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FFL's Forum For open discussion between FFLs and polite questions for FFLs. |
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DO NOT USE MARTIN B RETTING IN CULVER CITY
Just a quick heads up, my brother drove 45+miles to get to Martin B Rettings in Culver City and was denied selling a gun due to the fact he was not 21 years old.
This shop has no ideas of the laws and refused to provide a California penal code regarding a 20 year old selling a handgun. The gun was transferred to him from our father and the correct DOJ form was filed along with the $19 check prior to him going to sell it. This shop was ignorant and did not treat him as a human being, treating him with no respect and just giving him the "oh you are just a dumb kid routine." Well help spread the word on this shop with a ****ty attitude and refusing services...
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#2
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Can't comment on the attitude, but one point - on a PPT, the seller needs to be able to receive a gun through an FFL, in case the buyer fails background check.
For a handgun, that means the seller must be 21 - both CA and Fed law require 21 for handguns through the FFL. If FFL can't return the gun to the seller, have to dispose of it to LEO. So, while they may not have been thinking of that, could be they saved a potential problem.
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ARCHIVED Calguns Foundation Wiki here: http://web.archive.org/web/201908310...itle=Main_Page "The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."Ann Althouse: “Begin with the hypothesis that what they did is what they wanted to do. If they postured that they wanted to do something else, regard that as a con. Work from there. The world will make much more sense.” Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs. |
#3
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As I understand it can be ppt back to my dad if that was the case?
And they were not thinking of anything like that, they told him it was illegal and they would have to turn him into the DOJ if he tried to sell it.
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Strange that they were rude about it though. Did they call to make arrangements prior to going down there to transfer? |
#5
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Dat Blows!
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Actually I only started collecting Milsurps 3 years ago. I think I might own about 24...They're cheaper than guns that will most likely never get the opportunity to kill somebody... I belong to the group that uses firearms, and knows which bathroom to use. Tis better to have Trolled & lost, Than to never have Trolled, at all. Secret Club Member?. |
#6
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Don't worry I won't. I am an FFL, so I tend not to use other FFLs for PPTs.
Plus like was mentioned, it sounds like they saved your brother from possibly losing his firearm when it had to be turned over to the police if the buyer failed background. Based on this, I wouldn't PPT a gun from a under 20 year old either.
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www.tenpercentfirearms.com was open from 2005 until 2018. I now own Westside Arms. |
#7
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It doesn't matter, my brother will be 21 in less than a month, they could have worked around it if they had to return the gun. I'm always up for a stand up business that will back up us Ca gun owners. They clearly don't care about the customer.
Sad to hear you share the same POV tenpercent... I heard a lot of good about your shop lol.
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Having run my own company I have some insight into what an unhappy customer will perceive as rude and unprofessional. Basically, anything short of them not getting their way.
I have listened in on customer calls, from the very beginning of a call. The employee was polite, empathetic, yet non wavering. When the customer would ask to speak to a manager, I'd wait 10 seconds or so then "get on the line". In most cases whatever came out of the customers mouth next would be a flat out lie. Your staff said this, he told me that, he called me this...Just pure crap. I'd bet you're perspective is skewed because you walked out of there without getting what you wanted. Could they be wrong, possibly, not even related to the point I'm making. Were they rude, no respect, and sh***y attitude like you imply? Not likely. Grow up kid....
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#9
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IIRC, for a pawn return, a 4473 is needed, would it be required for a failed PPT return as well?
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Jack Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA? No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer. |
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Did you copy and paste the same thread from yesterday?
You posted this exact same thread yesterday before changing the title of the thread and deleting all the text. It looks like an exact copy and past of what's below. You seem hell bent on burning Martin B Rettings? Looks like you got your answers from the post below. Link to your original thread is below too.
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=749943 Quote:
Last edited by Powder_Keg; 04-23-2013 at 6:51 AM.. |
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Poor poor OP. Nobody to rant with.
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I would have to agree with the OP on the rudeness of MBR.
I drove 60 miles to purchase a rifle that is fairly difficult to find, Styer SSG (the original green stock ones). Got there, looked over the rifle and said, I'll take it... Handed the salesmen my DL and CCW. He looks at the CCW and says, " what's this for"? I said, since my DL has a PO Box you need my actual address... He looked at me as I was from Mars. Headed to the back came out with his boss... His boss tells me, I can't sell you this rifle, your DL has a PO Box. I said, I know, that's why you have my CCW. He goes on to say he can't use the CCW as proof of residency... OK, I've purchased handguns and rifles with that without issues, he stays the course, nope we can't sell you this rifle. I explained to him then why can I purchase a handgun with the DOJ exemption code X41 that excludes from having a HSC and even proof of residency? The CCW is an govenerment issues ID with a start-end date, my picture, finger print, etc. He had no answer. I told him thanks and you just lost a $3000 sale. So, yes MBR needs to get a better handle on the laws and not be so obtuse. I got into a similar situation with Turners, at least they realized their mistake and sold me the gun. |
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Been a semi-regular customer of MBR for a few years now, and I've definitely noticed a change the feel of the shop over the last year. I think the stress is getting to them. Long lines of panicked and/or low information buyers. Local, state, and federal government agents harassing them at every opportunity. And obnoxious gits like me wanting to do PPTs which net them very little in profit but take up valuable time.
The intra-family/direct ancestor exception is so obscure that most district attorneys don't know about it. I'm not surprised that some clerk at a gun store isn't up on every nuance of CA's rapidly changing legal minefield. I say cut 'em some slack.
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High speed, low drag? Only when stalking donuts. |
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#18
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They didn't save him from anything, they treated him like ****. And there is no going around the law, if they had to return the gun to him he has 30 days to pick it up, within those 30 days he would be 21... Not "going around the law" at all....
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#19
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Where is the part in your story that supports your claim of "I would have to agree with the OP on the rudeness of MBR." Looks like you just didn't get your way.
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#20
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Yea, except for everyone who posted their ****ty experience, and PMed me abut their ****ty experience ...
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#21
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Something is seriously amiss when the basic laws of supply and demand are not functioning, and there is, I am guessing here, one gun store per 1 million people. MBR manages to hang on because they are in Culver City and for reasons that most of us cannot fathom because we are not in the gun business. But they are doing something right. I am sure it is a difficult business. Just look at how many employees MBR has (4-8?) at any moment. What do you think the daily wages are that the owner pays out every day? You think he wants to take a chance of getting screwed for the income of one PPT. They don't always have the best prices. Sometimes the employees are not as patient and charming and you'd hope. But mostly they are. It is a great gun store and an outpost of freedom and hope in this garbage dump of a city. And there is always a great used gun selection to browse. And you can just grab most of those used guns and check them out without the help of a salesperson. How cool is that. Last edited by Tanner68; 04-23-2013 at 8:34 AM.. |
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I've had good and bad at MBR. Last one in Dec. was good,that's all
I remember. Pete
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NRA LIFE (1974) Psalm 46:10 I had a commission/USNR from 71-77 but never consider myself a Vet MyDad+4uncles/USMC/WW2/Korea/Vietnam. My Grandfather US Army WW1. No heroes,just regular folks--they were Veterans. “Do not be deceived.God is not mocked. You will reap what you sow.” |
#24
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Again, this proves to me that the majority of CalGun readers don't understand what CCW can give you. |
#25
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I previously asked: Quote:
Of course NOW you saying things like "The way they spoke to me was completely unacceptable", but you still haven't demonstrated that they were rude. Ignorant of the law, possibly. Rude, I don't see it. Did they call you names? Did they say you were dumb, ignorant, or stupid. Did they start to treat you in a condescending manner? You have made none of these claims. But somehow your disagreement with them, makes you think they were rude. I'll stick to my initial observation due to your lack of demonstration otherwise. Looks like you just didn't get your way. Sorry if I'm being rude......
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#26
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MBR has always come across as snot nosed. They do talk down to customers, I've seen it many times, when I was a regular there. I just happen to find better shops that one, know the law and two, actually have customer service. You can be a shill for them that's fine, but my experiences with MBR is far from acceptable. The beauty is there are many gun shops in and around So. Cal. so dealing with ignorance and lack of customer service is no big deal, just go to another shop.... |
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Well, if you would have said they spoke to you in a condescending manner in any of your previous posts you could have saved yourself this embarrassment.
My new rhetorical question is why would you be a "regular" there, even though they are always "snot nosed" and "talk down to customers" all the while you say there's many LGS in and around So Cal ? /caring /replies
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#28
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Your seller is under 21. So if you continue reading if I cannot legally return the firearm to the seller then I shall forthwith (again, immeidately) deliver the firearm to the sheriff or the chief of police. Now I am not commenting on how your brother was treated as I wasn't there. However, you are flat wrong when you state they could have legally held onto it for 30 days. They legally could not. By processing that PPT, they would put that firearm in jeopardy of being returned to directly to the police. At my store, I don't need to treat you like garbage to explain that. In fact, if it was a rostered pistol I would have offered to transfer it as a regular transfer for $35 like a PPT. That way if the buyer was denied, the gun would not have to be turned over to the police. Then in that case I could have waited for your brother to turn 21 and then DROSed it back to him. They might not have told you any of this and just said they couldn't do it. They might not have treated your correctly. Again, I wasn't there. However, the fact remains it would not have been legal to return the firearm to anyone other than law enforcement immediately after denial of the buyer. It is what it is.
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www.tenpercentfirearms.com was open from 2005 until 2018. I now own Westside Arms. |
#30
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MBR has been randomly good, great, and awesome,.
I've had them find me a AR retaining pin and put it in free of charge. Talk about CMP competition rules and what scopes are a good deal. And I've had a very few interactions that made me say - I don't want to shop there ever again.... The OP was involved in a transaction that would make them no money, had a lot of risk/ complexity with no upside for them.
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The Bigger the Government, the Smaller the Citizen CGF/SAF/FPC Supporter "There are four boxes to be used in the defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury and ammo. Please use in that order. |
#32
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bought a few firearms and ppt'd a couple at MBR. i can say the wait can suck and they can be brusque at times. but overall, they get the job done just fine.
on a side, note, why didn't your brother wait a month till he was 21 to ppt the handgun? |
#33
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#34
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Never had a problem with MBR. They are forced to explain the same rules and argue the same points to a bunch of know it alls, gun nuts, doomsday preppers and the ocassional felons.
After those experiences, I would approach everyone that walked through the door like an a-hole too. I wouldn't risk my dealers license on a transaction I didnt like either. Last edited by dikroundtree; 04-23-2013 at 5:44 PM.. |
#35
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mbr
i agree with others. Cut them some slack. There usually friendly when ive gone there. Also I have yet to buy a gun there. None the less they were always polite over the phone and in person. Took the time to show me firearms and let me grab them to get a feel for them myself with my own hands. Even without me asking to please let me handle the firearm. Have given me recommendations and there opinions. Did not feel as if they were going out there way to make a sale. Seemed more to be going out there way to make sure i understood the gun and caliber and would be happy with it. I have seen way more snotty attitudes and heard stories and heard stories of bad customer service at turners. But have aslo seen and had some good customer service from some managers and employees at turners.
Thinking back on the customer service ive had at mbr. I think they are over due on me giving them some buisness. Ill buy something from them if i find a price i like there. This is America. Thay should have the right to refuse anyone service if they are not comfortable with providing a particular service. whether its ignorance of the law on there behalf or the customer. Op dont be such a sour puss. Dont hold a grudge. Wasting your time anyways. Mbr has been in the area for many years and im sure has plenty regulars. |
#36
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Who was the firearms attorney, let me know so I can stay away from him. |
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You think you know, but you have no idea. The information posted here is not legal advice. If you seek legal advice hire an attorney who is familiar with all the facts of your case. |
#38
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Totally agree. Owning a couple of ARs, Aks and they know it all. And expect FFLs to cater to them. FFLs owe you squat. "Go around the law"?, what a freaking joke! Just be glad MBR didn't spit on them on the way out. |
#39
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I had a Martin Retting employee treat me rudely and indifferently while I was looking at an expensive firearm.
I called the Manager the next day, and he secured the gun for me over the phone, and knocked $100 off the price. They've made their mistakes but overall, I've had a good relationship with the store. Sounds like they were just being cautious about your brother's situation.
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NRA,SAF,CGF CCRKBA member "The price of freedom is eternal vigilance" - Thomas Jefferson |
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