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California handguns Discuss your favorite California handgun technical and related questions here. |
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Single Shot Exemption Explanation/Database Thread
With Brown's signing of AB 1964, SSE appears to go away as of Jan 1, 2015. SUMMARY:As before, any updates/additions/corrections/suggestions are welcome. I am not an employee nor am I affiliated with any FFL in any capacity other than customer. I will check this thread fairly regularly, or you can PM me. This mini database is broken into sections, please use control+F with "Section X" to jump to the pertinent section (as of now, this seems to be the easiest way to navigate a long post): Section 1- legal Section 2- plain English explanation of the process Section 3- FFL's who are performing this process, and the capacity in which they are doing the conversions Section 4- FFL's who are willing to transfer these items and their location/information Section 5- out of state vendors who will NOT ship off-roster items to CA FAQ in next post Section 1: Legal 12133. (a) The provisions of this chapter shall not apply to a single-action revolver that has at least a 5-cartridge capacity with a barrel length of not less than three inches, and meets any of the following specifications: (1) Was originally manufactured prior to 1900 and is a curio or relic, as defined in Section 478.11 of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations. (2) Has an overall length measured parallel to the barrel of at least 71/2 inches when the handle, frame or receiver, and barrel are assembled. (3) Has an overall length measured parallel to the barrel of at least 71/2 inches when the handle, frame or receiver, and barrel are assembled and that is currently approved for importation into the United States pursuant to the provisions of paragraph (3) of subsection (d) of Section 925 of Title 18 of the United States Code. (b) The provisions of this chapter shall not apply to a single-shot pistol with a barrel length of not less than six inches and that has an overall length of at least 10 1/2 inches when the handle, frame or receiver, and barrel are assembled. **note: anything not explicitly prohibited by the law is legal Section 2: Explanation - This conversion can be done by a private party (unlikely for them to have the parts) prior to shipping. - This reversible conversion generally entails a replacement barrel of greater length and a mag lock (not revolvers). There are no permanent modifications to the gun. - Keep in mind that certain guns, due to the nature of demand and or design, will be prohibitively expensive or not readily available to be converted. - Either complete DROS at that FFL or have it shipped to an FFL who is willing to accept guns in this format. Note, this may require a deposit on the parts from the FFL. - Take possession of the gun after DROS. - Return the gun to its original configuration (note, for guns with the magazine outside of the grip, a bullet button must be used, and you cannot use "normal capacity" magazines). BWeise 1Recipe: Section 3: FFL's doing this work NorCal Shop: Hours: Mon-Fri 10am - 5pm Capacity: common guns in 9mm, 380acp, 10mm, 40sw, and 45acp, inquire within Rate: $50 for guns purchased eslewhere Shipping: No Shop: Bear Arms PrecisionHours: Appointment only Capacity: Sig 238/ 938/ 220 variants/ 226/ 228/ 229, 1911 and Glock models soon Rate: $150 Shipping: no Shop: Placer TacticalHours: Appointment only Capacity: common guns in 9mm, 380acp, 10mm, 40sw, and 45acp, inquire within Rate: Contact shop Shipping: No Shop: Tracy Rifle and PistolHours: Mon-Sat 10 am - 7pmCapacity: AR/AK/Mac 10, LCP, Glock Gen 4, Sig, HK45, HK P30, Kahr p380, 1911 .40/.45, xDm Rate: contact the shop Shop: Wild Bill's Old West Trading Co.Hours: contact shop Capacity: Gen 4 Glocks, LCP Rate: contact shop Shipping: No Bay Area Shop: Brian Nussbaum CompanyHours: Tues - Fri 10 am - 7pmCapacity: most common pistols, contact shop Rate: contact shop Shipping: no Shop: Cordelia Gun ExchangeHours: Tu-Fr 11-7Capacity: Anything in .380, 9, 40, .45, any 1911, pretty much anything. Rate: No SSE Fees Shipping: Will ship firearms, but not firearms in SSE configuration. Shop: City Arms EastHours: Tu-Fri 11-7Capacity: Inquire within Rate: Inquire within Shipping: no Shop: Digital InstinctsHours: Mon-Fri 10am - 8pmCapacity: 1911's, Gen 4 9MM Glock, HK45 and 45C, HK P30, CZ-75 variants, and 9MM S&W M&P variants like the Pro Series and Core Rate: $100 including DROS Shipping: no Shop: Metal Dog Tactical SupplyHours: Tues-Fri 11am -7pmCapacity: 1911's Rate: Contact shop Shipping: No Shop: Mount Pleasant ArmsHours: By appointment in the evenings - closed Wednesdays and Sundays Capacity: http://www.mparms.com/Single-Shot-Exemptions_ep_67.html Rate: Contact shop Shipping: No Central Shop: Breco EnterprisesHours: contact shop Capacity: SSE all pistols in .380ACP, 9MM, .40S&W, .45ACP and 10MM, AR/AK pistols Rate: contact shop Shipping: No Shop: Cencal GunsHours: contact shop Capacity: contact shop Rate: contact shop Shipping: No Shop: Elite Arms & SupplyHours: T-F 10am - 7pmCapacity: most common models including Glocks, Sigs, 1911's, M&P, etc. Rate: inquire within Shipping: no Shop: Hours: M-S 9am - 6pmCapacity: most common models, inquire within Rate: contact shop Shipping: No Shop: Goodland GunsHours: T-F 10:30am - 6pmCapacity: any .380/9mm/.40 S&W/.45 ACP handgun that can have the barrel removed, 1911's in .38 super, 9mm, or .45. Ruger SR22, and Smith & Wesson M&P. Revolver conversion from double to single for most models. Rate: $50 for in house guns (often included in price), $100 for guns purchased elsewhere Shipping: Yes. $150 deposit. Shop: Spencer's FirearmsHours: Tue-Fri 10am - 7pmCapacity: 1911, Hi-Power, Glock Gen 4 Rate: contact shop Shipping: No Shop: PRKHours: Tues-Thurs 10am - 5pmCapacity: AR/AK/Mac 10, LCP, xDm, Glock Gen 4, 1911's. etc. Rate: contact shop Shipping: No
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WTS all BNIB: Colt S70 Repro, HK45c, Gen4 G19 Last edited by Cyc Wid It; 10-17-2014 at 6:50 PM.. Reason: update |
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SoCal
Shop: 2A ZoneHours: appointment only Capacity: most common models, transfers only http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=904714 Rate: $100 total including DROS/transfer fees Shipping: no Shop: Addax TacticalHours: Tues-Fri 11am - 6pmCapacity: Most Glock Gen 4 models (with exception to the Glock 42 until we make the SSE barrel for this).Rate: contact shop Shipping: no Shop: American Gun WorksHours: Tue-Fri 10am - 6pmCapacity: 1911, Glock Gen 4 Rate: $100 Shipping: No Shop: AmmoParadiseHours: by appointment Capacity: AR/AK Pistols, Glock (all models), Beretta, Sig, HK, xDm, 1911's, S&W semi-auto, CZ, FN, etc. Including most 45ACP, 40SW, 380, 9mm - inquire within for special requests Rate: Included on firearms purchased or ordered through shop, $100 on firearms purchased elsewhere Shipping: No Shop: AO Sword FirearmsHours: Mon-Fri 10am - 6pmCapacity: AR, AK, and most semiautomatic pistols, including single stack and double stack. Rate: ~$75 Shipping: No Shop: Direct Action SolutionsHours: Tues-Sat 10am - 6pmCapacity: HK45, FNP-45, AR pistols, Draco pistols, 1911's Rate: contact shop Shipping: No Shop:[INDENT]EBR Works Newbury Park, CA 91320 ***ALL SSE INVENTORY SOLD OUT. TRANSFER CALENDAR IS FULL FOR THE REMAINDER OF 2014*** Shop: Get A GunHours: contact shop Capacity: AR/AK pistols, LCP Rate: contact shop Shipping: No Shop: Gunfighter Tactical (formerly 'Wiser Owl')Hours: M,W-F: 10am-7pmCapacity: contact shop Rate: no charge for SSE Shipping: no Shop: OC ArmoryHours: Tues- Fri 12pm-9pmCapacity: Most pistols .380 and larger and revolvers longer than 3" with more than 5 cylinders. Rate: $45 pistol transfer $55 SSE DROS $25 Shipping: No Shop: Hollow Point VHours: Appointment only Capacity: contact shop hollowpointv@att.net Rate: $120 for SSE including DROS Shipping: no Shop: Limited-10Hours: Appointment only Capacity: Most glocks, 1911/2011 frames Rate: $100 1911/2011 frames, guns no SSE fee (only transfer fee) Shipping: No Shop: Own More GunsHours: Appointment only Capacity: All .380 ACP, 9mm, .40 S&W & .45 ACP Rate: contact shop Shipping: No Shop: Parallax TacticalHours: Tues-Fri 11am - 6pmCapacity: Walther PPQ in 9mmRate: $100 + tax + DROS Shipping: No Shop: PD Gun Supply & Tool Inc.Hours: Tues-Thurs 12pm - 7pmCapacity: 1911's, Glocks Rate: contact shop Shipping: No Shop: Scorpion ArmsHours: Tues-Sat 10am - 6pmCapacity: Gen 4 Glock, 1911, other models on a case by case basis Rate: $150 for common models Shipping: no Shop: TDS gunsHours: M-S: 11am-7pmCapacity: contact shop Rate: no fee for guns bought through shop, $200 for outside transfers all inclusive Shipping: no Shop: VC DefenseHours: by appointment only Rates (+tax, 7.5% if applicable + DROS): Included with pistol purchased from VC Defense, $150 for SSEs from other dealers without hardware, $60 for SSEs with hardware from another dealer/ customer or for On Roster transfers. Call or email for SSE of or for custom AR pistol builds. Shipping: No Out of State Shop: Table Rock
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WTS all BNIB: Colt S70 Repro, HK45c, Gen4 G19 Last edited by Cyc Wid It; 11-18-2014 at 7:43 PM.. |
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Section 4: Shops that are willing to accept transfers in this form
NorCal California Handgun Exchange (Cottonwood) Golden Bear Arms (El Dorado Hills) Norse Armory (Woodland) Robert Marine (Eureka) Roberts Gunsmithing and Police Supply (Folsom) Bay Area Eddy's Shooting Sports (Mountain View) Kevin Smith (Martinez) Republic of Northern Calif Armory (Oakley) Rob Blank (Milpitas) Santa Cruz Armory (Santa Cruz) Central JK Supply Co (Ione) Mad River Arms (Riverbank) Tenpercent Firearms (Taft) SoCal Addax Tactical (San Fernando) Aegis (Burbank) Bright Spot Pawn (Riverside) EBR Works (Newbury Park) Echo Arms (East Orange County) Fort Courage Armory (Simi Valley) Gusslers (Santee) HIT Armory (Upland) MGM Tactical (Bakersfield) OC Armory (Laguna Hills) Pennington Firearms (Wildomar) Professional Armament Services (Anaheim) Riflegear (Fountain Valley) Straightline Tactical (Anaheim) SWI Firearms (Santa Ana) Tin Star Supply (Oak Hills/Hesperia) West Coast Survival Arms (Chula Vista) Section 5: Out of state vendors who will not ship off roster guns to CA, support vendors that support us Bud's Gun Shop STI *maybe some improvement on this front, YMMV Nelson Tactical Springfield Armory FAQ Q: Where (in the law) does it say that I can convert a gun back to normal capacity? A: If not prohibited by the law, it is legal. In this case, you are merely performing gunsmithing work. Just keep AW laws in mind. Q: How do I know this thread has the correct information? A: I have done my best to combine my own research with outside input/corrections. While I am not a lawyer (yet ), this process has the CGF legal team "seal of approval" and some shops have been visited by both CGF legal folks and the DOJ already without issue. Q: Can I shoot my gun in single shot exempt form? A: Yes, and in theory nothing out of the ordinary should happen. Is it recommended? No. Q: Why won't a shop ABC convert gun XYZ? A: There are a few possible reasons. First, the gun's design could make a conversion cost/time prohibitive. Secondly, there may not be enough demand for this particular gun. In this case, you could try and organize a group buy to demonstrate demand, or pay more. Finally, the shop may be so overloaded with work that your particular gun is just not high enough on their list yet. In this case, a group buy may or may not bump your gun up on the priority list. Q: Does this process work for revolvers? A: Yes, there are somewhat different requirements, but the process works for revolvers as well. Q: If I decide to sell this gun later, what happens? A: You can sell it the same way as any other off-roster gun in CA. Q: What will it say on my DROS? A: Under type - single shot exempt. Q: My favorite shop doesn't believe these conversions are legal, how can I convince them? A: Unfortunately, many shops don't feel comfortable with things that are completely legal. The best you can do is show them the penal code and/or direct them to the CGF legal team if they are willing. Q: Can I use a gun transferred in this way on my CCW? A: Yes. The gun, once returned to its original configuration, is fine to put on your CCW, like any other off-roster pistol. Q: Why can't/won't these shops ship their conversions? A: Some of them did at first. However, many customers lagged or did not return the parts. Every gun sold in this form must remain converted during the 10 day waiting period so there's no rotating of parts possible. The backlog created by people being lazy/inconsiderate/whatever with returning parts has caused them to stop. Even with the deposit system (which many people would balk at), in the event of a late return other customers are still backed up as shops have to hound the customer or make new parts. *note - there is new legal advice stating that it may not be necessary to keep the guns in exempted form during the 10 day waiting period (during DROS and pickup only)
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WTS all BNIB: Colt S70 Repro, HK45c, Gen4 G19 Last edited by Cyc Wid It; 06-04-2014 at 9:02 PM.. |
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A few guys still think it is 'illegal' to convert a single shot to semi auto (XDm, Glock, Draco, AR, etc). Im hoping to get an XDm soon through them, otherwise, it will be bright spot or Rifle Gear. |
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This is kind of iffy in my opinion. Andy, based on how things went today, I think they're still unsure of themselves. The guy that did the PPT for us today wasn't sure how to do an off-roster PPT even though it's done like any other one. Then their boss or supervisor seemed skeptical about the whole single shot exemption and that they've never done one for regular pistols, just the AR pistols and AK pistols. Then again, they said if it's legal they'll do it. The guy who helped us said they will so go for it but I'd rather go through someone who was sure that they will do it.
Thanks again Andy! You've helped me complete my XDm collection... Maybe you can help me start my 1911 collection next? Haha |
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It is done in the exact same way, they are all off roster pistols in an exempt form. |
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You give certain people too much credit.
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WTS all BNIB: Colt S70 Repro, HK45c, Gen4 G19 |
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+1 for Table Rock Arms
I'm a happy customer of Ryan @ Table Rock Arms. Ryan has great customer service and was very patient with me thru the whole process. He couldnt supply the pistol; I wanted. He happily did the transfer from another dealer. I wanted a rare to find HK P30LS variant 1. Only 200 of these came here to the country and with the help of fellow HK'ers I found one a swooped it up. Ryan, was very strong about getting the pistol I wanted... He said since he couldnt supply the P30LS variant 1. He was more than happy to help me with the transfer and the one shot conversion. My P30LS is on its way to great guys @ StraightLine Tactical, as we speak. I cant wait to get her out of 10day jail. I'll definitely go back to Table Rock Arms for my next purchase... P.S. CZ guys get ready... Ryan is working of barrels for you guys. |
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Ryan edit: Thinking about it now I have about 30 barrels for single shot conversion. Last edited by Table Rock Arms; 05-18-2011 at 8:36 PM.. |
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Really like what you did with the OP.
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Trimmed out most of the old posts, as the info was moved to the original post.
Good job, Cyc Wid It!
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ARCHIVED Calguns Foundation Wiki here: http://web.archive.org/web/201908310...itle=Main_Page "The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."Ann Althouse: “Begin with the hypothesis that what they did is what they wanted to do. If they postured that they wanted to do something else, regard that as a con. Work from there. The world will make much more sense.” Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs. |
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I just gotta say how nice it was to do business with Valkyrie Arms for two of my three single shots. No attitude, no looking down noses at me saying no no no, just cool real people. I drove two hours to do business with them again for this reason.
A BIG thank you to CG also for helping navigate the gun law land mine field with the single shot threads, AW flow charts, 2A threads & the pooled knowledge has kept me legal & shooting the guns I want....well most of the guns I want heh heh
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------------------------------------------------------------ LTC for OTHER 35 States -check! LTC for MY County/State.... grrrr My High power Rocketry hobby; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAigaiK0YBI ------------------------------------------------------------ |
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I will say that Ryan is a very nice guy who is trying his hardest to keep up with all the requests since he's one of the few 07FFLs that will ship to us SoCal CGers. Maybe I'm just the unlucky guy he forgot about despite our multiple phone conversations. I still appreciate your effort though Ryan and will say that despite my unluckiness you're a great person to do business with. Hopefully we can do some business in the future. That being said... +1 for Ryan @ Table Rock Arms |
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Last edited by glock_holiday; 05-26-2011 at 1:18 PM.. |
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Ship them to us instead!
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Check out our e-commerce site here: www.ebrworks.com Serving you from Prescott, AZ Last edited by EBR Works; 05-26-2011 at 1:30 PM.. |
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What exactly is involved in converting a handgun such as a Glock Gen 4 to "single shot"? Will a magazine converted to being a "bob-sled" and only able to hold one magazine at a time qualify as being "single shot"?
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Installation of a substitute barrel that makes the gun dimensionally compliant (OAL must be at least 10.5" and barrel minimum of 6"). 0 round sled or blocked magazine. Mag lock device.
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Check out our e-commerce site here: www.ebrworks.com Serving you from Prescott, AZ Last edited by EBR Works; 05-26-2011 at 2:31 PM.. |
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AR/AK pistols always need a mag lock. XDM, Gen4 Glock, LCPs, 1911s etc, do not need a mag lock unless they have evil features. |
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Didn't know that, thanks.
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Check out our e-commerce site here: www.ebrworks.com Serving you from Prescott, AZ |
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Doesn't the 0 round magazine need to be locked in somehow?
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JPN Once a Marine, Always a Marine |
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My 1911 had the mag release replaced. G1500, you need the mag lock for the exemption, not for AW compliance. I think you may have mixed up the two.
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WTS all BNIB: Colt S70 Repro, HK45c, Gen4 G19 |
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just because some vendors do a mag lock on "mag in grip" pistols doesn't neccessarily mean that it is required. It may have just been a CYA move that they did, and remember that the SSE rules are still in flux to a small part.
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Jack Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA? No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer. |
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Seems to me to be a good idea to CYA and install a mag lock.
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As far as on pistols without the evil features listed above, I do not believe there needs to be a magazine lock. My understanding is that most vendors insert a 0 shot sled to replace the magazine and somehow secure it in the magazine well, or block the magazine well off somehow. As long as the pistol can only hold one round at a time, it is a single shot, regardless of a magazine lock replacing the mag release. I feel that blocking off the magazine well accomplishes this because a standard magazine cannot be inserted. Once you are in possession of the firearm, you can change out the barrel and the magazine block/sled. In the care of something with evil features, i.e. AR pistol, you MUST have a magazine lock for AW compliance. |
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As with a 1911 most people are "Locking" the magazine in place with longer grip screws. Buy doing is this way the screws are still considered a "Mag Lock" because they "Lock the Magazine" in place. It's just that most people think of a "Mag Lock" as a bullet button or some other device installed to replace or block the original magazine release. |
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but is there any legal requirement that they even do that? I don't think there is.
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Jack Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA? No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer. |
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Good new for Southern California.
Good news So. Cal. While reading a different thread this morning I found out about a gun shop in Ontario. The heart of the Inland Empire and pretty easy to get to from LA, Orange and San Diego counties.
The shop is called Cal-Arms. They are located at: 4451 Ontario Mills Parkway Suite F Ontario, CA. 91764 909-945-3113 www.cal-arms.com Why I am I so excited about them you ask? Well I want in and spoke with David Strait; the owner, today. They are a Type 07 FFL and will do Single Shot Conversion for people as requested. We didn't get in to any pricing but David assured me that he is very into customer service. And, I did get that feeling from him. He also said that he would receive Single Shot Exempt guns for transfer if you found one at a different dealer. He is also up on the IntraFamliar transfer and understands that they are roster exempt and would be happy to receive all of your off-roster gifts from your parent/child/grandparent in other states. And, speaking about transfers. He has a very reasonable transfer fee. Only $65.00 and that includes the DROS fee. David is former LEO and also runs a Private Investigation business. When you go looking for his shop be sure to look for a business called "Spy Gear". They can't put up any signs at their location about guns so they also run this business from the same location. OK, So Cal lets go get some guns. |
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I will have to stop by later! Good find. |
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I'm only going with the fact that these are "Single Shot" pistols. If you you have a removable magazine and insert a magazine that holds more than 0 rounds how is that a "Single Shot" pistol?
Last edited by morrcarr67; 05-27-2011 at 2:55 PM.. |
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It's in the same center as Chop Sticks House Chinese restaurant.
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Gunsmiting
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Just like some people initially thought you needed to render a single-shot pistol incapable of automatically extracting the spent round, I think that this is just cautiousness that people have for "conventional" pistols that are being made SSE.
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Jack Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA? No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer. |
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