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View Poll Results: What type of BUG do you carry?
Semi auto 31 50.82%
Revolver 25 40.98%
Don’t carry a BUG. 5 8.20%
Voters: 61. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1  
Old 12-15-2017, 8:15 PM
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Default Backup Gun type?

For a BUG, do you carry a revolver, semi auto or non at all?
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  #2  
Old 12-15-2017, 8:33 PM
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Glock 42

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  #3  
Old 12-15-2017, 8:42 PM
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Back up gun absolutely has to work when you need it. I carried a S&W model 42 38 Special 5 shot revolver when I was on patrol. I had total confidence in its function, no doubt.
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Old 12-15-2017, 11:50 PM
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LCP. Not my favorite. Ready to change to a revolver.


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Old 12-16-2017, 12:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by micro911 View Post
Back up gun absolutely has to work when you need it. I carried a S&W model 42 38 Special 5 shot revolver when I was on patrol. I had total confidence in its function, no doubt.
^^^Yes I personally agree. It will work probably 99.9% of the time it’s needed. It can be “burried” in pocket lint and still work. No so with a small semi auto. For a revolver, even if one has a “dead” round it only takes the same trigger finger to rotate a fresh bullet out the barrel. Whereas a semi auto might need two hands to tap n rack a new round. If the primary hand is injured, now what? It still can be done but it’s a lot more difficult and slower.

I love the 642 “air weight” J-frame, but any small wheel-guns will do. A shrouded hammer is even better.
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Old 12-16-2017, 7:21 AM
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Most I seen in my department...

Semi.... LCP 380 or bodyguard 380 sometimes Glock 42, but not much as LCP

Revolver.... s&w j frame
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Old 12-16-2017, 9:25 AM
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I carried a S&W 442 Airweight, however we recently switched to external carrier vests so I am no longer carryimg a BUG until I can find a good location to place it now.
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Old 12-16-2017, 12:01 PM
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Not allowed per Policy. Then again I really shouldn't be putting me and my partner into situations that call for a BUG as a Probation Officer. That said I usually have 76 rounds on me when I get out of the office....
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Old 12-16-2017, 1:21 PM
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I carried a Glock 30. That way I could also use the magazines from my duty gun ( Glock 21) if necessary.
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Old 12-16-2017, 5:00 PM
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I carried a S&W Model 60, 5 shot .38. I had the hammer bobbed so it wouldn't hang up on my pocket. I also carried it off duty.

My dept. had very strict rules as to what we could carry. It used to be a Colt or Smith revolver and that was it. Once we transitioned to the 92F we could still carry those, but we could also carry a Beretta Cougar, but not the Mini Cougar. The Cougar was too big to carry as a bug or off duty IMO and why the dept. wouldn't let us carry the Mini is beyond me. I could be incorrect, but IIRC, there really wasn't anything else allowed. If someone knows otherwise, please enlighten me.

Once I retired and didn't have to follow the overly strict and asinine rules, I stopped carrying the revolver. Once I retired I retired the gun to the safe and began carrying a XDSC 9mm. Did that for about 12 years. Now I carry a 9mm Shield.

I'm glad the deputies on my former dept. have so many more options as to firearms and accessories (i.e. lights/lasers).
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Old 12-16-2017, 5:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpod68 View Post
Not allowed per Policy. Then again I really shouldn't be putting me and my partner into situations that call for a BUG as a Probation Officer. That said I usually have 76 rounds on me when I get out of the office....
You can't, as I'm sure you know, always control the situation and the fact your dept. doesn't permit it is shortsighted and downright stupid IMO. Allowing you to carry a duty weapon but not a BUG seems incomprehensible to me.

The subject of a BUG has come up before in similar threads in the leo forum and I recall there were several leos who worked for police depts. that forbid carrying a BUG on duty. I was shocked to learn a dept. would do that. I know I wouldn't work for one that had that policy and I wasn't alone.

Sorry for the OT OP.
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Old 12-16-2017, 7:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by retired View Post
You can't, as I'm sure you know, always control the situation and the fact your dept. doesn't permit it is shortsighted and downright stupid IMO. Allowing you to carry a duty weapon but not a BUG seems incomprehensible to me.

The subject of a BUG has come up before in similar threads in the leo forum and I recall there were several leos who worked for police depts. that forbid carrying a BUG on duty. I was shocked to learn a dept. would do that. I know I wouldn't work for one that had that policy and I wasn't alone.

Sorry for the OT OP.
Some policies arise from somebody in the past history of the Department doing something stupid. I don't know the story on this one, but I'd sure like to hear it!

That said, our department is pretty good on keeping us prepared, especially compared to other California departments. Quarterly qualifications, decent training (we train for outlier incidents, i.e. Wounded shooter scenarios, malfunction drills, etc.) and EVERYONE can be armed, from Court officers to PRCS supervision officers. In addition we have good collateral training in medical emergency protocols, we are probably one of the few Probation departments that carry tourniquets.

That said, a BUG would be great for when my G22 goes entirely down, my 3.5" folder will probably be inadequate for the rest of the gunfight....

Last edited by dpod68; 12-16-2017 at 7:04 PM..
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  #13  
Old 12-16-2017, 7:07 PM
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Ahhh the all-so often debated topic of revolver or semi auto. The chicken came first, not the egg by the way. At least that’s what POST says.

Things to consider:

Semi auto- keep it reasonably clean and shoot the snot out of it before you carry it. Large manufacturer semis run very well.

Revolver - can be very light and small. Generally work well and can be fired through clothing with bobbed or enclosed hammers.

If you’re wrestling over the gun, grabbing the cylinder of the revolver will prevent it from firing. I’m always shocked at the number of people who don’t know that. The semi will still generally get one round off, then the adventure starts.

Semis are generally flatter and can hide easier in certain spots. Revolvers are generally lighter.

There’s more, but the moral of the story is you need to carry what you’re comfortable/knowledgeable in and get some training, even if it’s from your department’s firearms unit.

That being said, I carry two push daggers where I want them and a high standard 22 mag derringer in a particular pocket. No exposed moving parts and I get two rounds with absolutely nothing anyone can do about it other than kill me before I get them off.

Last edited by GizmoSD; 12-16-2017 at 7:10 PM..
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Old 12-16-2017, 7:21 PM
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I briefly carried a small semi-auto as a BUG while I was working patrol. Gun oil on my A's, lint in every crevice of the weapon, too large and heavy. Legitimate concerns about it being pushed out of battery in a contact shot situation. It was replaced by a Ruger LCR in a DeSantis Superfly holster and I never looked back.
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Old 12-16-2017, 9:23 PM
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I've carried a lot of duty guns... and a lot of backup guns.

I understand both positions... semi auto vs. revolver... and I've carried both. I think I'd still be OK carrying both, especially my S&W 640 which is the best revolver I've ever owned.

That said, I've been carrying a semi auto as a backup for many years, starting with a .45 Mini Cougar, then a .45 S&W CS45, then an M&P9C, then a 9mm Shield, and now a 9mm Glock 43.

I feel more confident with a semi-auto. I understand the potential drawbacks and work/train to mitigate them.

I also carry a Ruger LCP off duty. It goes in my pocket when I wake up in the morning... It's there now... and will not be put away until I go to bed. About every six months I go shoot the magazine I'd been carrying. I watch the lint "poof" out during the first couple shots. Then I'll train with it a bit... 50 to 150 rounds, clean it, and reload it with new duty ammo. I have around 800 rounds through it with exactly zero malfunctions with a variety of ammunition. ZERO. I can't say that for most of my guns, including many of my Glocks and the revolver I carried most as a backup.

At the same time I know another person who had major problems right from the beginning with their LCP and went to a revolver. I won't knock her choice.
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Old 12-16-2017, 11:42 PM
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Glock 19 is my primary weapon, but I usually carry a Glock 26 on most days because it is easier to conceal with a t-shirt and jeans.
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Old 12-17-2017, 2:22 AM
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Ruger LCR .38 on support side.
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Old 12-17-2017, 9:48 PM
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glock 19 or 17 primary, glock 26 or g43 backup.
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Old 12-17-2017, 10:04 PM
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I carry a Glock 17 for duty and a Glock 19 as a backup. Its an easy choice for me.
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Old 12-17-2017, 10:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by retired View Post
I carried a S&W Model 60, 5 shot .38. I had the hammer bobbed so it wouldn't hang up on my pocket. I also carried it off duty.

My dept. had very strict rules as to what we could carry. It used to be a Colt or Smith revolver and that was it. Once we transitioned to the 92F we could still carry those, but we could also carry a Beretta Cougar, but not the Mini Cougar. The Cougar was too big to carry as a bug or off duty IMO and why the dept. wouldn't let us carry the Mini is beyond me. I could be incorrect, but IIRC, there really wasn't anything else allowed. If someone knows otherwise, please enlighten me.

Once I retired and didn't have to follow the overly strict and asinine rules, I stopped carrying the revolver. Once I retired I retired the gun to the safe and began carrying a XDSC 9mm. Did that for about 12 years. Now I carry a 9mm Shield.

I'm glad the deputies on my former dept. have so many more options as to firearms and accessories (i.e. lights/lasers).
You could always carry any S&W revolver, Colt revolver or Ruger SP101 revolver as a back up. Then in the late 80’s early 90’s you could carry several variants of 3rd gen S&W 9mm’s as well as Hk P7’s.

As of the late 2010’s they can basically carry anything they want on or off duty in 9mm or 45 and .380 off duty as well. Beretta, Glock, Sig, Ruger, Hk, Colt 1911’s, S&W, etc.... it’s pretty nice now with all of the options on and off duty.
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Old 12-17-2017, 10:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpod68 View Post
Then again I really shouldn't be putting me and my partner into situations that call for a BUG as a Probation Officer.
I’ll stay polite and try not to get personal, but that’s a lame statement and a careless hap-hazard attitude.

Do you think any cop out there that’s had to revert to his back up gun in order to save his life had the same thought of “I shouldn’t be putting myself into that situation...etc...”

Tell me, what type of “situation” exactly does a LEO place himself into that calls for the need of a BUG? You’re probation, I guess another lame question needs to be asked of, “why do you need a gun at all?...you’re “just” probation.”

Reverting to a BUG has nothing to do with what type of LEO job you have. If you’re issued a primary weapon, you need a back up weapon. If you can’t see that fact, then maybe one shouldn’t even be in that line of work to begin with.
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Old 12-17-2017, 11:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post
I’ll stay polite and try not to get personal, but that’s a lame statement and a careless hap-hazard attitude.

Do you think any cop out there that’s had to revert to his back up gun in order to save his life had the same thought of “I shouldn’t be putting myself into that situation...etc...”

Tell me, what type of “situation” exactly does a LEO place himself into that calls for the need of a BUG? You’re probation, I guess another lame question needs to be asked of, “why do you need a gun at all?...you’re “just” probation.”

Reverting to a BUG has nothing to do with what type of LEO job you have. If you’re issued a primary weapon, you need a back up weapon. If you can’t see that fact, then maybe one shouldn’t even be in that line of work to begin with.
Well, I knew that would open a can of worms.... I totally agree with what you said, and I beieve you didn't get my tone since we are having this discussion on the Interwebs and not face to face.

My department, for better or worse, has a policy to roll out with no less than two (2) officers for field work. You can read between the lines of that policy if you like....

That said my PERSONAL opinion is that if we carry a primary, we should at least have the option to have a BUG. I just happen to work for a department that doesn't allow it
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Old 12-18-2017, 12:57 PM
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I retired 11 years ago today... However before that I carried a S&W M37 with Bianchi grips to shroud the hammer...

Carried it for so many years. I also carried it as a off duty gun, and occasionally still do. Used it to shoot a guy armed with a rifle. It definitely saved my life.

The grips were "relieved" to allow quicker reloading with speed loaders. Some of the checkering on the grips is gone due to carry wear... Totally reliable. I always knew it would go bang.
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Old 12-18-2017, 3:25 PM
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S&W 642 in a pocket with a speed strip

For me the revolver is more shootable than an LCP, and more easily carried and drawn from the pocket than a G43 or G26.

I also like the contact shooting qualities of a revolver.
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Old 12-18-2017, 6:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by retired View Post
You can't, as I'm sure you know, always control the situation and the fact your dept. doesn't permit it is shortsighted and downright stupid IMO. Allowing you to carry a duty weapon but not a BUG seems incomprehensible to me.



The subject of a BUG has come up before in similar threads in the leo forum and I recall there were several leos who worked for police depts. that forbid carrying a BUG on duty. I was shocked to learn a dept. would do that. I know I wouldn't work for one that had that policy and I wasn't alone.



Sorry for the OT OP.


Yeah, I’ve gotta agree with you on this one. I’m an arson investigator and my agency allows BUGs. So do all of my neighboring ones. We definitely don’t control our environment at all times. It’s nice to have that double assurance.


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Old 12-18-2017, 9:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpod68 View Post
That said my PERSONAL opinion is that if we carry a primary, we should at least have the option to have a BUG. I just happen to work for a department that doesn't allow it
I agree with you there and it’s a shame you have to work for a department like that.

I’d carry a BUG concealed anyway and just wouldn’t tell anyone. It’s “onion field” insurance if nothing else. Also, if you were forced to use the BUG in the performance of your duties even though it’s against policy, at least your alive to be fired because of its use. It’s always better to be fired than buried.
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Old 12-18-2017, 10:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SVT-40 View Post
I retired 11 years ago today... However before that I carried a S&W M37 with Bianchi grips to shroud the hammer...

Carried it for so many years. I also carried it as a off duty gun, and occasionally still do. Used it to shoot a guy armed with a rifle. It definitely saved my life.

The grips were "relieved" to allow quicker reloading with speed loaders. Some of the checkering on the grips is gone due to carry wear... Totally reliable. I always knew it would go bang.
That is one beautiful gun with some history! I love old Smith J frames; I miss my old issued Model 60 .38 special for my backup. It had a nice smooth trigger and would go "bang" every time. Only went to a Glock 26 because it was interchangeable with my Glock 19 magazines and the new revolver course was such a PITA.
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Old 12-18-2017, 11:06 PM
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When I was on patrol, 5 shot airweight in off hand back pocket. That way I could get to it if someone was trying to take my primary.
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Old 12-19-2017, 8:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SVT-40 View Post
I retired 11 years ago today... However before that I carried a S&W M37 with Bianchi grips to shroud the hammer...

Carried it for so many years. I also carried it as a off duty gun, and occasionally still do. Used it to shoot a guy armed with a rifle. It definitely saved my life.

The grips were "relieved" to allow quicker reloading with speed loaders. Some of the checkering on the grips is gone due to carry wear... Totally reliable. I always knew it would go bang.
She’s a beaut’ !!!

My partner at work has 9 J-frame variants! He’s beyond the term of a “gun nut.” He has two from the S&W custom performance shop that are just “gems” in and of themselves. While I own four 2” snubbys of various brands (S&W 640, 642, Ruger SP101 & Colt Detective spl.), I never appreciated nor really fell in love with the small revolvers, until years later in my career.
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Last edited by TrailerparkTrash; 12-19-2017 at 8:17 PM..
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Old 12-25-2017, 8:55 PM
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S&W 642 “Airweight” .38spl
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Old 12-27-2017, 11:04 AM
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G43 with TT +2 and +P 9mm rounds. 9 rounds for SHTF
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Old 12-27-2017, 11:24 AM
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LCR 38. Too much can go wrong with semi auto buried under my uniform. LCR is small, light and I can just keep squeezin til it goes bang. Little room for failure.
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