Busting Vets?

[11bravo1p]

Hello Gentlemen,

I'm curious to know if you tend to deal with individuals that have military service records a little bit differently than the average citizen. I do not want to start a flame war here, I am just curious if those currently in uniform or have a service record are extended a bit more common courtesy in real life.

I know that many Police Officers are former military and I wonder if that experience extends to dealing with offenders. Are those on the business side of the flashlight more likely to be given the benefit of the doubt, or viewed as more of a threat.Do you tend to consider the impact of a conviction on their lives? Or is it just business as usual?

[IrishJoe3]

Act like a professional, you get treated like a professional. I extend everyone common courtesy until I am given a reason not to. Give me an attitude that you are entitled to a break, you will quickly learn that you are not. This goes for everyone regardless of profession.

I expect members of the Armed Forces to act in an appropriate, professional manner like we all have been trained to be. Holding your CAC card out the window before you've even finished pulling over will win you no favors. It usually results in me pulling my CAC card that has a grade many levels above your own.

I've also had drunk, belligerent veterans become incensed when arrested for DUI etc, and I've been subject to significant verbal abuse from the same. A DD214 doesn't give you a free pass to do as you want, even though unfortunately there are many veterans and service members who feel that way.

Do you tend to consider the impact of a conviction on their lives?

It can't be that big of an impact since THEY put themselves there, not me.

[11bravo1p]

Would you do the same for a fellow officer?

[TRICKSTER]

Originally Posted by 11bravo1p

Would you do the same for a fellow officer?

And we see where this is going.

[11bravo1p]

Originally Posted by TRICKSTER

And we see where this is going.

It's a question trickster. No agenda. Just want to know.

[Petro6golf]

Vets get the same service as anyone else. If I pull you over for whatever reason and you put on your smug look and hand me your CAC card with dl, you will get a ticket.

I let most people go with a warning regarding traffic stops and if I pull over a fell officer he will get a warning as well.

[IrishJoe3]

Originally Posted by 11bravo1p

Would you do the same for a fellow officer?

Originally Posted by IrishJoe3

Act like a professional, you get treated like a professional. I extend everyone common courtesy until I am given a reason not to. Give me an attitude that you are entitled to a break, you will quickly learn that you are not. This goes for everyone regardless of profession.

Bold.

[IrishJoe3]

I'm not even sure why this is a question. If the CSM says don't walk on the grass, there is no discussion. You simply don't walk on the grass. And if you do walk on the grass, get caught and end up getting burnt until the middle of next week, everyone points and say's "what a dumbass, he shouldn't have walked on the grass".

What changes for some servicemembers when they leave the main gates of post, where they feel the rules don't apply to them? And get offended when told otherwise?

If a troop in my platoon told me he's special and remedial training doesn't apply to him, I would come unglued. So why is that mentality acceptable from the same troop outside of a military setting?

This is especially true from the leadership perspective. Why would I give young Soldiers a free pass for committing a moving violation? Because of young Soldiers doing stupid and wreckless things in cars we now have endless safety briefs, and POV inspections, mandatory training, and on and on. Sadly, Soldiers kill themselves frequently in vehicle accidents, often a result of risky behavior. So no one is done any favors when a young troop gets a "thanks for your service" and carte blanche for any moving violation.

[11bravo1p]

Originally Posted by IrishJoe3

Bold.

Bold? What do you mean?

[11bravo1p]

Hey irishjoe, you are obviously a vet, what MOS?

[IrishJoe3]

Originally Posted by 11bravo1p

Bold? What do you mean?

See the bold portion of my quote.

[IrishJoe3]

Originally Posted by 11bravo1p

Hey irishjoe, you are obviously a vet, what MOS?

Engineer. PLT Sgt.

[11bravo1p]

Your a police officer now? Good to have you. We need you. I am not posting to break balls. I just want to know if service in Iraq and Afghanistan mean anything to you guys or if it should just bust and cuff.

[IrishJoe3]

Don't get me wrong, be responsible and professional as expected of us as Soldiers, odds are realllly good that we'll BS for 5 or 10 minutes on past duty stations.

Flash your CAC card or tell me that you fought for my freedom....stand by.

I wear a small lapel pin of the US Army flag on my uniform. Most troops don't notice it till too late.

[johnthomas]

I am a Vet, never expected or received a break because of it. I have never been treated worse either. Most people don't even know I'm a vet, except for the yes sir, no sir, yes ma'am no ma'am.

[11bravo1p]

Glad to have you sergeant.

[IrishJoe3]

Originally Posted by 11bravo1p

Your a police officer now? Good to have you. We need you. I am not posting to break balls. I just want to know if service in Iraq and Afghanistan mean anything to you guys or if it should just bust and cuff.

One of my fellow officers heard that two U.S. Marines were flying home from
Afghanistan to family at a small local airport. He contacted all the local agencies and arranged a welcome home gathering. When those two Marines stepped off the plane, they were greeted by limos for them and their families. As they left the Airport, the road was lined by patrol cars and fire trucks at present arms for the Marines. They were given a motorcade escort to their homes. It was all organized and put on as a complete surprise to the Marines, their families and the Marine Corp.

Yes, I do highly respect my brothers in arms and those that have served, as do most LEOs that I've worked with regardless if they served in the Military or not.

[IrishJoe3]

Originally Posted by 11bravo1p

Glad to have you sergeant.

[SDCutter]

I'm not an LEO, so please forgive the intrusion, but I was a Marine rifle platoon commander in Vietnam and a prosecutor here in California. My mother was a Marine, my father was a sailor, my brother served in the Army, and my first wife in the Navy. My son-in-law is a deputy sheriff. IrishJoe3, you are on the money in my book. Those who serve with honor and dignity and are professional don't expect any special breaks; that they may get a break is because of the way they carry themselves and respond to LEOs, not merely because they served.

I can remember when defense attorneys would seek me out trying to get a special deal for their client because he was a service member and a conviction for substance abuse or DUI might cause him to lose his "secret" clearance. They thought that because of my military background and continued service in the reserves I would be more inclined to help their client. They rarely got it. Why would I want someone like that to have a secret clearance? But when someone came in, stood proud in his uniform, and took responsibility for what he had done -- that was the guy who would often get a break from me.

I was recently coming back from a cutting show in Yuma (horses "cutting" cows) and as I went through the checkpoint coming into California the guy at the checkpoint saw the base sticker on my truck and said, "Thanks for your service." Far different from what we got coming back from Vietnam, and very appreciated. I want to return the favor so I say to all of you LEOs here on CalGuns.net, thank YOU for your service in law enforcement. You are as much a part of keeping us safe as are our men and women in the military. Thank you!

Col. USMCR Ret.

[Eric B]

My stance is what you've already read. My attitude and the use of my discretion will rely 100% on the subject's attitude and behavior.

12 years active duty AF, EOD.

[PsychGuy274]

I don't treat anyone differently. I've arrested vets, I've taken them to detox, and I've given them a friendly warning and a handshake. Treating them any different than anyone else is unethical IMO. Maybe that makes me a dick in some people's eyes, but I need to uphold my professional integrity. I warn on most of my contacts anyways.

[urbancommando]

Active duty sure i might cut a break for a traffic stop but anything above an infraction they get the same treatment as anyone else. Hell i had to pile drive a drunk active duty marine into the sidewalk because he was being an jerk

[SoldierLife7]

I'm a veteran..

I don't expect any special treatment for it. If I break the law, I expect to pay the consequences.

[IrishJoe3]

SDCutter, I must say, I had the privilege of meeting a US Marine who was a Sergeant Major during Vietnam. He was in a halfway house, a struggling addict, and a broken old man. But by God, from the spark in his eye to the spring in his step I could tell he was still a U.S. Marine, and it was my honor to shake his hand and thank him for his sacrifice and service.

And the same to you, sir.

[tnlrat37]

As a Vet I don't expect anything, I just try to be professional and respectful and have been let off with warnings most of the time. FYI IrishJoe when I was in the Corps our command directed us to give our military IDs with our DL whenever we came in contact with LEO, so it might not be the guy trying to get off but following orders, however if they are being arrogant pricks then I'm sure they deserve what they get.

[IrishJoe3]

Understood, and I don't have an issue w that. But you know the types I am referring to.

[IrishJoe3]

I had a E2 wave his ID out the window before I got out of my car. When I asked him why he did that, he said "it got me out of a ticket last time".

[yzErnie]

Originally Posted by IrishJoe3

I had a E2 wave his ID out the window before I got out of my car. When I asked him why he did that, he said "it got me out of a ticket last time".

Press hard....three copies!!!!

[bigred1]

I've never been treated any different because of my service, 30 seconds in most officers realize the yes/no sir isn't just an act. But then again I haven't been pulled over since I grew out the high'n tight.

[bigred1]

Originally Posted by yzernie

Press hard....three copies!!!!

Have a nice day!

[tyrist]

How you treat us will determine how you are treated and that goes for everyone.

[11bravo1p]

Thanks guys for the great replies. I thought about a career in law enforcement when I ETS'd, and decided to take a different path but I still wonder what it is like to be a cop and to have to put up with all of the different personalities you encounter in the line of duty. You see allot of yahoos (the offenders not the LEOs) on shows like cops and was just wondering if vets and active duty were viewed any differently but it sounds like it is what I thought. That respecting the law and those who enforce it should be SOP. I know that when I was on active duty I always did my best to toe the line. It's just the right thing to do and there was always the double whammy if somebody did something illegal off post they would not only have to deal with civil authorities but you would also face the UCMJ. Not something that I would like to experience and luckily never had to.

[semperfi24]

If you do the crime you do the time is my motto! I have a few LEO friends and they tell about other LEO's can pretty much get away with murder which is not fair they should follow they same laws, they need set the example instead they think that they are exempt.

[Falconis]

My experience:

Had 1 guy here (on the boards) all pissy he didn't catch a break for traffic.

Had 1 guy I pulled over that didn't seem right. Example is, reading what you guys write, it's pretty evident you guys are or were in the service. This guy seemed like he was trying to BS his way through everything.

Everyone else I have ever dealt with were pretty run of the mill in the good way.

Every service member I have ever worked shoulder to shoulder with were just awesome to work with. One of my best friends and former partners is still active reserves.

[yzErnie]

Originally Posted by semperfi24

I have a few LEO friends and they tell about other LEO's can pretty much get away with murder which is not fair they should follow they same laws, they need set the example instead they think that they are exempt.

Your friends are idiots and/or not telling you the truth. The Code of Silence is non existent with these youngsters these days.

[kermit315]

I am with the others in this thread. I interact with Sailors and Marines on a pretty consistent basis, both on calls and not, since my agency covers two naval installations. If they are decent and it is some minor bs, they might get a warning vice a ticket. If they are asshat airmen or PFC's that think that swearing their oath meant they had an automatic 'get out of jail free' card, press hard. That always irks me.

Now, the flipside is that if Joe Blow does the same thing and acts the same way, barring any priors, warnings, or warrants, they are probably going to get the same treatment. I pull over lots of cars, but I do not write lots of tickets. You do that math.

[WyattandDoc]

I will thump on anybody who tries to thump on me. Vet, Serviceman, Cop, Lawyer, Janitor etc etc. Why would a profession dictate different treatment? It's what wrong with our society that you would even ask this question.

I've given drunk civilians rides home. I've given drunk servicemen and cops rides home. Attitude is everything and sometimes circumstances dictate giving a break to a persone regardless of profession.

[trob]

the same as anyone else.

[1CavScout]

^^^ Same here. I never worked traffic, and hated writing tickets. Attitude in most cases dictated how the contact was going to end. If I could cut someone a break, I usually did.

I did give more than a few homeless vets a ride to the VA though to try and get them some treatment for various issues.

[shakes88]

I've never expected any specialized treatment from LEO's. Outside the gate, I'm a citizen just like everybody else. Still held to the laws every other car on the road is.

I was in the car with my buddy who tried flashing his CAC. As the CHP officer handed him his citation he said "I really hate giving military tickets, but..." I had to do my best not to laugh out loud, so I didn't catch the rest...