for their policy in writing. As I've said in the past, the initial meeting is not recorded and is advisory.
So that could all be BS he made up, just to make it seem like no one applies and to keep the denial rate down, right?

Anyone in Marin Co ever think of dropping by the SO and getting a copy of their CCW policy in writing??? This ain't rocket science, folks, and they won't cut off your balls and stuff them down your throat if you ask or use a Public Records Act (PRA) request to force them to give you a copy. Anyone ever think of doing that??? Once again, I don't live in Marin Co. What are you guys DOING???

Evil thrives in the dark....

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Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 View Post
If you choose to have a determination made by the sheriff, it will be on file, a record created for you and if you are denied, (99.9% likely, given the sheriff in question), it will go into your record that will be reviewed at any subsequent application.
"Oh, no! I'm sooo scared! I was denied because I lacked Good Cause. I'm marked for life..."

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In addition you now get to claim a recorded denial on your out of state renewal applications. Which may or may not be a problem depending on the jurisdiction.
Really? It doesn't matter what the reason for the denial was?

Maybe I'm wrong, but I've got a hunch that since 42 out of 50 states are Shall Issue, if the denial was only for lack of GC (vs criminal record -- lack of GMC), that might matter when the applicant is from 1 of the 8 May Issue states.

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Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 View Post
For those of us that have OOS permits and live in Marin, it's a real problem.
Maybe. Maybe not.... Marking the box is not a problem. The question is what effect it has on your OOS app (for a SI state?), and so far, that's speculative.
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Last edited by Paladin; 01-05-2019 at 12:01 PM..
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  #86  
Old 01-05-2019, 12:01 PM
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I believe that Utah will deny based on a previous denial. I'm not going to risk it, however. Whatever the documentation you can get, Doyle is a hardcore anti and will not issue to non-LE.

I can't see what any documentation adventure accomplishes. The sole decision is in the hands of Doyle and his record is well known. There is literally zero chance you will be approved while he remains in office.

I'll be retiring to AK in five years. So it's not something I'm gung-ho on fighting at this time.

Last edited by Robotron2k84; 01-05-2019 at 12:08 PM..
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  #87  
Old 01-05-2019, 12:04 PM
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I believe that Utah will deny based on a previous denial. I'm not going to risk it, however.
Based upon what? Where does a UT state webpage say a mere prior denial is dispositive? Or is that internet FUD (fear, uncertainty, doubt)?
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  #88  
Old 01-05-2019, 12:16 PM
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Advice from my CCW instructor who handled Utah classes and kept track of his students. Beyond that, I don't have firsthand information.
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  #89  
Old 01-05-2019, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 View Post
Whatever the documentation you can get, Doyle is a hardcore anti and will not issue to non-LE.
Let's get it in writing and spread it around so whoever runs against him or for his open seat can use it during campaigning or we can use it to question them during the campaign.

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I can't see what any documentation adventure accomplishes.
First step is knowing what you're dealing with, rather than relying upon rumor and speculation.

For example: Are there any CGNers in Marin Co who've applied for a SO CCW within the past 3 years who've used more than mere "self-defense" as GC? If so, how'd it go? What was your GC like?

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Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 View Post
The sole decision is in the hands of Doyle
Yeah, that's by state law and applies to ALL CLEOs that issue.

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Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 View Post
and his record is well known. There is literally zero chance you will be approved while he remains in office.
Again, based upon what? FUD?

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Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 View Post
I'll be retiring to AK in five years. So it's not something I'm gung-ho on fighting at this time.
I say kick 'em in the balls on your way out.

Everyone wants a CA CCW and everyone wants someone else to make it possible. Life doesn't work that way.
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Last edited by Paladin; 01-05-2019 at 12:23 PM..
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  #90  
Old 01-05-2019, 12:26 PM
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You are just as free as anyone on this forum to file a PRA request. I've lived here a quarter century and know the area is highly anti-gun, probably second only to SF in the state. When my tenure in the Bay Area ends I'm moving to free America and the retardation in Marin can consume 100% of the oxygen for I'll I care.
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  #91  
Old 01-05-2019, 1:14 PM
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You are just as free as anyone on this forum to file a PRA request.
"Someone else should do it."

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Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 View Post
When my tenure in the Bay Area ends I'm moving to free America and the retardation in Marin can consume 100% of the oxygen for I'll I care.
"I was afraid when I lived here. I don't care now that I'm planning to leave...."

CGNers....
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  #92  
Old 01-05-2019, 1:48 PM
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My personal choice to leave CA / Marin has nothing to do with CCW in Marin, but feel free to think so.

In the grand scheme, getting my CCW here is pretty low on the list, and if I wanted it badly enough I would relocate to a more friendly county. You, nor anyone else is likely to succeed in your quest to turn Marin green. It's the heart of Anti territory and there simply aren't enough who want it to matter.

So, I can tilt at windmills for your pleasure and risk my OOS permits, or hang tight until I leave and get an AK permit that is good in 30+ states.

It's not a tough call. I'm sorry you feel disappointed. I've already been through the CCW process in Marin and tilting at windmills is an accurate description.
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  #93  
Old 03-26-2019, 5:48 PM
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Edit: This post was in response to one by Paladin that has since been deleted. My post shall remain for posterity.

So, 53 people over a near 20-year span applied. 12, less than one per year, didn't listen to the undersheriff and submitted their app anyway and were denied. While, 41 LEO or similar were approved.

This confirms what I have already told you and posted in this thread about numbers, disposition and chances for success. If you are not in some form of LE position, or tangentially associated, you will not be approved. 12 people thought otherwise and ignored the undersheriff telling them what the outcome would be.

That works out to 2.65 applications or renewals submitted to the sheriff per year, with 2.05 approvals per year avg. for the protected class.

Do you see now why it's futile with this sheriff? 0.6 apps per year from normal folks as submitted is nearly zero compared to Sac., SD and virtually any other county. No one here really cares about it, there is no groundswell of applicants that would support a pro-CCW sheriff candidate.

Even assuming a 10:1 ratio of withdrawn apps to submitted and denied ones, it's still next to zero for all intents.

Last edited by Robotron2k84; 03-26-2019 at 8:04 PM..
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  #94  
Old 03-28-2019, 7:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 View Post
My personal choice to leave CA / Marin has nothing to do with CCW in Marin, but feel free to think so.
I never said or implied it did.

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Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 View Post
You, nor anyone else is likely to succeed in your quest to turn Marin green. It's the heart of Anti territory and there simply aren't enough who want it to matter.
Please provide a quote where I said my quest was to turn Marin "green."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 View Post
So, I can tilt at windmills for your pleasure and risk my OOS permits, or hang tight until I leave and get an AK permit that is good in 30+ states.

It's not a tough call. I'm sorry you feel disappointed. I've already been through the CCW process in Marin and tilting at windmills is an accurate description.
Delusional much?

Why are you even replying to my posts then? Except where I've quoted you, they're not direct to you but to all CGNers in Marin Co. With the amount of effort you've spent in snide replies, you could have emailed your OOS instructor, asked them if a denial for insufficient GC would hurt your OOS permit chances and asked them upon what they based their opinion upon. But no....

Whatever dude.
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Last edited by Paladin; 03-28-2019 at 8:15 PM..
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  #95  
Old 03-28-2019, 8:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 View Post
Edit: This post was in response to one by Paladin that has since been deleted. My post shall remain for posterity.
My post #79 shall remain for posterity.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 View Post
So, 53 people over a near 20-year span applied. 12, less than one per year, didn't listen to the undersheriff and submitted their app anyway and were denied. While, 41 LEO or similar were approved.

This confirms what I have already told you and posted in this thread about numbers, disposition and chances for success. If you are not in some form of LE position, or tangentially associated, you will not be approved. 12 people thought otherwise and ignored the undersheriff telling them what the outcome would be.
This is not directed to Robotron: Sounds like LA Co under McDonnell. If people aren't willing to challenge them in court, nothing will change. Doyle could be easily schooled on discriminating by group membership using Salute v. Pitchess (https://law.justia.com/cases/califor...3d/61/557.html) and Guillory v. County of Orange (https://www.leagle.com/decision/19842110731f2d137911910) (14th A EP clause). I would think there were some wealthy gun owners in Marin Co willing to fight in the courts. But maybe not.

Heck, you aren't willing to ask for a copy of their written CCW policy (a state law requirement). If they refuse, you could file a PRA request. If they refuse that, you could ask a state judge for a writ of mandamus, ordering the sheriff's office to obey state law and give you a copy. Like I said before, "kick 'em in the balls." Maybe there's someone else in Marin Co willing to do that. (I don't live in Marin Co.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 View Post
Do you see now why it's futile with this sheriff? 0.6 apps per year from normal folks as submitted is nearly zero compared to Sac., SD and virtually any other county. No one here really cares about it, there is no groundswell of applicants that would support a pro-CCW sheriff candidate
This is not directed to Robotron: Doyle will be ~74 yo at next election. He may not run again. Younger CLEOs, who went through training after the Shall Issue movement, are generally better, as seen in Sonoma Co with Essick and, it's beginning to appear, as in Yolo Co with Lopez.

Hopefully, SCOTUS will give us a Carry win within 2 years. But in case we don't, why not start fighting now? (This is not directed to Robotron.)
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Last edited by Paladin; 03-28-2019 at 9:25 PM.. Reason: added links to Salute and Guillory cases
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  #96  
Old 04-02-2019, 12:25 AM
Robotron2k84 Robotron2k84 is offline
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Undersheriff Ridgway retired. New undersheriff is prior LT. Doyle no plans to retire after current term.

Here's your policy doc:

https://www.marinsheriff.org/assets/.../ADM-01-01.pdf

Peace out.
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