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FFL's Forum For open discussion between FFLs and polite questions for FFLs. |
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Need a hand with Proof of Residency
So all I was able to find was a W-2 form and a bank statement, and after some searching found out that these are not acceptable forms of proof. I don't have my name tied to any type of vehicle registration or utility bills. I am not able to draw up a rental agreement with my parents (who own the residence) because they do not support my decision to get a handgun (not because they hate guns or don't trust me with one, it is more a financial situation).
So I was wondering what my options were, is there some sort of form I can get a print out of with proof at a DMV? I am also a student/employee of a California State University if it makes any difference. And AAA member, I mention this because I have read stories of other Calguns members getting proof through them. |
#2
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http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=327217
You need a government issued document with an expiration date. I would suggest getting a hunting or fishing license. Your pay stub from the state would work for a long gun, but you need an expiration date for the state proof of residency requirement. Your parents still manage your finances at the age of 21 or older? Or do you owe them money and they don't like going to the back of the line?
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www.tenpercentfirearms.com was open from 2005 until 2018. I now own Westside Arms. |
#3
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It's more a situation where they suggest I put money into savings account for rainy days or my last year of college.(A very firm suggestion, even though I already have some funds allocated.)
I read somewhere that it is also possible to use a driving record print out from the DMV, but I'm not entirely sure that the print out comes with an address. The hunting license seems like a good idea, but I'll try and find out about that DMV printout first as that seems to be the least amount of effort and cost. Edit: Double checked the form I received from the FFL dealer, Hunting and Fishing licences do not count as proof. Last edited by ShadowSociety; 02-24-2013 at 9:39 AM.. |
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The DOJ FAQ says: Government-issued (city, county, special district, state or federal) documentation that has all of the following - - This does not include a drivers license or DMV-issued ID card: The name of the transferee as it appears on the transferee's CDL or CID. The name of the transferee as the transferee declares on the DROS form. The residential address of the transferee as it appears on the transferee's CDL or CID or the address update attachment to the driver's license/identification card. The residential address of the transferee as the transferee declares on the DROS form. Young buyers are often in this situation where parents disapprove. I accepted a sample ballot for one transaction. I just want to be able to show that it was something within the last 90 days like for utility bills. Greg David Eddy's Shooting Sports 400 Moffett Blvd.,Suite F Mountain View, CA 94043 (660)969-GUNS T-F 12-7 W 12-9 Sat 11-5 Closed Sun/Mon
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Greg David Eddy's Shooting Sports (650)969-GUNS 400 Moffett Blvd., Suite F Mountain View, CA 94043 www.eddysguns.com Tue-Fri 12-7, Sat 11-5 |
#5
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My W-2 was issued by a CSU(a state agency), as a vendor would you accept something like this?
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#6
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DMV printout does not have a period of validity nor expiration date.
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www.tenpercentfirearms.com was open from 2005 until 2018. I now own Westside Arms. |
#7
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We just had a DOJ inspection last week and the DOJ inspector told us that a fishing license does not count anymore even if it is printed out because the system that is used to issue the license just pulls the address from their DMV issued license. We specifically asked about this scenario.
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Elite Armory 3636 Castro Valley Blvd #1 Castro Valley, CA 94546 (510) 538-1686 Hours: Tues-Sat: 11:00am-6:30pm Elite Armory Plus 7601 W 11th Street Tracy, CA 95304 (209) 362-2010 Hours: Tues-Fri: 11:00am - 7:00pm Sat-Sun: 10:00am - 8:00pm *Follow us on Twitter and/or FaceBook for updates on what we have coming into the shop. Last edited by Elite Armory; 02-25-2013 at 10:17 PM.. |
#9
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Drivers license and/or State ID do not work as proof of residency.
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Elite Armory 3636 Castro Valley Blvd #1 Castro Valley, CA 94546 (510) 538-1686 Hours: Tues-Sat: 11:00am-6:30pm Elite Armory Plus 7601 W 11th Street Tracy, CA 95304 (209) 362-2010 Hours: Tues-Fri: 11:00am - 7:00pm Sat-Sun: 10:00am - 8:00pm *Follow us on Twitter and/or FaceBook for updates on what we have coming into the shop. |
#10
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sorry to side track but didnt want to start a new thread
would a DL that is issued in one county ( a PO BOX) and a car registration issued in my current county and residence(Street addy) cause a issue in a handgun PPT ? or would i need some other form of ID for the transaction ?
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Last edited by Jeepers; 02-25-2013 at 11:00 PM.. |
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I had them tell me on the phone it was legit so I am using it. We could also argue they ordered it online and had it sent to them. That most certainly is a government issued document with an expiration date. I wonder if we should start working on getting a definitive answer on this or if not having a definitive answer works better for us. Quote:
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www.tenpercentfirearms.com was open from 2005 until 2018. I now own Westside Arms. |
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If you look at most government documents, the address comes from your DMV ID/DL, so it is all a bit of a bad joke. I heard that the reason why a DL/ID is not acceptable is because some people live in NV, but work in CA and need a CA DL. The DL should show the NV residence address though, so that really does not make sense. This issue also is only for handguns.
The only reason to push the issue is to see if you can get the DOJ to understand that a CA DL/ID should be acceptable proof of residency.
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Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein |
#13
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Thanks Wes sure wish i was closer to your shop
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#14
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Proof of residency is required to get a CA DL/ID, are you having problems finding that
documentation? Or do your parents have it locked up and you are looking for a work around?
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_____________________________________________ "The key to immortality is first living a life worth remembering." _____________________________________________ www.KEOKEphotography.com |
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Last edited by Jeepers; 08-07-2015 at 10:11 AM.. |
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DOJ OAG site has a list of approved Proof of Residency documents: http://oag.ca.gov/firearms/resprf but does not state the codes. "Under Bureau of Firearms policy and soon to be proposed in regulations, firearms dealers may accept any of the following:"
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Toby's Tactical 07FFL/02SOT Mountain View, CA |
#18
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It is a requirement from CA & Feds., so it is not just a store policy (although their store policy is wrong). As a side note, it is not a second proof of residency, it is a proof of residence since CA does not accept a CA ID/DL as proof of residency for handguns.
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Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein |
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#20
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they are wrong, your current car registration with your current street address on it is all you legally need to comply with CA and federal law.
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Jack Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA? No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer. |
#21
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kinda what i thought also from what i have read but was not sure the laws change so much all the time this is the first handgun i have bought in many year ... last few i bought i had to get a BFSC and when that changed i stopped buying until recently ... anywho i will bring in what they want and find a different shop ....
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#22
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[QUOTE=tenpercentfirearms;10633863]Not sure which FAQ you are on, but here is the one I am on. http://oag.ca.gov/firearms/dlrfaqs#33G
http://oag.ca.gov/firearms/resprf Different page. Different info. The one you quote says "license, permit, or registration" WITH expiration date. The page I'm quoting simply says "government issued documentation" and has no expiration requirement. Which is correct? Greg David Eddy's Shooting Sports 400 Moffett Blvd.,Suite F Mountain View, CA 94043 (660)969-GUNS T-F 12-7 Sat 11-5 Closed Sun/Mon
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Greg David Eddy's Shooting Sports (650)969-GUNS 400 Moffett Blvd., Suite F Mountain View, CA 94043 www.eddysguns.com Tue-Fri 12-7, Sat 11-5 |
#23
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both are just FAQs, look at the actual regulations and you'll see this:
11 CCR § 4045
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Jack Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA? No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer. |
#24
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Why does DOJ put bad info in their FAQ's? Any reasonable person would assume guidelines given in an official FAQ would be supported by actual law.
I guess I better print out both FAQ's and I hope I don't have to use them in an audit... Greg David Eddy's Shooting Sports 400 Moffett Blvd.,Suite F Mountain View, CA 94043 (660)969-GUNS T-F 12-7 Sat 11-5 Closed Sun/Mon
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Greg David Eddy's Shooting Sports (650)969-GUNS 400 Moffett Blvd., Suite F Mountain View, CA 94043 www.eddysguns.com Tue-Fri 12-7, Sat 11-5 |
#25
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Figure I might as well ask here since the FFLs all seem to be here too. I am running into a similar problem. Car and home are registered in my girlfriends name (she got a better rate through her credit union than we could together), and while I am "on" the utilities, the only one I have that displays my name when sent is the water bill.
Last week I brought my DL and water bill with for my purchase last week and my FFL said I need something else and listed a bunch of bills or car registration which of course I don't have. Since my license displayed my previous address (we moved a month ago), would getting an updated license from the DMV work or do I really need to find some other bill? Thanks guys! |
#26
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Who is going to force them to be accurate?
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Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein |
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Greg David Eddy's Shooting Sports (650)969-GUNS 400 Moffett Blvd., Suite F Mountain View, CA 94043 www.eddysguns.com Tue-Fri 12-7, Sat 11-5 |
#28
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Just so you know, the Penal Code citations on the DOJ BOF site are the old code sections which were changed two years ago. This is also on their website, and is out of date: http://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/ag...s/Cfl2007.pdf? Good luck with documenting your compliance with statutes based your reliance with these DOJ Internet FAQs. Now that you've identified a conflict between entries, your defense of innocent reliance is gone. Best. JR |
#29
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So how does a person who doesn't have a permanent residence obtain a handgun? Gypsies are screwed or what?
Never thought about it before now.. but how does one have to have residency in order to exercise a right?
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NRA Member The Constitution does not bestow wisdom. It's up to the body politic to be wise. -Patriot All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing. -Edmund Burke I'd much rather go to my grave never needing my gun, than go there wishing I had it. - Phil Dalmolin The Battle of Athens was illegal too. |
#30
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Ok, since quite a while i use my Calif Real Estate Brokers licence (govt issued, expiration date, my name and address appearing). It is a perfect document, as is any other similar professional licence--State Bar, Accounting, Medical, Architecural, Pest Control, etc)
2. I have used a new, current Social Security statement. I went to an SS office, got a current printout of my benefits and took that in also. In light of having the RE licence the SS statement would be redundant. 3. I have used an IRS Estimated Tax Statement which many of us get every year in the mail--(again, govt issued, name and address appearing, dated within 90 days of the purchase). 4. If a person doesnt own the place where they live and have no rental agreement, a signed letter from the owner that you live there, accompanied by a copy of the Grant Deed also works. These alternatives arent on the list of usual suspects but they meet the guideline so they are acceptable.
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Slim River Carry Slings for Henry AR-7 |
#31
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I overheard during a transaction at another retailer that residence/hardline phone service statement/bill is not acceptable. When I asked the cashier as I was checking out with my paper targets why they no longer accept residence phone bills, she said it's because the address for the account can be set up and used and mailed elsewhere. I was in a hurry and didn't try to clarify, but I was thinking that I also have utility statements and vehicle registrations with addresses (for my business) that is mailed to another address. Is this a new standard or trend for secondary forms of residency? Just curious.
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#32
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www.tenpercentfirearms.com was open from 2005 until 2018. I now own Westside Arms. |
#33
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No change, but places do sometimes make up rules.
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Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein |
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Check with Turners in Chino Hills. They do not accept residence phone bill as secondary proof of residency. I was just there this afternoon. I was just asking the more knowledgeable folks here if this is something I need to be aware of as a larger trend going forward, perhaps there was an update sent to FFLs since I'm not an FFL similar to sales tax updates sent from the BOE to retailers, etc. Thanks for the accusation, though. It sure makes asking about this stuff to be better informed so welcoming.
Last edited by Vin63; 05-17-2013 at 4:13 PM.. Reason: typo |
#35
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Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein |
#36
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There isn't anything more to discuss. The gun shop is making up their own rules. You can find all of the rules here. http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=327217
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www.tenpercentfirearms.com was open from 2005 until 2018. I now own Westside Arms. |
#37
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Off topic, but, can I get a definitive yes or no on new voter registration card for proof of residency? My girlfriend is shopping for a new 10/22 and her DL address is not current, and all utilities are in my name. We only have a copy of the lease.
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#38
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I did the same thing for my first handgun
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#39
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Is it a government issued document? Then yes it works for proof of residency for the Feds when your DL/ID address does not match your 4473 address.
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www.tenpercentfirearms.com was open from 2005 until 2018. I now own Westside Arms. |
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