2014 CA State IDPA Championship

[John M]

The Sacramento Defensive Pistol Shooters will be hosting the 2014 CA State Championship again this year. The match will be held the first Sat in Oct. Look for signups in a few months..

[Hank15]

What are the qualifications/requirements to sign up for the state championship?

[reckoner]

Excellent! I had a great time at last year's match.

[John M]

The requirements are... you must be an IDPA member, have shot a classifier within one year, and have a classification of Marksman or higher.

[Jerrywho]

Great match last year, Thanks.
looking forward to this years match.

Jerry

[fullrearview]

I'll be shooting Sig this year so no broken Glocks!!!!

[HighLander51]

Originally Posted by fullrearview

I'll be shooting Sig this year so no broken Glocks!!!!

And what exactly did you manage to break on a OEM Glock?

[RoundEye]

Awesome, looking forward to it. I had a great time last year as well, and I'll be working on ammo loads a little extra this year to prevent a future FTF from occurring inside a dark freezer!

[gsxr13]

Afternoon gents, I'm just curious if anyone knows of any camp sites near the range? I'm still doing some research but I thought I'd ask to see if anyone had good intel. Thanks

[RoundEye]

Originally Posted by gsxr13

Afternoon gents, I'm just curious if anyone knows of any camp sites near the range? I'm still doing some research but I thought I'd ask to see if anyone had good intel. Thanks

None that I know of. I stayed at La Quinta just down the way last year.

[rmatt]

Probably in Ione is your closest bet. Ask the range if you can camp there would be my first choice.

[galekowitz]

I'm looking forward to it! This will be my third trip to this Championship.

Now, do I stay in the haunted hotel in Ione again??

[PM720]

Any chance we could talk them into backing this up a week?

Scott

[RoundEye]

Originally Posted by PM720

Any chance we could talk them into backing this up a week?

Scott

Uh oh...

[Gryff]

Rancho Seco is about 15 miles away. It appears they have RV and camp sites at the lake.

https://www.smud.org/en/about-smud/c...-seco-lake.htm

[gsxr13]

Awesome thanks for the help, camanche (yes that's how they spelled it) & pardee reservoirs are roughly 1/2hr away & look pretty nice too if anyone is interested in camping as well. Matt you had the best answer I'll be calling tomorrow to check on camping there.

[fullrearview]

Originally Posted by HighLander51

And what exactly did you manage to break on a OEM Glock?

Slide stop spring... Broke it on the stage with the gun box and tech...

turned into a single shot weapon with 6 targets left... After about 4 tap racks and mag strips, I finally figured it out. Added about 60 seconds overall, between that and the final stage... I finished about 60 seconds from the leader in my class and division.

[John M]

If you have an RV you can camp at the range, there are no hookups tho..

[John M]

Match preparations are in full swing. . We ordered three (3) Dillon reloaders, 2 650's and a 550 for raffle prizes. These will be available to all entrants, no need to buy raffle tickets. . More good stuff coming.

[PM720]

When are you going to announce a date change? A week later will be just fine thank you very much!

Scott

[rmatt]

sweet prizes!!

[titigasss]

When do they announce the date for CA IDPA state match

[John M]

The date is OCt 4th.. The match webiste should be up and running very soon. Check the club website at www.sdps-idpa.org

[fullrearview]

John, is there going to be a better understanding of the rules this year? Or to put it better... Are they going to be enforced properly?

[Gryff]

Originally Posted by fullrearview

John, is there going to be a better understanding of the rules this year? Or to put it better... Are they going to be enforced properly?

What rules were enforced improperly last year?

[fullrearview]

Well... Misinterpretations maybe, but it's out of hand. No where else is it ran like a concentration camp.

1: Front slide serrations... SLIDE LIGHTENING!
2: Drawing from a holster and "sweeping" your leg...
3: Reaching over the rope on a hot range to get your eye pro and getting DQ'ed
4: Having a gun box that is out of spec, then DQ'ing someone when his gun doesn't fit with ONE out of the seven mags he has

Overall, it was well run but a few of the guys that are regulars are way over the top on things. When I shoot down there, I get procedurals galore from a certain person and it always feels like he does it just because we shoot the same division... Even when I walk a stage and take my time, I get them.

[Scotty]

Originally Posted by fullrearview

1: Front slide serrations... SLIDE LIGHTENING!
2: Drawing from a holster and "sweeping" your leg...
3: Reaching over the rope on a hot range to get your eye pro and getting DQ'ed
4: Having a gun box that is out of spec, then DQ'ing someone when his gun doesn't fit with ONE out of the seven mags he has

1. Was the shooter in ESP or CDP? Not legal in SSP.
Excluded features and modifications: 8.2.2.3.2/8.2.3.3.2. Removal of material from the exterior of the slide other than front cocking serrations, tri-top,
engraving, carry melts, and high power cuts.

2. Sweeping leg is a DQ.
2.2.1. Endangering any person, including yourself. This includes sweeping one’s self or anyone else with a
loaded or unloaded firearm. Sweeping is defined as allowing the muzzle of the firearm (loaded or
unloaded) to cross or cover any portion of a person.
2.2.1.1. Exception: Some body types combined with some holster types makes it almost impossible to
holster a firearm or remove the firearm from the holster without sweeping a portion of the shooter’s
lower extremities. Thus, a match disqualification is not applicable for sweeping of the shooter’s own
body below the belt while removing the firearm from the holster or holstering of the firearm, provided
that the shooter’s trigger finger is clearly outside of the trigger guard. However, once the muzzle of the
firearm is clear of the holster on the draw, sweeping any part of the body is a Disqualification.

3. ?

4. The firearm with the largest magazine inserted must fit in the IDPA gun test box measuring
8 ¾” x 6” x 1 5/8”.

IDPA has also clarified the issue with box tolerance.

Question: All IDPA boxes are not the same size. At one local club the wood box measures very close to
spec in width but 1/16" under spec in length, at another local club the box measures slightly under spec in
both length and width.
Answer: The IDPA gun test box has an allowed dimensional tolerance of -0” and +1/16”. Boxes outside
this tolerance range may not be used in IDPA matches for equipment checks or for “gun in the box” starts.
 The width of an IDPA gun test box can be from 8 3/4” to 8 13/16”.
 The height of an IDPA gun test box can be from 6” to 6 1/16”.
 The depth of an IDPA gun test box can be from 1 5/8” to 1 11/16”

[PM720]

Sweeping the leg should be a DQ and every stage I shot where that was a possibility we were cautioned on that and what would happen. The reaching over the rope thing seems a bit extreme but I guess it would depend on how far you reached maybe? As in did you push the tape 6 feet and then reach over? I thought all the bags were within reach in that stage but my memory is a little fuzzy. Were all the mags the same capacity with the exact same bases?

Scott

[fullrearview]

Originally Posted by Scotty

1. Was the shooter in ESP or CDP? Not legal in SSP.
Excluded features and modifications: 8.2.2.3.2/8.2.3.3.2. Removal of material from the exterior of the slide other than front cocking serrations, tri-top,
engraving, carry melts, and high power cuts.

CDP. And they were front cocking serrations.

2. Sweeping leg is a DQ.
2.2.1. Endangering any person, including yourself. This includes sweeping one’s self or anyone else with a
loaded or unloaded firearm. Sweeping is defined as allowing the muzzle of the firearm (loaded or
unloaded) to cross or cover any portion of a person.
2.2.1.1. Exception: Some body types combined with some holster types makes it almost impossible to
holster a firearm or remove the firearm from the holster without sweeping a portion of the shooter’s
lower extremities. Thus, a match disqualification is not applicable for sweeping of the shooter’s own
body below the belt while removing the firearm from the holster or holstering of the firearm, provided
that the shooter’s trigger finger is clearly outside of the trigger guard. However, once the muzzle of the
firearm is clear of the holster on the draw, sweeping any part of the body is a Disqualification.

In bold.

3. ?

For one stage, we all lined up, made our guns hot, then were ordered to stay in the bay for the duration of the stage. One shooter reached over the boundary rope, and was DQed.

4. The firearm with the largest magazine inserted must fit in the IDPA gun test box measuring
8 ¾” x 6” x 1 5/8”.

IDPA has also clarified the issue with box tolerance.

Question: All IDPA boxes are not the same size. At one local club the wood box measures very close to
spec in width but 1/16" under spec in length, at another local club the box measures slightly under spec in
both length and width.
Answer: The IDPA gun test box has an allowed dimensional tolerance of -0” and +1/16”. Boxes outside
this tolerance range may not be used in IDPA matches for equipment checks or for “gun in the box” starts.
 The width of an IDPA gun test box can be from 8 3/4” to 8 13/16”.
 The height of an IDPA gun test box can be from 6” to 6 1/16”.
 The depth of an IDPA gun test box can be from 1 5/8” to 1 11/16”

The box was out of spec.

[RoundEye]

Originally Posted by fullrearview

2.2.1.1. Exception: ...However, once the muzzle of the firearm is clear of the holster on the draw, sweeping any part of the body is a Disqualification.

If I recall correctly, I think you're referring to the boat stage, and as you indicated in bold above if you sweep yourself after your muzzle has cleared the holster you're going to get DQ'd. The squad I was on was cautioned about this, and when it was my turn to run I made sure that my legs were offset enough to prevent an unintentional sweeping once my muzzle cleared the holster.

I am of the opinion that you if swept yourself after clearing the holster (up stroke), and you were DQ'd, it was rightly earned.

Other than that, I am not sure what else you could be referring too.

[John M]

Fullrearview.. I am not aware of any of the issues you speak.. Yes there were DQ's on the boat stage and from what I recall they were all deserved.

The IDPA box was within specs and the DQ was the correct call.

Font cocking serrations?? Most of my 1911's have them from the factory, are you implying one gun out of the entrie match (174) had an illegal mod and it was missed? Front cocking serrations and slide lightening are two different things.

My real issue with your post is this, after the match last year we sent out surveys and more than welcomed responses and feedback. I am not sure what your motivation is other then to sling mud. Maybe just opt to sit this one out this year and find a sanctioned match in NV to shoot.

If you have an issue with a particular SO and you know his or her name, please forward (PM) me a name and detail your issue. I will do my best to ensure fairness as I too have been subjected to bad calls by certain SO's.

[Scotty]

Originally Posted by fullrearview

The box was out of spec.

Not according to the SO that was there who measured the box.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...&postcount=194

[Gryff]

Originally Posted by John M

I am not sure what your motivation is other then to sling mud. Maybe just opt to sit this one out this year and find a sanctioned match in NV to shoot.

I have a mixed response to this comment. On one hand, it's easy to criticize when you've never ran a large match. On the other hand, it's kind of uncool for a match official to suggest that a shooter not shoot their match because they voiced an opinion.

Originally Posted by Scotty

Not according to the SO that was there who measured the box.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...&postcount=194

I've worked with Stretch at the Sanctioned Matches I've run. He knows the rule book better than I do. And while it sounds like the box was out of spec, the variance benefited the shooter. Not sure how someone could complain about DNFing under those circumstances.

Hell, I DNF'd last year's match. My gun was something like 8 grams overweight (about 0.3 ounces...I had no idea that Pachmayr grips would push a stock S&W 686 into illegal territory) and my factory ammo didn't make power. But that is, without question, all on me. Big boy rules...bring legal gear or don't whine if you suffer the consequences (including complaining that you didn't know your gear was illegal...that whine just makes me nuts).

[John M]

Jim, an opinion is one thing, misstating the facts is another.. My point is, if you dont like how our match is run, dont shoot it.

We elicited shooter feedback, both good and bad and made changes. There was a time and place for it.

[fullrearview]

Originally Posted by John M

Fullrearview.. I am not aware of any of the issues you speak.. Yes there were DQ's on the boat stage and from what I recall they were all deserved.

The IDPA box was within specs and the DQ was the correct call.

Font cocking serrations?? Most of my 1911's have them from the factory, are you implying one gun out of the entrie match (174) had an illegal mod and it was missed? Front cocking serrations and slide lightening are two different things.

My real issue with your post is this, after the match last year we sent out surveys and more than welcomed responses and feedback. I am not sure what your motivation is other then to sling mud. Maybe just opt to sit this one out this year and find a sanctioned match in NV to shoot.

If you have an issue with a particular SO and you know his or her name, please forward (PM) me a name and detail your issue. I will do my best to ensure fairness as I too have been subjected to bad calls by certain SO's.

John, it's not my intention to sling mud. Like I said it was well run overall. I'm still skeptical about the box, but it is what it is. I don't think I ever got a survey, but no biggie.

I was not DQed but I saw it all unfold with the gun... Even if the MD ruled the box was out of spec, the shooter was told his gun with factory front cocking serrations, was actually slide lightening and we would have been DQed either way. He was later sent home for reaching over the rope to get his ears.

The shooter who "swept" his leg was well aware of the danger, positioned himself properly, but was DQed... Oddly enough, no one yelled stop and he wasn't told until after he was at the back of the bay. It there is a safety problem, call it like it should be.

There is one specific member who does issue P's like candy from a panel van, but I'm not going to name names. He seems to issue them to those who are in his class and division more frequently. It may be coincidence, so I'll reserve it for now.

I will likely return if I can fit it in. I think you guys are a great club but the problems likely stem from IDPA in general. IDPA has done a horrible job at clarifying things, making new rules just to make rules. They appear to only be interested in taking our money.

[John M]

All good.. we are more then willing to address issues if we are aware of them. See you in Oct

[RoundEye]

Originally Posted by fullrearview

IDPA has done a horrible job at clarifying things, making new rules just to make rules. They appear to only be interested in taking our money.

I disagree, and somewhat take offense to this statement. Just to be clear, other than being a member who enjoys shooting sanctioned matches, I'm not affiliated with National IDPA in any way.

Recently, I did have the opportunity to sit down with Joyce and asked her probably most of the questions on everyone's mind about the rules changes, and to be honest, she had a good answer for all of them. The rules are to preserve the ideals the founders intended, and make officiating easier on all ROs.

If you don't like the rules, I am sure the Tiger Team that is running the rule changes would be happy to hear from you.

[Gryff]

Originally Posted by RoundEye

I disagree, and somewhat take offense to this statement....The rules are to preserve the ideals the founders intended, and make officiating easier on all ROs.

Actually, I agree somewhat with rearview. The organization is not member-driven, and only makes changes when they start to feel embarrassed about neglecting member needs and concerns for so long. Until national management makes the sport more answerable to the paying membership (or ownership changes), the game's success will ride solely on the backs of quality local clubs like Sacramento.

[RoundEye]

Originally Posted by Gryff

Actually, I agree somewhat with rearview. The organization is not member-driven, and only makes changes when they start to feel embarrassed about neglecting member needs and concerns for so long. Until national management makes the sport more answerable to the paying membership (or ownership changes), the game's success will ride solely on the backs of quality local clubs like Sacramento.

I'm not sure I agree. The Tiger Teams are solely member driven, you just have to volunteer, to be on one. I agree, that it is an East Coast bias organization, so the people on the left coast may be disenfranchised. However, if you don't vote, you can't legitimately complain.

[Bob Hostetter]

Actually volunteering to be on a Tiger Team does not get you on one. I know of several people who volunteered and weren't selected. IDPA HQ's approach has never been to be open or sensitive to members issues. I have enjoyed shooting DIPA matches for the most part but you have to take the rules (and sometimes the enforcement of them) with a grain of salt. Often times to win you have to win by a bunch to make sure, otherwise ...