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FFL's Forum For open discussion between FFLs and polite questions for FFLs. |
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#1
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interstate intrafamily handgun transfer illegal clip
oregon resident father has owned a handgun for 30 years approximately and wants to give it to his son. I read the wiki laws section that requires a FFL transfer (accompanied by a note of gift details) to comply with federal law. my concern is this is an "illegal california gun" because it has a 14-round mag clip. does this matter? the gun and clip were made (and it was bought) long before the CA 10-round Max clip law was passed. thanks
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#2
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The gun itself is fine, and the father could transfer the magazines IF he disassembles them into kits, and the son never re-assembles them inside CA.
However, the son will need an appropriate magazine, 10 rounds or under, to perform the safety demonstration. Blocking one of the disassembled ones to 10 and reassembling it would work.
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ARCHIVED Calguns Foundation Wiki here: http://web.archive.org/web/201908310...itle=Main_Page "The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."Ann Althouse: “Begin with the hypothesis that what they did is what they wanted to do. If they postured that they wanted to do something else, regard that as a con. Work from there. The world will make much more sense.” Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs. |
#3
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thanks librarian. so the 14-round clip could never be used legally in CA, only owned assuming it stayed unassambled. would getting the 10-round clip for the FFL transfer and just leaving the 14-round clip in Oregon be the easiest? I thought since it was intrafamily and owned before the 10-round Clio law, it could legally be "grandfathered in" for owning and use by the CA resident son
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#4
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Sadly, no grandfathering of 11+ mags.
If the gun has 10-rounders available, getting some of those would be easiest. Then, ship to a convenient CA FFL, 10-day wait and all the usual requirements (except the Roster), and nice new-to-CA gun!
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ARCHIVED Calguns Foundation Wiki here: http://web.archive.org/web/201908310...itle=Main_Page "The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."Ann Althouse: “Begin with the hypothesis that what they did is what they wanted to do. If they postured that they wanted to do something else, regard that as a con. Work from there. The world will make much more sense.” Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs. |
#5
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First, it is a magazine, not a clip.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clip_%28ammunition%29 The second thing is handguns not on the certified list are NOT illegal in CA, but the transfer of the firearms are restricted for dealer sales. PPTs, intrafamilial transfers, dual residents, new residents are exemptions which allow the firearm to be transferred and/or brought into CA. There is no restriction of doing the HSC safety demo in terms of the magazine size. It can be done with a so-called high capacity magazine, but the magazine can not be transferred. According to the CA DOJ, a FFL can modify a magazine to limit it to 10 rounds, but can not take apart a magazine and sell it as a parts kits.
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Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein |
#7
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Quote:
PC 32310 (http://law.onecle.com/california/penal/32310.html) PC 16740 (http://law.onecle.com/california/penal/16740.html) Just saying'. But the key here is that the OP cannot bring the large cap mag into the state to do the demonstration. JR |
#8
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Where is it written that you can take it apart? You would need to log the magazine when you receive it, but then you would need to document what you did with it.
That is what I was told by the DOJ, which does not mean that it is correct (aka the law), but that is who you are going to have to deal with if they decide that it is a problem, so the question is whether it is worth the risk to you. Quote:
Quote:
http://law.onecle.com/california/penal/32410.html http://law.onecle.com/california/penal/32430.html
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Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein |
#9
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Absolutely and completely FUD
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Golden State Tactical <---click here > An FORMER Outpost Deep In the Heart of the Beast! Home of "California Compliant" AR15 Parts and Magazines and some of the lowest priced guns in the state!!! |
#10
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That is what the CA DOJ said and part of the problem is that they are the ones who deal with it. If you get the complete magazine in, you need to log it in. If you take it apart, then you need to document that. Where does it say what the process is? Perhaps you can do it and perhaps you can't, but the fact is that the DOJ can harass you for doing it.
Where does it say what the process is? Where does it say you can do it?
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Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein |
#11
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Quote:
No. We are in California, and this is "Calguns.net". This discussion centers on California law. The name in California Penal Code is "large-capacity" magazine. That is not the "so-called" name; it is the "properly-called" name in California. It's not confusing at all. Until you start using "standard" capacity. Since California law identifies any +10 round magazine as large-capacity, what is "standard"? Is it anything with 10 or less? Ruger LC9 has 7; Glocks may come with 6; Springfield 1911 has 7, or 8, or 9 or 10. It's only confusing because you attempt to confuse it with a nonsensical term like "standard". So, the term "standard" magazine has no meaning in California. So why use it? Its only value is to reference that, some 13 years ago, large capacity magazines were "standard" from manufacturers. That ship has sailed, and continued reference is simply delusional propaganda. (See, I do agree with you). (Note: all questions above are rhetorical and therefore do not require an answer.) Quote:
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Cheers, JR Last edited by Dvrjon; 03-26-2013 at 10:17 AM.. |
#12
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Quote:
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High capacity is NOT the proper name as it is the standard capacity magazine in the Free States. If CA wanted to call such magazines "uber-capacity baby killing magazines used only by criminals" and used that term in the CA PC, would you also then consider that the "proper" term? Quote:
I don't attempt to confuse anyone, although you appear to be confused. I stated it because people need to understand that it is actually the standard and that it is only a so-called high capacity magazine. Quote:
It is not delusional propaganda, it is the reality, but you seem to have swallowed it hook, line and sinker. Quote:
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Actually it is not a license, so you are wrong there. You claim to want to be accurate, then do so. So do you know what it really is? I doubt it, but you might look it up and claim that you know, but since you incorrectly called it a "license", you don't know. Your assumptions are also incorrect as it is not a bad practice since the magazine could be sold. It would be a worse practice to throw it away and pay for it and not get anything from it.
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Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein Last edited by kemasa; 03-26-2013 at 10:42 AM.. |
#13
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This again?
I thought this had been settled: * when talking specifically about CA law, use the legal term 'large-capacity' magazine; stupid or not, it has a specific meaning. * in other contexts, use what you like - most people can figure it out.
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ARCHIVED Calguns Foundation Wiki here: http://web.archive.org/web/201908310...itle=Main_Page "The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."Ann Althouse: “Begin with the hypothesis that what they did is what they wanted to do. If they postured that they wanted to do something else, regard that as a con. Work from there. The world will make much more sense.” Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs. |
#14
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In my opinion, you should add "so-called" in front of the bogus terms so that people think about reality and not just come to accept the incorrect terms, otherwise if you don't then a semi-auto AR will actually be considered a real assault weapon, etc.
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Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein |
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