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  #1  
Old 07-14-2019, 8:56 PM
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Default Livermore range

// Talking about Livermore Rod and Gun Club, https://lprg.org/
//
// Librarian


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gowking View Post
I would imagine they will have something similar to Livermore.
Livermore requires standing for pistol and sitting for rifles/large caliber. It's only 40 lanes total with 11 pistol and 29 combo. I think the last eight or so years they were required to lower the range side ceiling due to the damage to ranch land on the other side of the hill. Plenty of clowns still hit the steel awning regardless...but it keeps the lead on range.

Looks like it's much larger and will accommodate plenty if they aim to. It also looks like they won't have any extended length lanes and I could really use some 200yd practice.
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  #2  
Old 07-14-2019, 9:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Gowking View Post
I would imagine they will have something similar to Livermore.
So movable...shoot 25, 50, 75, 100 all from the same bench; just move the target holder.
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Old 07-15-2019, 6:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Swagman00 View Post
Livermore requires standing for pistol and sitting for rifles/large caliber. It's only 40 lanes total with 11 pistol and 29 combo. Withink the last eight or so years they were required to lower the rage side ceiling due to the damage to ranch land on the other side. Plenty of clowns still hit the steel awning regardless...but it keeps the lead on range.

Looks like it's much larger and will accommodate plenty if they aim to. It also looks like they won't have any extended length lanes and I could really use some 200yd practice.
And at Livermore if you shoot pistol standing then want to shoot rifle you gotta pay again. USI better not do that. It was great at USI paying and being able to shoot both sides.
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Old 07-15-2019, 9:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Psychbiker View Post
And at Livermore if you shoot pistol standing then want to shoot rifle you gotta pay again. USI better not do that. It was great at USI paying and being able to shoot both sides.
You cant be serious. I was willing to give them another chance soon to develop some non lead hunting rounds but not now.
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Old 07-15-2019, 8:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Psychbiker View Post
And at Livermore if you shoot pistol standing then want to shoot rifle you gotta pay again. USI better not do that. It was great at USI paying and being able to shoot both sides.
They must not like you because I shoot there all the time and move between rifle and pistol every time with a one time fee of $20.
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Old 07-15-2019, 9:47 PM
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They must not like you because I shoot there all the time and move between rifle and pistol every time with a one time fee of $20.
Not on the weekends or busy times. Says on their website.
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Old 07-16-2019, 9:13 AM
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My son and I were just at Livermore & shot both sides, one charge...
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Old 07-16-2019, 11:18 AM
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So if it's on their webpage and some people don't get charged for both pistol and rifle, is it a "goodguy" discount?
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Old 07-16-2019, 6:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Tractionavant View Post
My son and I were just at Livermore & shot both sides, one charge...
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Originally Posted by jtv3062 View Post
So if it's on their webpage and some people don't get charged for both pistol and rifle, is it a "goodguy" discount?
Got lucky . . . because someone failed to make them pay the additional fee.
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Old 07-16-2019, 8:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Tractionavant View Post
My son and I were just at Livermore & shot both sides, one charge...
You didn't get lucky. That is how Livermore works. You just need to let the cashier know when you want to switch sides so he/she can keep track of available lanes and assign a new one to you. If they don't have a wait you can shoot there, on both sides, all day for the one fee.
.
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Old 07-17-2019, 9:56 AM
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Originally Posted by BrassCase View Post
You didn't get lucky. That is how Livermore works. You just need to let the cashier know when you want to switch sides so he/she can keep track of available lanes and assign a new one to you. If they don't have a wait you can shoot there, on both sides, all day for the one fee.
.
The following is taken directly from Livermore's website here: https://lprg.org/ranges/pistol-rifle-range/

"Modern Rifle and Pistol Ranges

We now have 2 ranges open which offer a safe place to enjoy shooting your firearm and hone your marksmanship skills.
The two ranges, a Pistol Only range and a Combination range are treated as independent ranges When you sign in you will be asked to choose which range you wish to shoot on.

At busy periods we restrict range to 2 hours – if you wish to shoot both ranges you will incur 2 charges but you will be able to shoot for 2 hours on each range."

So, does this mean they only charge the additional fee for changing sides when it's "busy" (whatever that means) or does the charge apply whenever you want to change sides?
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  #12  
Old 07-17-2019, 12:11 PM
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As an RSO at Livermore, I can say that we haven't enforced the 2 hour time limit in the last 2 years. Nor, in that time, have we charged a second fee to switch from one side of the range to the other, despite what it says on the website. When USI and then Chabot closed down, Livermore was so overwhelmed with new shooters that there were often 20 to 30 people on wait lists to get a lane. Time limits and not allowing people to jump from one range to the other ahead of others waiting for lanes were implemented to try to accommodate the large number of shooters. For whatever reason, a lot of people aren't shooting as much now as back then and there is not currently a need for those limitations.
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  #13  
Old 07-17-2019, 1:00 PM
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Originally Posted by mlgs00 View Post
As an RSO at Livermore, I can say that we haven't enforced the 2 hour time limit in the last 2 years. Nor, in that time, have we charged a second fee to switch from one side of the range to the other, despite what it says on the website. When USI and then Chabot closed down, Livermore was so overwhelmed with new shooters that there were often 20 to 30 people on wait lists to get a lane. Time limits and not allowing people to jump from one range to the other ahead of others waiting for lanes were implemented to try to accommodate the large number of shooters. For whatever reason, a lot of people aren't shooting as much now as back then and there is not currently a need for those limitations.
Glad to hear. Charging people per side was always a bad choice.
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Old 07-17-2019, 1:42 PM
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Originally Posted by sgt1372 View Post
The following is taken directly from Livermore's website here: https://lprg.org/ranges/pistol-rifle-range/

"Modern Rifle and Pistol Ranges

We now have 2 ranges open which offer a safe place to enjoy shooting your firearm and hone your marksmanship skills.
The two ranges, a Pistol Only range and a Combination range are treated as independent ranges When you sign in you will be asked to choose which range you wish to shoot on.

At busy periods we restrict range to 2 hours Ė if you wish to shoot both ranges you will incur 2 charges but you will be able to shoot for 2 hours on each range."

So, does this mean they only charge the additional fee for changing sides when it's "busy" (whatever that means) or does the charge apply whenever you want to change sides?
Well, if you don't believe us come out on a Friday when I RSO, introduce yourself and have a fun day shooting with us.
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  #15  
Old 07-18-2019, 5:07 AM
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Originally Posted by mlgs00 View Post
For whatever reason, a lot of people aren't shooting as much now as back then and there is not currently a need for those limitations.
Are you still getting same rate of first time or new shooters that are signing up or has that dropped off as well?
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Old 07-18-2019, 8:08 AM
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Are you still getting same rate of first time or new shooters that are signing up or has that dropped off as well?
Our business picked up tremendously after USI closed and some again with Chabot closing. We did have waits on Saturday and Sunday mornings before both the other ranges closed, we had 29 shooting lanes that were combination rifle/pistol. Now we have the 29 lanes plus an additional 12 for standing pistol. Business was off last year and even off more this year. The peak was probably 2017. We brought the other 12 pistol lanes on line in response to the USI closing to help alleviate the wait, that was our youth shooting area.

Most of the people that I talk with at the range that are confused are the more casual shooters who don't have time, knowledge or concern to keep up with the news on the gun laws. They just hear the headlines and think they can't buy ammo or that the gun they have is illegal or might be so they stay home.

Just look at the number of gun stores that have been closing up!
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Old 07-18-2019, 8:53 AM
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Originally Posted by mlgs00 View Post
As an RSO at Livermore, I can say that we haven't enforced the 2 hour time limit in the last 2 years. Nor, in that time, have we charged a second fee to switch from one side of the range to the other, despite what it says on the website.
If so, I suggest that you remove the quoted language from your website.
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Old 07-18-2019, 3:00 PM
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Originally Posted by sgt1372 View Post
If so, I suggest that you remove the quoted language from your website.
We keep it as a fallback in case we need it.
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Old 07-18-2019, 3:15 PM
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Originally Posted by BrassCase View Post
We keep it as a fallback in case we need it.
Then, don't object when people think that you will charge another fee if you change sides.

If you want to retain the option, you should at least modify the quoted language to say something, like:

"At busy periods we restrict range to 2 hours – if you wish to shoot both ranges you MAY incur 2 charges BASED ON OUR SOLE DISCRETION, IF WE IN OUR WISDOM THINK THAT THE CIRCUMSTANCES JUSTIFY IT but you will be able to shoot for 2 hours on each range."

Suggested edits listed in caps & bold.
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Old 07-19-2019, 2:47 PM
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Some people complain about Livermore. We've been coming here since USI closed and have never had an issue. Granted we usually come on tuesdays so less crowded than the week-ends but still busy. The Gal in the office always has a big smile, the RSO's are great. The RSO's will watch my son for a few minutes & then when they see he knows what he doing they go back to keeping an eye on the idiots. I like the fact that they run a tight ship
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Old 07-19-2019, 4:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Tractionavant View Post
Some people complain about Livermore. We've been coming here since USI closed and have never had an issue. Granted we usually come on tuesdays so less crowded than the week-ends but still busy. The Gal in the office always has a big smile, the RSO's are great. The RSO's will watch my son for a few minutes & then when they see he knows what he doing they go back to keeping an eye on the idiots. I like the fact that they run a tight ship
Livermore is still my favorite, although I haven't been in a very long time. It's a much longer drive from Martinez vs. Dublin. I can get in more shooting at Dublin too and they also allow double-taps and limited rapid fire (no mag dumps).

I've always had great experiences with the RSO's and the staff at Livermore. For the most part, the shooters at Livermore seem a bit better too, although you still run into some very new shooters. I try to extend some kindness and try to chat with them a bit.

Pretty much the same experience at Dublin, but the RSO's are almost non-existent until one of the target hangers breaks. They're too busy keeping the check-in moving. The shooters do tend to be more 1st timers who rent and I'm always cautious. Same as at Livermore, I'll try to chat with them a bit. Always keep a wary eye on them though no matter where you're shooting.

It will be great once USI opens again. Also, good to hear that Livermore isn't a complete zoo. Maybe I'll head out there again one of these days.
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Old 07-19-2019, 7:49 PM
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As an RSO at Livermore, I can say that we haven't enforced the 2 hour time limit in the last 2 years. Nor, in that time, have we charged a second fee to switch from one side of the range to the other, despite what it says on the website. When USI and then Chabot closed down, Livermore was so overwhelmed with new shooters that there were often 20 to 30 people on wait lists to get a lane. Time limits and not allowing people to jump from one range to the other ahead of others waiting for lanes were implemented to try to accommodate the large number of shooters. For whatever reason, a lot of people aren't shooting as much now as back then and there is not currently a need for those limitations.
So why can you not walk in (to whatever spot they give you) with a gun in a LOCKED case unless its during a cease fire period? My group of friends and I stopped going pretty much because of this. Seriously, if I just go to my bench, drop my stuff off/set up and wait there until a cease fire to go post targets what is the big deal with that?
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Old 07-19-2019, 8:06 PM
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My group of friends and I stopped going pretty much because of this. Seriously, if I just go to my bench, drop my stuff off/set up and wait there until a cease fire to go post targets what is the big deal with that?
Agreed, I'm located in Livermore and stopped going to that range several years ago. Too many odd restrictions and irritations for the cost. Better experience driving a bit further and supporting a friendlier place.
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Old 07-19-2019, 9:52 PM
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Agreed, I'm located in Livermore and stopped going to that range several years ago. Too many odd restrictions and irritations for the cost. Better experience driving a bit further and supporting a friendlier place.
Where do you go to now?
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Old 07-19-2019, 10:31 PM
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Agreed, I'm located in Livermore and stopped going to that range several years ago. Too many odd restrictions and irritations for the cost. Better experience driving a bit further and supporting a friendlier place.
Ditto.

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Where do you go to now?
My "favorite" range is now in Linden and have to go far out of my way to get there for rifle shooting at 50/100/200 yards but their pistol range sucks. For pistol shooting, I go to Tracy.

I'll go to Livermore ONLY if I need to zero a new scope on a rifle and don't have the time to go to Linden. Otherwise, I refuse to shoot at Livermore anymore. Just not worth the dealing w/the "attitude" of certain RSOs who are a real PITA, their "unique" rules and the general aggravation and discomfort that I feel when ever I shoot there.

BTW, FYI, I've been shooting for over 30 years in the SF Bay Area and have shot pretty much everywhere (still open and now closed) over those years from SJ to Sacramento and, based on this experience, Livermore is the LEAST favorite PUBLIC place that I've ever shot a handgun, rifle or shotgun at in all of those years, as compared w/the following, including but not limited to and in no particular order: the old USI, Richmond, San Leandro, Coyote Park in San Mateo, Linden, Sac Valley, Reeds, Target Masters, Jackson Arms, GFOS in Dublin, Ammo Supply in Vacaville, Chabot, Metcalf, Sharp Park, Tracy, The Gun Range in Sac, The Sacramento Gun Club and The Gun Room in Galt, the Martinez Gun Club, Bird's Landing and the Coyote Valley Sporting Clays in Morgan Hill.

So, I do have a reasonable basis of comparison to make my judgment about Livermore.

I hope to cut my travel time by going back to USI when the rifle/pistol ranges reopen and, if they are managed the way they were before the closure, I should not have to travel all the way out to Linden/Tracy to shoot anymore.

Got my fingers crossed for that.
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Old 07-20-2019, 12:28 AM
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They donít call them Livermorons for nothing...
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Old 07-20-2019, 1:06 AM
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So why can you not walk in (to whatever spot they give you) with a gun in a LOCKED case unless its during a cease fire period? My group of friends and I stopped going pretty much because of this. Seriously, if I just go to my bench, drop my stuff off/set up and wait there until a cease fire to go post targets what is the big deal with that?
?

When itís a cease fire you canít approach the benches nor enter nor leave the range. Basic range safety.

If itís live fire time, thatís when you can walk over to your assigned spot, uncase and setup for the cease fire.

ó Michael
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Old 07-20-2019, 4:14 AM
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They donít call them Livermorons for nothing...
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Old 07-20-2019, 4:40 AM
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Originally Posted by mlgs00 View Post
As an RSO at Livermore, I can say that we haven't enforced the 2 hour time limit in the last 2 years. Nor, in that time, have we charged a second fee to switch from one side of the range to the other, despite what it says on the website. When USI and then Chabot closed down, Livermore was so overwhelmed with new shooters that there were often 20 to 30 people on wait lists to get a lane. Time limits and not allowing people to jump from one range to the other ahead of others waiting for lanes were implemented to try to accommodate the large number of shooters. For whatever reason, a lot of people aren't shooting as much now as back then and there is not currently a need for those limitations.
Thanks for being an RSO!

Agree, have never been charged to switch lanes at Livermore, and never have had the 2 hour time limit enforced (and i've definitely been there for more than 2 hours in one lane before).

It does get very backed up at times, with wait times.
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Old 07-20-2019, 5:26 AM
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?

When itís a cease fire you canít approach the benches nor enter nor leave the range. Basic range safety.

If itís live fire time, thatís when you can walk over to your assigned spot, uncase and setup for the cease fire.

ó Michael
I believe he is asking why he cant do what you are saying.
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Old 07-20-2019, 7:14 AM
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?

When it’s a cease fire you can’t approach the benches nor enter nor leave the range. Basic range safety.

If it’s live fire time, that’s when you can walk over to your assigned spot, uncase and setup for the cease fire.

— Michael
I, like others above, have been to most of the other ranges in a 100ish mile area. I'm at the point that I have separated rifle, pistol, and shotgun into different disciplines and I pretty much stick to the Sacramento Gun Club (I really like this place) for pistol, the Stockton Trap and Skeet Club for shotgun (I really like this place too), and Sac Valley for Rifle (was a member for 3 years, story for another time), Tracy use to be good and I will go there occasionally with friends.

I don't think you understood my statement/ question. I do not understand their logic behind walking in and out of the range. During a cease fire as long as you are behind the firing line and not handling firearms or touching the bench during a cease fire period I do not understand why I cant walk in and out with spotting scopes, LOCKED gun cases, toolboxes, whatever, and sit with them behind the firing line. During an active fire period (or whatever term you want to use) I do not understand why I can't walk in and out, set up my stuff at the bench they assigned and then wait with a target behind the firing line.

Others will probably disagree, but there is nothing unsafe about walking in and out during a cease fire period as long as you are behind the bench (firing line, whatever term you want to use) and not handling any firearms.
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Old 07-20-2019, 7:30 AM
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[QUOTE=fish45;23225

I don't think you understood my statement/ question. I do not understand their logic behind walking in and out of the range. During a cease fire as long as you are behind the firing line and not handling firearms or touching the bench during a cease fire period I do not understand why I cant walk in and out with spotting scopes, LOCKED gun cases, toolboxes, whatever, and sit with them behind the firing line. During an active fire period (or whatever term you want to use) I do not understand why I can't walk in and out, set up my stuff at the bench they assigned and then wait with a target behind the firing line. .[/QUOTE]

There is the concept of safety, and then there is the thoughtless implementation of rules that are overboard to the point of silly, which is the current state of mind.
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Old 07-20-2019, 8:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fish45 View Post

I don't think you understood my statement/ question. I do not understand their logic behind walking in and out of the range. During a cease fire as long as you are behind the firing line and not handling firearms or touching the bench during a cease fire period I do not understand why I cant walk in and out with spotting scopes, LOCKED gun cases, toolboxes, whatever, and sit with them behind the firing line. During an active fire period (or whatever term you want to use) I do not understand why I can't walk in and out, set up my stuff at the bench they assigned and then wait with a target behind the firing line.

Others will probably disagree, but there is nothing unsafe about walking in and out during a cease fire period as long as you are behind the bench (firing line, whatever term you want to use) and not handling any firearms.
another reason is for "security" they dont want somebody walking off with another persons guns / gear , to prevent theft, people have been known to walk off with another persons firearm.
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Old 07-20-2019, 12:52 PM
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another reason is for "security" they dont want somebody walking off with another persons guns / gear , to prevent theft, people have been known to walk off with another persons firearm.
Thats a valid point but thats not an excuse for poor customer service. Somebody could walk off with your stuff during the walk in/ out period anyway. I'll just keep spending my money elsewhere to avoid the hassle.
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Old 07-20-2019, 1:05 PM
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Yea, when I'm at a public range nothing gets out of my sight.
Either the person I'm with or I have eyes on firearms, ammo, or gear.
Not that I distrust everyone, but feel that it's my obligation as a gun owner just in case. I've been to the Livermore range a few times and the in\out only at cease fire
seemed a bit strange but range rules are range rules and are different wherever you go.
No need in getting upset about IMO. Just makes it rough to change targets or pee!
-g
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Old 07-20-2019, 3:55 PM
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The "No movement of guns or equipment during cease fire" is for your protection. I don't watch your stuff that is behind the cease fire line during cease fire, I watch the benches to make sure no one approaches them while we have people down range. Since I'm not watching your "Stuff" that is behind the line, what would stop someone from grabbing your things, even a cased rifle, and walking off with them while you are walking out to the 100 yd line? Nothing! You'd ask me "where's my stuff", I don't know, what's your stuff?

So the inconvenience is minor, people can come and go, just not stuff. If you plan it right you take your equipment to your car before cease fire and then you can grab your target and go during cease fire.
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Old 07-20-2019, 5:59 PM
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I have left my Glock on top of the table at firing line at USI for 20/30 minutes before without fear of it not being there when I got from watching the action guys probably 15/20 years ago.

Ive been to Chabot, Sacramento valley, Davis st, Manteca, Yolo, USI, and Livermore before the closure have without problems.

The reopened (7 years ago) Livermore seems to have some major issues. So far from reading this new thread that Livermore has thieves, idiots, dont rub the rsos wrong or they will charge you to switch lanes limit you to 2 hours shooting and from personal experience issue you 1 table for your group.
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Old 07-20-2019, 6:12 PM
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I went there once. Hot, dusty, in the middle of nowhere. Never again. I'll stick with my secret, plush, secluded pimp range.
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Old 07-20-2019, 6:13 PM
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I have been going to Livermore for more the 25 years. The rules have changed and I understand that for the most part. The facility has been improved and I enjoy going there. I have never had an issue and will continue. the RSO are good people and I appreciate the job they do.

... and the steel shoot they are working on is fun.

anyone remember RSO Alvin?
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Old 07-20-2019, 7:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fish45 View Post

I don't think you understood my statement/ question. I do not understand their logic behind walking in and out of the range. During a cease fire as long as you are behind the firing line and not handling firearms or touching the bench during a cease fire period I do not understand why I cant walk in and out with spotting scopes, LOCKED gun cases, toolboxes, whatever, and sit with them behind the firing line. During an active fire period (or whatever term you want to use) I do not understand why I can't walk in and out, set up my stuff at the bench they assigned and then wait with a target behind the firing line.
Still don't understand. If you can't walkin (in/out) during a ceasefire, and you can't walk (in/out) during live fire, then how are you supposed to enter and leave the range?
  • You _can_ walk in/setup/prep target/shoot/packup/leave during live fire... I do it all the time.
  • You can't walk in/setup/etc during cease fire.

During cease fire they don't want people tempted to go to their bench and futz around...which would be a constant occurrence if joe public could enter the range with his gear during a cease fire.

Back during my Chabot days, the RO would be yelling at people fairly frequently during cease fires...there's always one or two new shooters who are running on (unsafe) autopilot. You'd think it would be easy - stay behind the red line while folks are downrange - but empirical evidence showed otherwise.

Anywho, it is what it is. It's not a big deal for me either way; frankly the big PITA at Livermore is that I can't shoot rifles standing. ( Sigh )

Livermore isn't perfect, but it's a decent range and pretty much all of the staff is friendly. I like it.

: shrug :

-- Michael
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