Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > FIREARMS DISCUSSIONS > Centerfire Rifles - Manually Operated
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Centerfire Rifles - Manually Operated Lever action, bolt action or other non gas operated centerfire rifles.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-20-2019, 4:53 PM
BroncoMustang BroncoMustang is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 298
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default Wondering why some prefer Howa action to a Remington

I have read in a number of different websites, etc. that some people really prefer the Howa action over the Remington. Wanting to learn the benefits of Howa and what the differences are, I thought that I would ask people out on this site. What features does the Howa have that you really like? Looking forward to learning from others. Thank you.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-20-2019, 5:00 PM
jtv3062's Avatar
jtv3062 jtv3062 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,305
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

I wouldn't buy a Howa being they're cast.
__________________
Do not fear the enemy, for your enemy can only take your life. It is far better that you fear the media, for they will steal your Honour

Let's pray for Obama Psalm 109:8



Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-20-2019, 5:41 PM
MongooseV8's Avatar
MongooseV8 MongooseV8 is online now
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: East Bay, CA
Posts: 3,555
iTrader: 83 / 100%
Default

Price would be my first guess.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-20-2019, 6:04 PM
Hoooch's Avatar
Hoooch Hoooch is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South OC
Posts: 314
iTrader: 15 / 100%
Default

Got a great deal on my 30-06 howa in a HS precision stock. 1 moa rifle with a lifetime warranty was good enough for me. Action is smooth and rugged. There’s really nothing I don’t like.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10-20-2019, 6:17 PM
kevins750's Avatar
kevins750 kevins750 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Deep behind liberal lines
Posts: 1,183
iTrader: 36 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MongooseV8 View Post
Price would be my first guess.
I have a Howa, price would be my guess also.....before I bought it I have read
"The howa corrects everything wrong with the R700 action." I have several R700
Actions long and short and the howa to me has a heavier bolt lift. Uses the
AR 15 type ejector also.
__________________
"To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical." Thomas Jefferson
NRA+CRPA member

"Get yourself a Glock and lose that nickel plated sissy pistol" -------Deputy Samuel Gerard
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-20-2019, 6:35 PM
vintagearms's Avatar
vintagearms vintagearms is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: CA
Posts: 6,553
iTrader: 53 / 100%
Default

I'd get a Tikka or Bergara before buying a Howa. Support and aftermarket support mostly.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 10-20-2019, 7:02 PM
American Muslim Gun Owner American Muslim Gun Owner is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 74
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Hello BroncoMustang fellow members,

I recently bought a Howa heavy barrel for a beginner long-range project and, speaking for myself, it was a combination of price, features and reviews. I have handled and/or shot all other brands at some point, and it could've easily been a Remington, Savage, Ruger, etc.

The reviews on the Howas were good no matter where I looked. And I went into it knowing full well that the aftermarket support would not be anywhere near as big as for the Remington 700. But for me, that is also a plus because I can't go upgrades crazy even if I wanted to. This rifle will force me to shoot it as-is for a while, getting the fundamentals down and start learning to reload to realize its full potential. At that point I will also know for sure if I am happy with the kind of shooting I am doing, or I if am ready to step up my game financially and into a particular discipline. It's not a bad example of a cheap entry rifle for someone without a long-term game plan.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-20-2019, 7:49 PM
JackEllis JackEllis is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: NorCal Mountains
Posts: 2,113
iTrader: 27 / 100%
Default

I have a Howa 1500 in .223 with a varmint barrel. It's the most consistent (accurate) rifle I own.

When I decided to buy that rifle, price was a minor issue. I'd done a bunch of research and Howas get pretty favorable reviews.

Aftermarket support was never an issue. I prefer to buy rifles that shoot well out of the box and then not mess with them. The one concession to customization I did make was a high power scope, the better to find those pesky rodents.

If you want a project rifle, Howa does sell barreled actions.

Last edited by JackEllis; 10-20-2019 at 7:52 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 10-20-2019, 7:59 PM
pennstater's Avatar
pennstater pennstater is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Diamond Bar, Ca.
Posts: 2,599
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Default

I think posts #7 & 8 have it covered for most shooters. Remember, it's the Indian, not the arrow.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 10-20-2019, 8:10 PM
sigstroker sigstroker is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: not in CA
Posts: 7,716
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

Bolt stop that's not part of the trigger, the way the bolt disassembles, the M16 extractor, the recoil lug that's part of the action, not a separate part that's held on by the barrel, and that the forward action screw screws into that recoil lug area.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 10-20-2019, 9:17 PM
oak18's Avatar
oak18 oak18 is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 370
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtv3062 View Post
I wouldn't buy a Howa being they're cast.
Yeah, Remington started to cast everything they could several years ago but I believe their receivers are still machined from solid steel.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 10-20-2019, 11:22 PM
ar15barrels's Avatar
ar15barrels ar15barrels is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Van Nuys
Posts: 46,770
iTrader: 101 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BroncoMustang View Post
I have read in a number of different websites, etc. that some people really prefer the Howa action over the Remington. Wanting to learn the benefits of Howa and what the differences are, I thought that I would ask people out on this site. What features does the Howa have that you really like? Looking forward to learning from others. Thank you.
The benefits of a Howa are that you can sometimes get one for $250 while 700's rarely pop up under $400.
The other advantage over a 700 is the recoil lug being one piece with the action.
The Howa receiver has the recoil lug built in like a Mauser or Winchester M70.
The Rem700 design uses a separate recoil lug which is retained by the barrel just like a Savage or almost every other design which does not have an integral recoil lug.
If you don't plan or WANT to customize them, they are fine guns.

Everything else about the Howa are downsides when it comes to customizing them.
Metric barrel threads so most gunsmiths won't rebarrel them
NO aftermarket bolts so you can not true them and tighten up the bolt fit.
Limited options for triggers and replacement stocks.

For a person looking to customize, the 700 design has so many more options in aftermarket parts.
There are over 20 companies producing a clone of the 700 design.
No other designs have more than 2 clones.
__________________
Randall Rausch

AR work: www.ar15barrels.com
Bolt actions: www.700barrels.com
Foreign Semi Autos: www.akbarrels.com
Barrel, sight and trigger work on most pistols and shotguns.
Most work performed while-you-wait, evening and saturday appointments available.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 10-21-2019, 2:03 AM
LynnJr LynnJr is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 6,643
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

Price or lack of experience
__________________
Lynn Dragoman, Jr.
Southwest Regional Director
Unlimited Range Shooters Association (URSA)
www.unlimitedrange.org
Not a commercial business.
URSA - Competition starts at 2000 yards!
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 10-21-2019, 11:13 AM
Vigilante's Avatar
Vigilante Vigilante is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Utah
Posts: 564
iTrader: 10 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtv3062 View Post
I wouldn't buy a Howa being they're cast.
Howa 1500 receivers are forged, not cast.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 10-21-2019, 11:17 AM
M1NM's Avatar
M1NM M1NM is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: West Covina
Posts: 6,248
iTrader: 48 / 100%
Default

Why do some people prefer Chevy over Ford? Different cars that do same job.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 10-21-2019, 11:29 AM
sigstroker sigstroker is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: not in CA
Posts: 7,716
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

Good comparison. Way back when, the Ford engine was a superior design, but Chevy played the politics game better and therefore got preferential treatment wrt rules. This led to better aftermarket support and development on the Chevy. Eventually GM wised up and the modern LS motors have a lot of features that look very familiar to long time Ford fans.

Not saying that Remington did anything wrt politics, but they were cheaper and easier to work on than the inherently superior Winchester Model 70. If you're an aftermarket vendor trying to sell parts for improving a rifle, it's easier to sell them for rifles that benefit the most from improvement. It's at the point now where you can hardly buy any hot rod parts for a Winchester.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 10-21-2019, 3:49 PM
TMB 1's Avatar
TMB 1 TMB 1 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: 530
Posts: 6,427
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sigstroker View Post
Good comparison. Way back when, the Ford engine was a superior design, but Chevy played the politics game better and therefore got preferential treatment wrt rules. This led to better aftermarket support and development on the Chevy. Eventually GM wised up and the modern LS motors have a lot of features that look very familiar to long time Ford fans.

Not saying that Remington did anything wrt politics, but they were cheaper and easier to work on than the inherently superior Winchester Model 70. If you're an aftermarket vendor trying to sell parts for improving a rifle, it's easier to sell them for rifles that benefit the most from improvement. It's at the point now where you can hardly buy any hot rod parts for a Winchester.
Working on 60s and 70s vehicles. My experience with Chevy has been small block V8 part will interchange with multiple years and models of vehicles. My experience with small block Ford V8 has been you better have make model and year perfect or you will get wrong part and you may still get the wrong part even if you do have make model and year perfect. I think that is why Chevy became so popular.


As far as Remington vs Winchester goes. How can something that is more difficult to work on/repair/hot rod be superior?
__________________

Last edited by TMB 1; 10-21-2019 at 3:53 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 10-21-2019, 4:20 PM
jtv3062's Avatar
jtv3062 jtv3062 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,305
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TMB 1 View Post


As far as Remington vs Winchester goes. How can something that is more difficult to work on/repair/hot rod be superior?
LOL, who? The germans!
__________________
Do not fear the enemy, for your enemy can only take your life. It is far better that you fear the media, for they will steal your Honour

Let's pray for Obama Psalm 109:8



Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 10-21-2019, 4:22 PM
RNE228 RNE228 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,446
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

This is interesting.

In my 6.5CRD vs 6.5-284 thread, mentioned the 65.-284 I shot was a custom built on a Mauser action. My in-law wondered why anyone would build on a Rem700 action...
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 10-21-2019, 5:03 PM
LynnJr LynnJr is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 6,643
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

What Sigstroker fails to realize in all of his threads is the 700 Remington is a 1.350 round action with a separate recoil lug and it also has a very fast lock time.
YThe round action means anyone with a lathe can true it up and sleeve it if necessary.
Actions with built in recoil lugs or cast actions are a pain to center up and will crack.
The model 70 is so far from being a better action it's not worth talking about while the 700's design is copied by 95% or more of all the custom manufacturers.
There's a good reason they copy the 700 and not the model 70.
Likewise the 700 trigger is the most copied design because it is also the best.

The Mauser actions have slow lock times and integral lug and a tenon shroud on some models that needs removal on rebarreling. They are also very weak when it comes to hanging anything other than a sporter weight barrel on them. They tend to flex where the cutout is and ruin your bedding when a heavy barrel is installed.

The Savage actions simply have to many parts and the tolerance stacking becomes an issue early on
There saving grace is the floating boltface which accounts for much of the slop by allowing the lugs to stay in contact with the abutments regardless of what the bolts body is doing..

On a loose fitting bolt the trigger pushes upwards on the cocking piece which lifts the locking lugs off of there abutments and sending vibrations through the gun upon firing.
Savage somewhat solves that by using the floating head while Remington's need an oversized bolt body or sleeves added to lessen the cant from the trigger cocking piece lifting.

Most of the aftermarket tactical actions have worse tolerances than a trued up Remington but you can't tell those guys anything without a debate.
__________________
Lynn Dragoman, Jr.
Southwest Regional Director
Unlimited Range Shooters Association (URSA)
www.unlimitedrange.org
Not a commercial business.
URSA - Competition starts at 2000 yards!

Last edited by LynnJr; 10-22-2019 at 3:20 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 10-22-2019, 8:28 AM
Dave Hoback Dave Hoback is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 240
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtv3062 View Post
I wouldn't buy a Howa being they're cast.
Where did you hear this? Simply isn’t true. This was a lie started on various forums years ago by a couple people who claimed to WORK in the factory! (I’m sure!) And has simply been regurgitated & repeated through the years!(case in point!) Howas are made in the same fashion that Remington and Savages Winchesters are!

Howa Actions are made in Japan & based somewhat on the old Sako Actions. They start with a solid billet of round stock 4140 alloy steel, and the action is machined. They have a great stock trigger, and use the M16/m4 style extractor. (SMART!) They have never been huge in the US because the firearms community has always harbored a love for our US made rifles. Remington & Winchester at the top, with Savage & Ruger not far behind. So of course aftermarket support favors the US rifles. But enough is available that choosing a Howa is not a handicap.

I have never owned one as I’m a Savage guy. But I would not hesitate, and I may at some point as I build my own rifles on bare Actions. So getting it cheap is my goal.

People need to stop spreading that they are Cast. It’s simply not true!

Feel free to educate yourselves. https://www.howausa.com/
__________________
CalGuns DUMBEST Quote ever: “It's doubtful you've ever actually shot anybody, maybe never even seen anybody shot and don't really know what the hell you're talking about in the first place.” -Member on Calguns. (I think he is “LESS” more than just “FEATURE”!)

Ask me what Christ did for me..., and I will tell you what He will do for you!

Last edited by Dave Hoback; 10-22-2019 at 8:31 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 10-22-2019, 8:54 AM
dizzyblonde dizzyblonde is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 18
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Because Remington doesn't do quality control anymore.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 10-22-2019, 9:16 AM
California_Deplorable's Avatar
California_Deplorable California_Deplorable is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: everywhere
Posts: 3,864
iTrader: 35 / 100%
Default

I have the Howa 24" heavy barrel that was on sale at Turner's for $300. Thats why I bought it. I put it in a chassis and its a great bench gun for me.

I've had a Howa 1500 "scout" and a Weatherby Vanguard (Howa 1500) and they were both excellent rifles that shot subMOA out of the box.

I also have two used R700s.

To me the Howa is an inherently accurate design given the flat bottom of the receiver and the hardness of the Japanese steel. I think their factory barrels are more accurate than Remington's standard factory barrels (not the 5R).

I only bought the Howa's because they seem to group just as well as a basic Remington SPS for at least $100 less. But I would not recommend them for a custom rifle build. The Remington 700 is really the gold standard when it comes to selecting an action for a custom rifle build.
__________________
CRPA and NRA member.

The OPINIONS expressed herein are NOT legal advice and should not be taken too seriously. This is the internet after all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ibanezfoo View Post
And the lord appeared unto him and spoketh "tere henges". And he did knoweth in two weeks shall be the terrible boating accident whereas upon the mighty waves will the shoulder thing that goes up be lost beneath the sea. All rise. Sit down. Rise again. Sit down. Behold the non homo dancing. Amen

Last edited by California_Deplorable; 10-22-2019 at 9:18 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 10-22-2019, 9:48 AM
ar15barrels's Avatar
ar15barrels ar15barrels is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Van Nuys
Posts: 46,770
iTrader: 101 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dizzyblonde View Post
Because Remington doesn't do quality control anymore.
It's not the 80's anymore.
Remington went to a full CNC machining in the mid 2000's and their actions are now being made much straighter/squarer than they used to be in the 1960's.
__________________
Randall Rausch

AR work: www.ar15barrels.com
Bolt actions: www.700barrels.com
Foreign Semi Autos: www.akbarrels.com
Barrel, sight and trigger work on most pistols and shotguns.
Most work performed while-you-wait, evening and saturday appointments available.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 10-22-2019, 10:09 AM
M1NM's Avatar
M1NM M1NM is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: West Covina
Posts: 6,248
iTrader: 48 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TMB 1 View Post
,,, My experience with small block Ford V8 has been you better have make model and year perfect or you will get wrong part and you may still get the wrong part even if you do have make model and year perfect. I think that is why Chevy became so popular.
Chevy became popular because the kept the same basic design for many decades. You can take a head off a 1955 265 and bolt it on a current crate motor. Millions of Chevies in junk yards made for cheap replacements.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 10-22-2019, 1:29 PM
Dave Hoback Dave Hoback is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 240
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by California_Deplorable View Post
I have the Howa 24" heavy barrel that was on sale at Turner's for $300. Thats why I bought it. I put it in a chassis and its a great bench gun for me.

To me the Howa is an inherently accurate design given the flat bottom of the receiver and the hardness of the Japanese steel. I think their factory barrels are more accurate than Remington's standard factory barrels (not the 5R).
The “hardness” of Japanese ordnance steel is the same as any other rifle. They are using 4140 alloy & 416R (stainless models).

Just wondering, what Chassis did you use? I build ALL of bolt guns in Chassis. My current uses a modified MDT TAC21. Curious which you went with?
__________________
CalGuns DUMBEST Quote ever: “It's doubtful you've ever actually shot anybody, maybe never even seen anybody shot and don't really know what the hell you're talking about in the first place.” -Member on Calguns. (I think he is “LESS” more than just “FEATURE”!)

Ask me what Christ did for me..., and I will tell you what He will do for you!
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 10-22-2019, 1:49 PM
California_Deplorable's Avatar
California_Deplorable California_Deplorable is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: everywhere
Posts: 3,864
iTrader: 35 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hoback View Post
The “hardness” of Japanese ordnance steel is the same as any other rifle. They are using 4140 alloy & 416R (stainless models).

Just wondering, what Chassis did you use? I build ALL of bolt guns in Chassis. My current uses a modified MDT TAC21. Curious which you went with?
Accurate mag sport tact lite chassis with XLR tactical lite stock.
https://accurate-mag.com/shop/chassi...hassis-system/
__________________
CRPA and NRA member.

The OPINIONS expressed herein are NOT legal advice and should not be taken too seriously. This is the internet after all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ibanezfoo View Post
And the lord appeared unto him and spoketh "tere henges". And he did knoweth in two weeks shall be the terrible boating accident whereas upon the mighty waves will the shoulder thing that goes up be lost beneath the sea. All rise. Sit down. Rise again. Sit down. Behold the non homo dancing. Amen

Last edited by California_Deplorable; 10-22-2019 at 1:54 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 10-22-2019, 2:09 PM
jtv3062's Avatar
jtv3062 jtv3062 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,305
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hoback View Post
Where did you hear this? Simply isn’t true. This was a lie started on various forums years ago by a couple people who claimed to WORK in the factory! (I’m sure!) And has simply been regurgitated & repeated through the years!(case in point!) Howas are made in the same fashion that Remington and Savages Winchesters are!

Howa Actions are made in Japan & based somewhat on the old Sako Actions. They start with a solid billet of round stock 4140 alloy steel, and the action is machined. They have a great stock trigger, and use the M16/m4 style extractor. (SMART!) They have never been huge in the US because the firearms community has always harbored a love for our US made rifles. Remington & Winchester at the top, with Savage & Ruger not far behind. So of course aftermarket support favors the US rifles. But enough is available that choosing a Howa is not a handicap.

I have never owned one as I’m a Savage guy. But I would not hesitate, and I may at some point as I build my own rifles on bare Actions. So getting it cheap is my goal.

People need to stop spreading that they are Cast. It’s simply not true!

Feel free to educate yourselves. https://www.howausa.com/
I've done a little searching since the claim that the action was forged. Also I don't remember where I read that the action was cast. As inexpensive as the rifle is I had no reason to question that claim at the time



Barreled Action*features a machined receiver and forged bolt.

This is a cut a paste from the web page you linked. Where does it say the action is forged? The bolt is forged and the receiver is machined. I'm not being an *** here. Is being machined another way of saying forged? Again I'm not being an ***.
__________________
Do not fear the enemy, for your enemy can only take your life. It is far better that you fear the media, for they will steal your Honour

Let's pray for Obama Psalm 109:8



Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 10-22-2019, 3:25 PM
Dave Hoback Dave Hoback is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 240
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtv3062 View Post
I've done a little searching since the claim that the action was forged. Also I don't remember where I read that the action was cast. As inexpensive as the rifle is I had no reason to question that claim at the time



Barreled Action*features a machined receiver and forged bolt.

This is a cut a paste from the web page you linked. Where does it say the action is forged? The bolt is forged and the receiver is machined. I'm not being an *** here. Is being machined another way of saying forged? Again I'm not being an ***.
Oh, I don’t think you’re being that! LOL! Nothing wrong with asking a question.

Howa’s site says each part is made from hammer forged, machined steel. I know almost all actions are made the same way. They use ordnance 4140 round bar and machined(combination of lathe turned & CNC’d). If you search, there are several other articles (respected organizations) that also state Howa’s being “forged” & “machined”.

Forged & CNC machined are basically the same thing. When it’s stated forged, it doesn’t mean a burly, bearded man wearing a Kilt heating the steel in his coal fire & beating it with hammer & anvil! A forged anything means the basic shape is pressed under tremendous force. But then that basic shape still needs machined. When a part is “CNC machined” or you see “Billet”, this means the part is fully machined from a solid bar or round stock of steel, or aluminum. But the BAR STOCK/ROUND STOCK was already FORGED to that style of stock.

Hope this sheds some light.
__________________
CalGuns DUMBEST Quote ever: “It's doubtful you've ever actually shot anybody, maybe never even seen anybody shot and don't really know what the hell you're talking about in the first place.” -Member on Calguns. (I think he is “LESS” more than just “FEATURE”!)

Ask me what Christ did for me..., and I will tell you what He will do for you!
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 10-22-2019, 3:26 PM
Dave Hoback Dave Hoback is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 240
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by California_Deplorable View Post
Accurate mag sport tact lite chassis with XLR tactical lite stock.
https://accurate-mag.com/shop/chassi...hassis-system/
Very nice. I like it. And great price there! Thanks for sharing.
__________________
CalGuns DUMBEST Quote ever: “It's doubtful you've ever actually shot anybody, maybe never even seen anybody shot and don't really know what the hell you're talking about in the first place.” -Member on Calguns. (I think he is “LESS” more than just “FEATURE”!)

Ask me what Christ did for me..., and I will tell you what He will do for you!
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 10-22-2019, 4:04 PM
ar15barrels's Avatar
ar15barrels ar15barrels is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Van Nuys
Posts: 46,770
iTrader: 101 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hoback View Post
When a part is “CNC machined” or you see “Billet”, this means the part is fully machined from a solid bar or round stock of steel, or aluminum.
But the BAR STOCK/ROUND STOCK was already FORGED to that style of stock.
Billet means made from a standard bar stock shape whether that is round, square or flat will depend on the basic shape being machined.
Forged means they took a blob of liquid metal and pre-shaped it before they machined it.
For mass production, a forged part is usually cheaper to make than a billet part because a forging requires much LESS metal removal because you make the forging as close to the finished shape as you can.

Bar stock is usually extruded or rolled to shape and is definitely not forged.
__________________
Randall Rausch

AR work: www.ar15barrels.com
Bolt actions: www.700barrels.com
Foreign Semi Autos: www.akbarrels.com
Barrel, sight and trigger work on most pistols and shotguns.
Most work performed while-you-wait, evening and saturday appointments available.
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 10-22-2019, 7:59 PM
ar15barrels's Avatar
ar15barrels ar15barrels is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Van Nuys
Posts: 46,770
iTrader: 101 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hoback View Post
Forging is much more expensive, because of the machinery involved.
This is why small companies CNC custom parts....because the startup cost for Forging equipment is much too expensive for a smaller company’s output.
I said mass production, not small production.
Think connecting rods and crankshafts for ford or chevy.
In mass production, the cost of having the forgings made disappears behind machining costs and the machining costs from billets are almost always dramatically more.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 10-22-2019, 8:13 PM
LynnJr LynnJr is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 6,643
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

A cast big block crank runs $300 a forged big block crank runs a $1000 and a billet crank runs $2500.
__________________
Lynn Dragoman, Jr.
Southwest Regional Director
Unlimited Range Shooters Association (URSA)
www.unlimitedrange.org
Not a commercial business.
URSA - Competition starts at 2000 yards!
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 10-22-2019, 8:24 PM
Dave Hoback Dave Hoback is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 240
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Your statement was correct. And so was mine.

And back to the topic at hand... Howas are great rifles, with a fantastic 2-stage trigger, and impressive accuracy not just for their price point, but impressive period! And given there are companies that make Barrel nut systems (as used by Savage) for almost any rifle, the list of cons becomes rather small. Coming down really to simple preference.
__________________
CalGuns DUMBEST Quote ever: “It's doubtful you've ever actually shot anybody, maybe never even seen anybody shot and don't really know what the hell you're talking about in the first place.” -Member on Calguns. (I think he is “LESS” more than just “FEATURE”!)

Ask me what Christ did for me..., and I will tell you what He will do for you!

Last edited by Dave Hoback; 10-23-2019 at 8:38 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 10-22-2019, 8:28 PM
ar15barrels's Avatar
ar15barrels ar15barrels is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Van Nuys
Posts: 46,770
iTrader: 101 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hoback View Post
But the BAR STOCK/ROUND STOCK was already FORGED to that style of stock.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Hoback View Post
Your statement was correct.
And so was mine.
Bar stock is NOT forged.
It is normally extruded in the case of aluminum or rolled in the case of steel.
Prove me wrong.
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 10-22-2019, 9:39 PM
California_Deplorable's Avatar
California_Deplorable California_Deplorable is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: everywhere
Posts: 3,864
iTrader: 35 / 100%
Default

Im so confused. I thought forged was when you take piece of metal and heat it up then hammer it into shape and cast is when you melt the metal to a liquid and pour it into a mold.
__________________
CRPA and NRA member.

The OPINIONS expressed herein are NOT legal advice and should not be taken too seriously. This is the internet after all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ibanezfoo View Post
And the lord appeared unto him and spoketh "tere henges". And he did knoweth in two weeks shall be the terrible boating accident whereas upon the mighty waves will the shoulder thing that goes up be lost beneath the sea. All rise. Sit down. Rise again. Sit down. Behold the non homo dancing. Amen
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 10-22-2019, 10:15 PM
JTROKS's Avatar
JTROKS JTROKS is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: NorCal - Bay Area
Posts: 11,555
iTrader: 130 / 100%
Default

MIM is stronger than forged, billet and cast.











Just kidding.
__________________
The wise man said just find your place
In the eye of the storm
Seek the roses along the way
Just beware of the thorns...
K. Meine
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 10-23-2019, 12:00 AM
2shotjoe's Avatar
2shotjoe 2shotjoe is offline
My brother loves AOC
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: (╯°o°)╯︵ ┻━┻
Posts: 24,272
iTrader: 14 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by California_Deplorable View Post
Im so confused. I thought forged was when you take piece of metal and heat it up then hammer it into shape and cast is when you melt the metal to a liquid and pour it into a mold.
It is, there's more than 1 way to forge metal.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kestryll View Post
..not only am I a terrorist I'm a Director of a terrorist organization.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CAL.BAR View Post
You're letting shallow politics influence your gasp of facts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoffmang View Post
Anyone not voting Brown is putting other things above gun rights.
Whitman + Cooley or Harris = a rash of gun control California has never seen the likes of.
-Gene
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoffmang View Post
If you're not voting why are you even opining?
Brown has a track record of not bowing to Dem pressure on guns.
-Gene
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 10-23-2019, 6:09 AM
SnWnMe's Avatar
SnWnMe SnWnMe is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: The 951
Posts: 6,413
iTrader: 10 / 100%
Default

Rugers are cast. Anyone want to claim Rugers are weak guns?
__________________
Frank Da Tank
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 10-23-2019, 6:34 AM
LynnJr LynnJr is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 6,643
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

BroncoMustang
If your shooting a factory out of the box rifle the Howa rifles come with a patriotic paint job and several chassis that look cool to the new shooter.
If your going to compete or shoot much very little if what comes on a factory rifle gets used or gets used without modification.
The guys just starting out usually prefer to look cool.
The guys who want to win usually update/modify to be more competitive.
I don't shoot tactical matches only long-range and Benchrest and I have never seen a Howa in competition use.
If your goal is tactical go to a tactical match and see what the winners are using.
__________________
Lynn Dragoman, Jr.
Southwest Regional Director
Unlimited Range Shooters Association (URSA)
www.unlimitedrange.org
Not a commercial business.
URSA - Competition starts at 2000 yards!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 9:09 PM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2018, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.
Calguns.net and The Calguns Foundation have no affiliation and are in no way related to each other.
All opinions, statements and remarks made by Calguns.net on this web site and elsewhere are solely attributable to Calguns.net.