What would the penalty be from shooting a pellet gun in one's backyard if...

[Jumbi]

My question is what is the penalty for violating these city "no air guns" ordinances by shooting in ones backyard?

Lets take the case of just shooting a low power .177 pellet rifle into a shooting gallery bullet trap example and NOT shooting it at other neighbors yards or at them directly or something else stupid and dangerous. Please answer the question if it was clearly not malicious and only shooting as relatively "safer" "cough" target practice.

I know the city has this ordinance, but where can I find out the penalty of violating it?
9.35.180 Discharging prohibited.
No person may fire or discharge a firearm, gun, rifle, spring gun, air gun, air rifle, BB gun, pellet gun, sling shot, or other gun or device which throws or projects bullets or missiles of any kind by means of elastic force, air, or any explosive substance. (Ord. 896 § 1, 2016; Ord. 876 § 1, 2013; amended during 2005 recodification; 1991 code § 5-8.1. Formerly 9.35.010)

[Erion929]

A quick Google search yields:

Penalties

Unlawful discharge of a weapon crimes can be either misdemeanor or felony offenses depending on the state and the circumstances of the case. Misdemeanor offenses are less serious than felony offenses, though both can result in significant criminal penalties.

Jail. Jail sentences for the unlawful discharge of a weapon differ widely depending on the state or city. For some city ordinance violations there may be no associated jail time penalty at all, while misdemeanor charges can result in a few days or up to a year in jail. Felony offenses, especially where a person fired into an occupied home or fired in a way that risked human safety, can result in prison sentences of five years of more.

Fines. Fines for illegal discharge convictions also vary significantly. City ordinance fines can be as small as five dollars, while misdemeanor fines typically range between about $50-$1,000. Felony fines are often much more significant, sometimes as high as $10,000 or more.

Probation. You can also be sentenced to probation for the illegal firing of a weapon. Probation sentences typically last at least 12 months, but can exceed three years in some situations. When you're on probation you have to meet specific conditions, such as paying all court costs and fines, taking a drug and alcohol rehabilitation program if substance abuse was involved, regularly reporting to a probation officer, and not committing more crimes. Failing to comply with any probation condition can result in a court revoking probation and imposing a jail sentence, imposing additional fines, extending the length of probation, or other penalties.

Firearms restriction. Federal firearms law prohibits any convicted felon from owning a gun. This means that if you're convicted of a felony criminal discharge crime, you will have to get rid of any guns you already own.


In a worse case.....some neighbor reports you, and the Popo come racing to your house, guns drawn, orders to get on your knees, and you're unceremoniously marched out to the waiting squad car.

In an even worse case, you are Black and you are shot with a half-azzed warning....and die.

Just depends.........

[nagzul]

Get to know your neighbors. If the police are called and they respond, you should expect a very tense situation.

In an even worse case, you are Black and you are shot with a half-azzed warning....and die.

You don't even have to be black, just a neighbor saying a crazy guy with a gun shooting at me. "So they come quickly" .
Not a knock on police, they know how they roll out on gun calls.
As to penalty, I could find nothing saying the charges are different for pellet or rifle discharge.

Side note: I shoot pellets in my back yard all the time. I use a 1911 handgun model mostly with absolutely no issues. I also have a pellet rifle, single shot, that sounds like a .22. I don't shoot that one.

[Jumbi]

Fortunately, my neighbors are either cool with it, or unaware since mine is soooo quiet. This is just a realistically "what if" question.

I find it difficult (but of course not impossible) to believe my proposed situation would be considered a felony since that would require malice or at the very least gross negligence of something like shooting the gun at an inhabited building or car.

What about the situation I proposed in my original post?

[nagzul]

Seems this might have gotten better answers in the CA laws and how they effect me section.
I'm not a lawyer, but I do the same thing all the time with no worries.
If they have a video, and contact police I think they will feel obligated to make a report if the complaint pushes the issue.
Sounds to me like a report and a warning would be expected
Final thought, don't let them in the house, do not submit to a search, and if it was me, I would say as close to 0 words as possible. Maybe none.
It is hard to unring the bell. You would not be the first person to talk themselves into something.

Im abit hardcore, but if they knocked on my door, my answer would probably be "what gun" . Than, I need to call a lawyer.

[xxxx]

I used to shoot my pellet gun in my back yard all the time. But that was like 20 years ago.

[Jumbi]

Originally Posted by nagzul

Seems this might have gotten better answers in the CA laws and how they effect me section.
I'm not a lawyer, but I do the same thing all the time with no worries.
If they have a video, and contact police I think they will feel obligated to make a report if the complaint pushes the issue.
Sounds to me like a report and a warning would be expected
Final thought, don't let them in the house, do not submit to a search, and if it was me, I would say as close to 0 words as possible. Maybe none.
It is hard to unring the bell. You would not be the first person to talk themselves into something.

Im abit hardcore, but if they knocked on my door, my answer would probably be "what gun" . Than, I need to call a lawyer.

Agreed, thank you

[Doheny]

TLDR

[nagzul]

I think he's asking you to shorten up the text. Make it quicker to read. Bullet points.

[Jumbi]

I don't want to shorten the text, as the important clarification of the situation requires a certain minimum number of words, I only want answers from people smart and capable enough to read the whole situation before offering a response. Clearly he is not in that category. The post isn't that long.

I only want responses from those who thoughtfully read the post and are of sound enough mind to answer it.

I'm asking for advice / opinions. If people don't want to respond, then simply don't. I won't be offended.

[P5Ret]

It really depends on the city and how stringently the PD enforces ordinances, and how hard the city attorney wants to push. You can bet that in more than one city in this state if you get caught the city attorney will go for the max penalty. Very few cities have ordinances that amount to a felony, at most misdemeanor charges. I can only think of two cities that have felony ordinances, and surprisingly enough they are Davis and Berkeley, and both involve nukes.

[TKM]

TL/DR/NMP/DYOHW

[Jumbi]

Originally Posted by P5Ret

It really depends on the city and how stringently the PD enforces ordinances, and how hard the city attorney wants to push. You can bet that in more than one city in this state if you get caught the city attorney will go for the max penalty. Very few cities have ordinances that amount to a felony, at most misdemeanor charges. I can only think of two cities that have felony ordinances, and surprisingly enough they are Davis and Berkeley, and both involve nukes.

Fair enough...

[Librarian]

Moved the original.

Cities and counties may create crimes punishable as infractions or misdemeanors. In CA, only State law can be a felony. (Excluding Federal law, which, SFAIK, doesn't address the OP's question at all.)

One would have to look at the city's definition of 'firearm' or 'gun' related to the discharge within their jurisdiction. Some include spring-powered and gas-powered devices in their 'do not discharge' law.

[Jumbi]

Originally Posted by Librarian

Moved the original.

Cities and counties may create crimes punishable as infractions or misdemeanors. In CA, only State law can be a felony. (Excluding Federal law, which, SFAIK, doesn't address the OP's question at all.)

One would have to look at the city's definition of 'firearm' or 'gun' related to the discharge within their jurisdiction. Some include spring-powered and gas-powered devices in their 'do not discharge' law.

My city says this: I know the city has this ordinance, but where can I find out the penalty of violating it?
9.35.180 Discharging prohibited.
No person may fire or discharge a firearm, gun, rifle, spring gun, air gun, air rifle, BB gun, pellet gun, sling shot, or other gun or device which throws or projects bullets or missiles of any kind by means of elastic force, air, or any explosive substance.

Given my city is including "or any other gun or device" catch all, I'm curious what determines if it is only an infraction or not?

Should I just call the Police and ask directly?

[Jumbi]

I think I have found the best solution. I can sit in my house about 11 yards from a sliding door and shoot to the outside target at 20 yards to a safe target of a 5 gallon bucket on end filled with rubber mulch-very quiet. Behind this bucket would be a .22lr rated metal bullet trap. I would have additional backstop around the trap for any possible errant shots. I have no children to worry about walking in the way, it is just me and my wife.

I think this is the best solution as no one can see or hear me shoot. The pellets hitting the rubber mulch ought to be very quiet as well, and since I am elevated above my surrounding neighbors, they would have no line of sight to my target.

I think I just satisfactorily nullified my original question.

Thank you for the positive replies

[Librarian]

Helps if you identify your city.

In this case, seems to be Pleasant Hill.

Their code says

1.30.010 Criminal penalties.

A. Misdemeanor. A person who violates a provision of this code, or who fails to comply with a requirement of this code, is guilty of a misdemeanor, unless the violation is specifically identified in this code as an infraction or unless the violation is charged as an infraction by the city attorney under PHMC § 1.30.020.

A misdemeanor is punishable by a fine not exceeding $1,000, or imprisonment not exceeding six months, or both. (Govt. Code §§ 36900, 36901.)

B. Infraction. A person who violates a provision of this code, or who fails to comply with a requirement of this code, is guilty of an infraction if the violation is specifically identified in this code as an infraction, or if it is charged as an infraction by the city attorney under PHMC § 1.30.020.

An infraction is punishable by:

1. A fine not exceeding $100.00 for a first violation;

2. A fine not exceeding $200.00 for a second violation of the same code provision within a 12-month period;

3. A fine not exceeding $500.00 for each additional violation of the same code provision within a 12-month period. (Govt. Code § 36900.)

An offense, which would otherwise be an infraction, is a misdemeanor if a person has been convicted of two or more violations of the same code provision within a 12-month period. For the purpose of this subsection, a bail forfeiture is considered a conviction of the offense charged.

An infraction is not punishable by imprisonment. A person charged with an infraction is not entitled to a jury trial or to a public defense unless arrested and not released.

Every day a violation of this code continues constitutes a separate offense. (Ord. 782 § 1, 2004; 1991 code § 1-6.1)

As discharge is not labeled an infraction, misdemeanor.

Just an observation: people are ratted out every day.

[jeremiah12]

I had this happen about 19 years ago. A neighbor kid 2 houses down was shooting his pellet gun in his backyard. My 2 yr old was in our backyard. My son was hit with a pellet above the eye. I knew exactly where it came from because I had complained to the parents several times before.

I called the police and even though the kid and parents denied everything, the embedded pellet above my son's left eye and all the fruit from my trees that had pellet holes in them was more than enough for the police to search the house and find the pellet gun. The kid was 14 and was arrested for assault with a deadly weapon as well as discharging a firearm in city limits.

I was pissed and made it clear that if I ever heard that pellet gun again, I would shove it up the kid's behind.

Well, he ended up doing time in juvenile hall though. That was back when our country still locked up juvenile offenders. The parents were so afraid of me that they made sure their kid admitted to it at the Juvenile hearing because they did not want me to testify.

My suggestion, make sure no neighbor can hear it because all it takes is one to rat you out. Remember, many homes have video cameras. The cameras mounted high in my backyard can also see over the neighbor's fence so I can see if anyone is jumping over to our yard. People also use cell phones to video. A video and a claim of pointing the rifle at someone to intimidate them, or a few stray pellets or BBs in another yard is all that it takes to get LE involved.

You might be better off setting up a shooting gallery inside a garage and playing music to cover the sound if you really have the need to shoot at your residence inside the city. Any ricochet will stay in the building.

Otherwise, just stay legal and go out to some open space where it is legal.

If you do not want to give LE a reason to search your house, then do not try to find ways to violate city ordinances. This way you will not have to pay for the services of an attorney to explain why you thought it was okay, or the ordinance is stupid, or whatever to get you off. Remember, even an arrest for something stays on your record forever in this day and age of the Internet.

[Jumbi]

Originally Posted by jeremiah12

I had this happen about 19 years ago. A neighbor kid 2 houses down was shooting his pellet gun in his backyard. My 2 yr old was in our backyard. My son was hit with a pellet above the eye. I knew exactly where it came from because I had complained to the parents several times before.

I called the police and even though the kid and parents denied everything, the embedded pellet above my son's left eye and all the fruit from my trees that had pellet holes in them was more than enough for the police to search the house and find the pellet gun. The kid was 14 and was arrested for assault with a deadly weapon as well as discharging a firearm in city limits.

I was pissed and made it clear that if I ever heard that pellet gun again, I would shove it up the kid's behind.

Well, he ended up doing time in juvenile hall though. That was back when our country still locked up juvenile offenders. The parents were so afraid of me that they made sure their kid admitted to it at the Juvenile hearing because they did not want me to testify.

My suggestion, make sure no neighbor can hear it because all it takes is one to rat you out. Remember, many homes have video cameras. The cameras mounted high in my backyard can also see over the neighbor's fence so I can see if anyone is jumping over to our yard. People also use cell phones to video. A video and a claim of pointing the rifle at someone to intimidate them, or a few stray pellets or BBs in another yard is all that it takes to get LE involved.

You might be better off setting up a shooting gallery inside a garage and playing music to cover the sound if you really have the need to shoot at your residence inside the city. Any ricochet will stay in the building.

Otherwise, just stay legal and go out to some open space where it is legal.

If you do not want to give LE a reason to search your house, then do not try to find ways to violate city ordinances. This way you will not have to pay for the services of an attorney to explain why you thought it was okay, or the ordinance is stupid, or whatever to get you off. Remember, even an arrest for something stays on your record forever in this day and age of the Internet.

If someone was shooting in this way and shot your kid, they did deserve to do time as they clearly did commit assault with a deadly weapon. No excuse for unsafe activity. Given the numerous pellets in your fruit trees would provide clear evidence of repeat offenses as well as the direction the pellets were fired from, he can't say it wasn't him.

I refuse to shoot in any situation where I do not comply with the critical safety rule of "Know your target and what is beyond it." Safety trumps all "can I get away with it scenarios." First and foremost we as gun owners must demonstrate we are adult enough to handle the responsibility with any projectile weapon, bb gun on up.

Not so interested anymore in shooting in my backyard if it is a misdemeanor. If it was just an infraction I could have handled that with a simple check that would only cover a few trips to the rifle range (which has been closed recently...)

Thank you for your efforts and research.

[Jumbi]

Thank you librarian. That helps quite a bit.

[Half Cocked]

Originally Posted by Jumbi

My city says this: I know the city has this ordinance, but where can I find out the penalty of violating it?
9.35.180 Discharging prohibited.
No person may fire or discharge a firearm, gun, rifle, spring gun, air gun, air rifle, BB gun, pellet gun, sling shot, or other gun or device which throws or projects bullets or missiles of any kind by means of elastic force, air, or any explosive substance.

This shows how stupid these laws can be. It must be a requirement to have a subnormal IQ to be a politician so that you can write garbage like this.



Note that this ordinance specifies elastic force, air, or any explosive substance. It would appear that CO2 powered guns are OK since they are not covered by this ordinance. Also, smokeless powder is a deflagrant, not an explosive, so technically this ordinance does not cover conventional firearms.

[Jumbi]

It also says "or other gun or device" as a catch all....

So,yes, when you throw that tennis ball for your dog in your own backyard, technically, you are committing a jailable offense...

[dbub]

Check the ordinance carefully for your city. Last time I checked San Ramon excluded spring loaded single shot .177 bb guns. So it's nice to have one around the house, to get out in case any one calls the police, whatever you are doing.

[Jumbi]

No such luck in Pleasant Hill.

Selling my airguns and bow.

Might as well be shooting powder burners, hello clay pigeons!