Arisaka Identification

[DroneHater]

I was looking for a project and these two rifles raised their heads.
Let’s start by me saying Japanese rifles are not part of my collection yet.
One of them is definitely a Type 38 with “mum” the other?????
I haven’t pulled them from the stock yet to look at other markings- I was assessing what type they were and wether I wanted to proceed- I would definitely say it matches a “last ditch” rifle as the chrome protrudes up the front of the barrel and receiver shows chrome too. The front sight is also in line with last ditch- but stock has the steel butt plate- not wooden. No bolt- but it definitely is different in the way it mounts to the stock by rear of receiver. Maybe I’m tired- but I can’t make sense of it. Any help appreciated

[highpower]

Try posting your question in the proper forum, instead of in the picture gallery. You just might find you'll get more views on your post and maybe even some answers.

Edited to add; you really need to take better pics of the entire rifle too. Right now all you can see is the receiver markings which only say what model of rifle it is.

[Rogerbutthead]

Type 38 Model of 1905 http://www.castle-thunder.com/model.htm

Data Sheet - http://www.castle-thunder.com/datasheets/38ds.pdf

[Rogerbutthead]

The second picture may be a training rifle - type C - if my eyesight isn't that off.

http://www.castle-thunder.com/datasheets/trainerds.pdf - if it is a trainer, do you want a trainer for your collection?

[Rogerbutthead]

It has struck me that I am just assuming that you know what a Japanese Arisaka training rifle is. To clarify, they are meant to just fire blanks, not real ammunition. People who could not read Japanese, who fired real ammunition in training rifles - have killed/maimed themselves.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaznkI2yF7s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6LwsYXwcKg

There are a whole lot of different types of Arisaka training rifles and some people collect them, but not many.

Do not fire live/real ammunition in an Arisaka training rifle.

PSA over

[DroneHater]

Have you heard of a last ditch training rifle? The chrome lining of the barrel comes up the outside almost 6 inches- as well as bleeds out the receiver- it is rifled too- which seems like a waste of only for blanks. It is the same length as the Type 38- but different tang and screw location. I will revisit the castle thunder site

[Rogerbutthead]

Never held a training rifle in my hands. Only seen Type 38 and Type 99's - all those Kanji variations on the Training Rifle data sheet - never seen any of them in person. Your second picture - to me - is the Type C variation on the Training Rifle data sheet. I am wondering why no one else is commenting on this thread. I have heard among the various training rifle variations, are some made from old rifles, no idea if they are safe to fire.

I did notice a paragraph about 02/45 rifles - https://military.wikia.org/wiki/Type_35_rifle Weird hybrid issued late war. No idea what they look like either, but they have the 6.5mm receiver merged with a Type 99 stock.

Two holes means Type 38 to me, no Mum bothers me, thought last ditch rifles were 7.7mm - meaning Type 99 one hole - as far as I know. What caliber is it? Any more pics you can post?

Are there locking lugs on the bolt?

Guess you can always fire it - tied to tires - with a piece of string - from a safe distance - if you want to experiment.

[DroneHater]

These were “projects” in various states of disassemble. The stocks looks like they had the bayonet mount broken off. Both are missing bolt assys. I thought that I’d investigate whether or not I wanted to add one of these rifles to the collection. As a project- they would be long term. These are not “found treasure” but history and interesting. I was reading the comparison to Mauser in design and safety- but I was just lost trying to id the second one

[DroneHater]

BTW - yeah- type C. Almost all the options on the sheet match with “c” as the variant parts except front sight blade

[Rogerbutthead]

I am getting the impression that there is not much experience with Japanese training rifles on this board.

Here are some threads on other boards that might help you or at least indicate the wide variety in training rifles.
https://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=41675
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3-dYP6BtsM
https://forums.gunboards.com/showthr...ning-Rifle-6-5 *this one has the same receiver markings
https://www.gunandgame.com/threads/b...rifles.132669/

If you don't purchase the second rifle, please tell the owner it might be a training rifle, so he can at least warn the next potential owner that he should check out that possibility.

[DroneHater]

Well- I agree completely with those markings indicating it as such. I guess you wouldn’t need to dros- equivalent to starters pistol. Maybe p/u for decorating.😬 The T38 - well it needs a lot- but everyone says mismatched rifles have little value. Maybe I’ll make a shooter