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  #81  
Old 05-17-2017, 6:58 PM
nstoolman1 nstoolman1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tnlrat37 View Post
Look here, Https://www.ssa.gov/planners/retire/wep-chart.html

There's an online calculator to figure it out exactly, if you pay in more than 30 years you get it all

^^^^^^ Winner

If you have 30 "QUALIFYING" years paid in you will not be dinged.
Check out the SS website.

Quarters have nothing to do with it. The 40 quarters only means you are eligible to receive Medicare when you retire.
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  #82  
Old 05-17-2017, 8:00 PM
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Originally Posted by nstoolman1 View Post
^^^^^^ Winner

If you have 30 "QUALIFYING" years paid in you will not be dinged.
Check out the SS website.

Quarters have nothing to do with it. The 40 quarters only means you are eligible to receive Medicare when you retire.
I get a letter every year from the SS Admin that says otherwise. I will get a check for a specific dollar amount when I reach a particular age because I've reached my "40." If I contribute more money into SS as a result of working a job that pays into it, obviously then I'd get a little more when I reached a specific age. But I will get money, no matter how small of a dollar amount it will be.
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  #83  
Old 05-18-2017, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post
I get a letter every year from the SS Admin that says otherwise. I will get a check for a specific dollar amount when I reach a particular age because I've reached my "40." If I contribute more money into SS as a result of working a job that pays into it, obviously then I'd get a little more when I reached a specific age. But I will get money, no matter how small of a dollar amount it will be.
There should be a footnote on there indicating something to the effect of, 'this calculation is presuming that you will continue to contribute the same amount until retirement age.'
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  #84  
Old 05-18-2017, 8:22 PM
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Originally Posted by mej16489 View Post
There should be a footnote on there indicating something to the effect of, 'this calculation is presuming that you will continue to contribute the same amount until retirement age.'
No footnote on mine.

Additionaly, my primary retirement "entity" has also calculated a rough estimate of what my SS payout will be upon specific age(s).

Now what?
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  #85  
Old 05-18-2017, 9:08 PM
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After 40 quarters you do get "benefits". It is called Medical/Medicare. Your retirement amount is based on how much you contribute. If you have 30 qualifying years of contributions you will not get dinged with WEP. Mine says what I will get at 62, 65,70. If I did not have the 30 years( and I do) I would be penalized x percent for each year less than 30. Everyone needs to go to the SSA website and read up and learn. To not do so is doing yourselves a disservice.
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  #86  
Old 05-18-2017, 9:14 PM
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Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post
"We" also pay taxes out the nose. Some of us that have second jobs still pay into social security for people like YOU when you become old and grey and collect your SS check.

Aside from every tax you pay which I also pay I have to also pay Social Security tax on ALL my income including my payments into my retirement savings accounts
But you totally miss the point. YOU GET to pay into you Retirement program tax free. Most people on the outside don't have a retirement unless they fund it themselves with money they paid Social Security TAXES on.

You receive a guaranteed payout from your pension based on the numbers of years you worked and your highest Quarterly earnings.Regardless of how much you paid in.

We only get the money we paid in (After paying Social Security Taxes) plus any earnings we were able to make



40 quarters. The LAW says one gets SS "benefits" upon reaching the 40. So how about giving us our share of the 40, to exactly what a non civil service person would get upon reaching their 40 quarters? Makes sense to me. However govt employees are discriminated against in this aspect. Why? Again, if we pay our "fair share" of 40 quarters, give us what we are entitled to receive. Why discriminate us for being civil servants with another pension? By the way, my government pension requires me to pay a share into my retirement, just like anyone in the private sector with a 401k. ...You have one of those, ...don't you????

No we don't get a 401K just for showing up, and if we self fund one we only get our own money PLus growth, not some guaranteed payout like you based on years of service.

You mentioned earlier that we have "government jobs" where YOUR tax dollars pay for our salaries etc... etc... blah blah blah... Well guess what? Our tax dollars also pay for ourselves and everything else that benefits you as well! So don't give us that krap about your tax dollars pay our salaries. Again, civil servants pay taxes too.

Give me a break, you still don't even grasp we pay more taxes then you do and do not receive Defined Benefit Pensions.

Second, cops, firefighters, military, courts, county hospital doctors and nurses etc...etc.... are Government entities that serve the public to maintain order, safety and security. These entities are "NOT for profit" organizations, so who the hell else is going to pay for those NEEDED services other than [U]U.S. tax payers ???
Never said any such thing Putting words in my mouth doesn't reduce your lack of understanding
Your argument about you not getting any return for your tax dollars is totally bogus and at best, very juvenile. For starters, YOU get police, fire, medical (etc...) PROTECTION B-E-N-F-I-T-S! Nor do you get sent a bill when you call and scream into the phone that you need the fire department because your van is on fire. If you don't know what "protection" I'm talking about, then go dial 911 and ask for help. Then watch YOUR tax dollars at work son! I thought you were a "business man." You should know better.


Never said any such thing Putting words in my mouth doesn't reduce your lack of understanding So is Social Security Administration what exactly is your point? Your rules are fair but theirs are unfair? Same Government buddy. There rules not mine, I just try to help you understand them.



Finally, It sounds like your miserable with your own choice of career path you took. I read much envy and despising of a civil servant's career benefits in your posts. We can't help it if you have a sucked job and are obviously jealous that your benefits must suck when compared to ours. We civil servants planned our career choices out. ...Didn't you? [/COLOR]

Never said any such thing Putting words in my mouth doesn't reduce your lack of understanding. Funny for all that planning you don't even understand what you have. Your the one whining and your the one angry, what does that tell you?

But YOU do indeed get your FULL SS benefits if you pay into the system ...and are NOT a civil servant. So why are your complaining? Many of us civil servants are REQUIRD BY LAW to pay into SS with our second jobs or did so already early in life before a career change from the private sector. So if YOU get the SS benefit return, why shouldn't we if we paid into the same system that you did and we met the government set requirement (40-quarters) as well? (I'm not talking about one that hasn't met his/her 40 quarters. I'm talking about those of us that have).

I'm not the one complaining here you are.(That's projection) I trying to help you understand the system. Not my fault you don't

You mentioned that you put in "200 quarters." So where exactly is the line of demarcation of when someone should receive their SS benefits? Is it at 199? 200? 300? 150? Which is it now in YOUR opinion? Here's a hint for you: The government (i.e the LAW) through congress, has long determined that it's "40 quarters!" Now what? So your opinion on that specific matter is really moot. [/COLOR]

I didn't make the rules I just paid what I paid. The law adjust your SS benefit to reflect the "Better " deal you planned. But after your great planning you now think it's unfair. It's the carrier you planned and you followed your plan, Now at the last minute you cry the plan is unfair

Well we're always hiring. Did you ever fill out that employment application for that civil/public service linked job, in order to receive those same benefits you sorely despise us of having????

Frankly, I've seen many that just couldn't pass backgrounds and/or the civil service tests themselves. ...So they whine.
Once again you get it backwards, you are whining the law is unfair not me.

But nice try, you can't make a good argument so you imply I am somehow unworthy.

Snowflake Red doesn't make your misstatements any more correct.
Get in touch with me again when you have a clue about what you are talking about.
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  #87  
Old 05-18-2017, 9:21 PM
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https://www.ssa.gov/policy/docs/ssb/v68n2/v68n2p21.html

"The regular Social Security benefit computation formula is weighted to provide a higher replacement of earnings for workers with low earnings. Most employment and self-employment in the United States is covered by Social Security. Workers and their employers pay taxes up to an annual maximum amount, and the earnings are creditable for Social Security purposes. Before the WEP was enacted, individuals who had worked mainly in employment not covered by Social Security had their benefits computed as if they were long term low-wage earners. The WEP prevents this unintended windfall for workers who receive a pension from a job where they did not pay Social Security taxes, but who benefited from provisions aimed at low lifetime earners."

Pretty cut and dry concerning the "windfall offset."

And if you have 30 YOC's you'll be able to collect your non covered pension and your SS retirement benefits without a problem.

https://secure.ssa.gov/poms.nsf/lnx/0300605362
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  #88  
Old 05-18-2017, 11:28 PM
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Originally Posted by 71MUSTY View Post
Once again you get it backwards, you are whining the law is unfair not me.

But nice try, you can't make a good argument so you imply I am somehow unworthy.

Snowflake Red doesn't make your misstatements any more correct.
Get in touch with me again when you have a clue about what you are talking about.
Triggered.

I accept your white flag of surrender as you've clearly just demonstrated your inability to refute.

'Nuff said.
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  #89  
Old 05-19-2017, 2:19 AM
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Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post
Triggered.

I accept your white flag of surrender as you've clearly just demonstrated your inability to refute.

'Nuff said.
I don't give me anything to refute, just a bunch of anger and false statements.

You are becoming the poster child for why people think so poorly of Public Servants

Here is the heart of the matter in your own words.

Quote:
We civil servants planned our career choices out.
Now you are complaining your plan is unfair. But it's your plan! Either you don't understand your own plan or your just a whiner.

BooHooHoo Poor public servant gets exactly what he planned. HOW UNFAIR IS THAT.

But that's OK keep telling your self your Whining is winning.
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  #90  
Old 05-19-2017, 3:57 AM
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Originally Posted by 71MUSTY View Post
Interestingly, that was the trade-off you all made when you agreed to be Exempt from Social Security in exchange for that great Government pension. Now you want to have your cake and eat it too. Don't get me wrong I do understand but Social Security was never intended to support people who already have a great Government Pension.

Now consider this. Those of us who did not/don't work for the Government have to pay Social Security Tax on every dime of wages we make every day of our lives.

Why should you be entitled to the same Social Security benefit I am when you were able to exclude most of your income from Social Security Tax.

I will agree to give you the same social security benefit as me when you agree I get the same pension as you.

Exactly. I paid into SSI from 1967-2014. When I retired from a private
sector job,my employer DEDUCTED from my pension--- a dollar amount
that was 1/2 of the benefit I receive from Social Security,that's because every dollar that I contributed my employer also had to pay into,so they want
their money. People that didn't put anything into SS ,shouldn't be entitled to it.
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  #91  
Old 05-19-2017, 4:28 AM
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Your PERS (Public Employee Retirement System) pension benefits are FAR better than those receiving SSI (Social Security)... You've invested (one of) your career(s) in one of the few EXEMPT (or nearly exempt) jobs. You KNEW this, and are reminded annually (at minimum) during open enrollment.

Normal folks can't do this. Your SSI is being reduced because you EXCEED their maximum income levels. It's the same across the board for others. Like those who take a job in excess of the earned income limits.

PERS works... and works well. SSI is administered to the American public by exempted PERS employees... and it's failing. Social Security has been stolen from, and made insolvent by those who promised SSI to the American taxpayer, then FORCED us to participate. Summarily, they exempted themselves, while causing SSI to crumble by mismanagement... yet they created themselves a system (PERS) that works, but it's only for them.

Ruling class (PERS) vs. the Little People (SSI). Now you want an exemption from longstanding SSI reductions to further force the insolvency of the public system, so you can have more?

No wonder the democrats overwhelmingly support this nonsense! When you signed your PERS contact, it was there in black and white, and so where you. YOU EXEMPTED YOURSELF !

You knew better, or should have known better... either way, it's against the law for a reason. Your asking to blatantly double dip... after you've been TOLD FOR YEARS! I'm only an insurance agent, and I know that PERS makes you SSI exempt! I served PERS employees. They all knew... what happened to you? I think you're playing dumb. Needless to say, anyone who supports this idea, is.

Your PERS pension is likely 3x more than a guy earning the same wage via SSI... and you STILL want more?

Greed is ugly!

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  #92  
Old 05-19-2017, 8:48 AM
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Originally Posted by kfraiz007 View Post
Your PERS (Public Employee Retirement System) pension benefits are FAR better than those receiving SSI (Social Security)... You've invested (one of) your career(s) in one of the few EXEMPT (or nearly exempt) jobs. You KNEW this, and are reminded annually (at minimum) during open enrollment.
But...but...but.... I'm NOT a member of PERS.
I've NEVER been a part of CalPERS.
I will never collect one dime from PERS because again, I'm NOT enrolled with that entity.

Now what?

Care to ASSume anything else that is not part of the facts of this discussion, son?

I actually belong to one of the very rare government retirement systems that actually requires the employee to contribute a large percentage to our own retirements (unlike PERS), similar but not exactly like a civilian 401k. Wow, imagine that

Again reiterating, I also happily chose to work TWO jobs for a time period where I contributed the full amount as prescribed by law into Social Security. How is that "greed" in your mind? It's called "working harder" to strive for better, here in America. If I'm contributing to SS, shouldn't I receive my "entitled" benefits as well? You're contributing to SS, don't you want your benefits that you've put into it? Why do you get yours and others don't?

Which one did you support that lost the election, Hillary or Bernie? We're not completely a socialist nation yet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kfraiz007
Your PERS pension is likely 3x more than a guy earning the same wage via SSI... and you STILL want more?

Greed is ugly!
I'd say that your Ignorance is even uglier because you don't know all of the facts. ("PERS.". Ha!).

Neeeext!
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  #93  
Old 05-19-2017, 12:29 PM
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That it's not PERS is immaterial. You KNEW you'd receive reduced SSI, or SHOULD have known. Everyone eligible for SSI receives a reduced benefit when income allowance is exceeded.

SSI is a failsafe, never intended to be a replacement for savings or pension or 401K... etc. It has parameters. Paying in is required in most circumstances, their payout isn't.

I pay into that system, and I'll likely never receive ANY benefit from it. It's insolvent. If SSI was a privately held insurance company, it'd be shuttered by government for failing to cover it's projected loss ratio... and those in control would be convicted for embezzlement, waste, fraud and abuse. Government promises are BUNK. Particularly THIS one.

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  #94  
Old 05-19-2017, 5:52 PM
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Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post
But...but...but.... I'm NOT a member of PERS.
I've NEVER been a part of CalPERS.
I will never collect one dime from PERS because again, I'm NOT enrolled with that entity.

Now what?

Care to ASSume anything else that is not part of the facts of this discussion, son?

I actually belong to one of the very rare government retirement systems that actually requires the employee to contribute a large percentage Of Social Security Exempt money to our own retirements (unlike PERS), similar but not exactly like a civilian 401k. Wow, imagine that

Again reiterating, I also happily chose to work TWO jobs for a time period where I contributed the full amount as prescribed by law into Social Security. How is that "greed" in your mind? It's called "working harder" to strive for better, here in America. If I'm contributing to SS, shouldn't I receive my "entitled" benefits as well? You're contributing to SS, don't you want your benefits that you've put into it? Why do you get yours and others don't?

Which one did you support that lost the election, Hillary or Bernie? We're not completely a socialist nation yet.


I'd say that your Ignorance is even uglier because you don't know all of the facts. ("PERS.". Ha!).

Neeeext!
You really don't understand any of this do you. The Greed comes in when you want all the benefits of your plan, but want to ignore the costs imposed by law upon your because you greedily want even more money.

It doesn't matter which EXEMPT GOVERNMENT PLAN YOU belong too.

Quote:
I actually belong to one of the very rare government retirement systems that actually requires the employee to contribute a large percentage to our own retirements
Which means you got to build your retirement with even more SS tax EXEMPT dollars then your PERS Friends here. You got an even better deal then they did.

I doesn't matter which EXEMPT GOVERNMENT PLAN YOU belong too.

But feel free to continue posting your ignorance. We won't laugh.







.
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  #95  
Old 05-19-2017, 6:32 PM
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I for one am very happy to I don't have to pay into SS anymore. I don't even care if I never see the money I paid into it at previous jobs.
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  #96  
Old 05-19-2017, 7:54 PM
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You really don't understand any of this do you. The Greed comes in when you want all the benefits of your plan, but want to ignore the costs imposed by law upon your because you greedily want even more money.

It doesn't matter which EXEMPT GOVERNMENT PLAN YOU belong to!
My government retirement plan and my SS contributions are two seperate and independent issues. If as you say I have "nothing coming" when it comes to SS returns (a whopping 40 quarters worth in my case) because I already have a seperate retirement plan, I'd agree with you IF..... SS reimburses me for what I've already contributed. It's like I was "taxed for nothing." So give me a refund for all those years into SS and you won't hear from me again.

Do you have a 401K, a Roth IRA or regular IRA? If you did, you'd know that you also contribute a percentage of your money to those funds with pre-tax dollars (just like I do). So if that's the case, how about I claim that since you too are taking advantage of a "quasi tax break," then you shouldn't receive any SS benefits either. After all, you already have a retirement plan, right? Hey there's an idea! Oh here's another reminder to you: your plan takes advantage of tax "loop-holes" too!

Again, I contributed to SS for a time period in my life and later switched careers. I should get whatever percentage I'm allowed to receive based on what I contributed that's equal to my fellow tax payers' who contributed the same amount. I'm not suggesting any "more" than what I've contributed and what the law says I'd be allotted as the next tax payer is allowed. Evidentaly some politicians think this way now too.

What you're suggesting is that the government takes my tax money I contributed into SS and keeps it, yet they take your tax money and you get a small (SS) return upon reaching a specific age. That doesn't make sense. Had I NOT reached my 40 quarters, then yeah I shouldn't be entitled to anything from SS. The fact is however, I like you paid into the system. Naturally you should get more from SS than I because you paid more into it.

Either way I know this fact: You're triggered with anger because you don't have what I have regarding retirement. Can't help you there. Second, no matter how much you can't stand it, the fact is I'll still receive something from SS. Third, as discussed earlier, there's already a move in Washington to change all this and give those of us that rightfully contributed whatever dollar amount, the benefit that's commensurate to the same return as the next guy that contributed the same respective amount.

So really, your belly aching doesn't do much for you. Again, if you're so jealous of a civil servants's retirement plan (again, being sperate from SS), we're always hiring.
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  #97  
Old 05-19-2017, 9:08 PM
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Getting what you "deserve" from paying into social security outside of any other income is the opposite of what many believe is the intent of social security (right or wrong) -- helping supplement the retirement income of lower lifetime wage earners. Basically, WEP is the government's answer to those with pensions + SS aren't considered lower lifetime wage earners.

That's why there's talk of "fixing" social security by putting in means-testing and replacing WEP with something that counts ALL of your income -- both which may hurt those with pensions.

Just be happy your social security benefit can only be dropped by a maximum of $428/mo because it could get a lot worse for those with pensions or other retirement income.
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  #98  
Old 05-20-2017, 7:52 AM
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My government retirement plan and my SS contributions are two seperate and independent issues.

That is where you are 100% wrong. SORRY They became combined the minute you signed on to be Social Security EXEMPT.

By your own words that is the PLAN you chose. Now after reaping all the benefits of being able to fund a great Defined Benefit Pension with SS Exempt Dollars suddenly you want to change the rules.

Many of us take pride in honoring the deals we make. I guess you feel it's of for you to make a deal, reap the benefits, then try to get out of the deal you made.

We all pay SS taxes for nothing. None of us who worked a full career gets back what we paid in. Quit the false argument. To receive back every $$$ I paid into SS I would have to live past 100.


Quote:
Do you have a 401K, a Roth IRA or regular IRA? If you did, you'd know that you also contribute a percentage of your money to those funds with pre-tax dollars (just like I do).
Wrong again. You pay with pre tax and SS Exempt dollars. We pay with Pre tax post SS tax dollars. Read that again, this is the crux of the matter.

All your arguments about 40 quarters are wrong and a waste of bandwidth, because you cut a special deal in exchange for being allowed to fund your pension with SS Exempt dollars.

If you want the same deal as me add up every dollar you paid into your EXEMPT pension, calculate the SS tax you would have paid on it and send that to the government.

Then we would have an equal basis in SS

You made the deal, and reaped the benefits, be a man and quit crying about
it.

AGAIN it is not my fault you don't understand the deal you made. All I'm asking you to do is understand the facts of the deal you made.
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Old 05-20-2017, 8:01 AM
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My government retirement plan and my SS contributions are two seperate and independent issues.

That is where you are 100% wrong. SORRY They became combined the minute you signed on to be Social Security EXEMPT.

By your own words that is the PLAN you chose. Now after reaping all the benefits of being able to fund a great Defined Benefit Pension with SS Exempt Dollars suddenly you want to change the rules.

Many of us take pride in honoring the deals we make. I guess you feel it's OK for you to make a deal, reap the benefits, then try to get out of the deal you made.

We all pay SS taxes for nothing. None of us who worked a full career gets back what we paid in. Quit the false argument. To receive back every $$$ I paid into SS I would have to live past 100.


Quote:
Do you have a 401K, a Roth IRA or regular IRA? If you did, you'd know that you also contribute a percentage of your money to those funds with pre-tax dollars (just like I do).
Wrong again. You pay with pre tax and SS Exempt dollars. We pay with Pre tax post SS tax dollars. Read that again, this is the crux of the matter.

All your arguments about 40 quarters are wrong and a waste of bandwidth, because you cut a special deal in exchange for being allowed to fund your pension with SS Exempt dollars.

If you want the same deal as me add up every dollar you paid into your EXEMPT pension, calculate the SS tax you would have paid on it and send that to the government.

Then we would have an equal basis in SS

You made the deal, and reaped the benefits, be a man and quit crying about
it.

AGAIN it is not my fault you don't understand the deal you made. All I'm asking you to do is understand the facts of the deal you made.


Attempting to transfer your anger and confusion to me by saying I'm triggered and jealous is not helping your case. What are we 13? Why not discuss this like an adult?

Oh yeah, I forgot, when you can't support your argument with fact, switch to name calling.

Again you are making all public employees look bad, please get the facts.
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  #100  
Old 05-20-2017, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by 71MUSTY View Post
suddenly you want to change the rules.
Not my idea, but some of your elected officials want to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 71Musty
We all pay SS taxes for nothing. None of us who worked a full career gets back what we paid in. Quit the false argument. To receive back every $$$ I paid into SS I would have to live past 100.
"Pay SS taxes for nothing?" Ummm, you do get something back when you're in your 60's. What, you didn't know that???

Of course you don't get back 100% of what you paid into silly. You only get a PORTION of what you paid into the system, commensurate with the years that you worked. What, did you actually think that I want "100%" of what I put into it??? Whadya new?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 71Musty
Wrong again. You pay with pre tax and SS Exempt dollars. We pay with Pre tax post SS tax dollars. Read that again, this is the crux of the matter.
Ummm, I underlined the "crux" of the matter of what you said. I already told you that you pay with "pre-tax dollars." So I was in fact correct as you pointed out with your underlined statement. Your "post tax" stuff doesn't concern me, nor is it germane to this conversation. Either way, you should continue to pay into SS because you will earn more in the long run. I paid with the same pre and post tax dollars that you did at one time, so why don't I get my small return of what I already put into it? Nothing more, nothing less.

Your confusion is that you are incorrectly lumping two independent careers with different SS tax laws into one melting pot.

Whereas the beginning of my working years I paid into SS. It wasn't until later in life that I switched and my SS taxes came to a halt. At that point, everything I paid into it should allow me to collect a small percentage of my paid "fair share." At no point should I get one additional dime from the system after I left it. Again, I've never made that claim, however you seem to have created that myth in your own mind.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Musty71
All your arguments about 40 quarters are wrong and a waste of bandwidth, because you cut a special deal in exchange for being allowed to fund your pension with SS Exempt dollars
"Special deal"??? No it's just a market of one's money. You get only a portion of what you put into SS, that's understood. Had I left the system to be a homeless person for the next 40 years, I'd still receive benefits based upon how much I put in, since I met the 40Q threshold. Albeit it would be minimal.

So because I went to a different system and continued to work, you're saying that I shouldn't get the same return as the hypothetical guy who just stops working all together yet he contributed the exact same amount that I did, only he still gets "his" of what he paid into it in the end? That's called socialism and you evidentially seem to support it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Musty71
If you want the same deal as me add up every dollar you paid into your EXEMPT pension, calculate the SS tax you would have paid on it and send that to the government.
But I don't want the "same deal" as you. I only want my percentage of what I put into it so far. That's what you don't understand. I don't want anything after the day I stopped paying into SS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 71Musty
You made the deal, and reaped the benefits, be a man and quit crying about it.
What "deal?" Previously you were the one who was crying about not getting any return on your taxes. You're the one crying that you have to continuously pay into SS, yet you will get your FULL allotted and calculated percentage upon reaching a specific age. You're the one evidentially crying and alluding to the fact that you have a sucked retirement and you want everyone else around you to have the same.

Again two things:

1) Bernie lost the election Son, get over it.
2) We're always hiring. Join us. You'll like the "benefits" you sorely keep bringing up.

Simply leaving the SS system shouldn't mean that the government now keeps what I contributed and give it ALL to someone like YOU. Again, that's socialism and I don't support it. However with YOUR "greed," it's perfectly acceptable for you to take someone else's contributed money, while that same person gets nothing in return.

See what you like like when I hold the hypocritical mirror up in front of you?

You're confusion has lumped two different systems into one debate and that's where the flaw lies with your argument.
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  #101  
Old 05-20-2017, 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post
Not my idea, but some of your elected officials want to.


"Pay SS taxes for nothing?" Ummm, you do get something back when you're in your 60's. What, you didn't know that???

Of course you don't get back 100% of what you paid into silly. You only get a PORTION of what you paid into the system, commensurate with the years that you worked. What, did you actually think that I want "100%" of what I put into it??? Whadya new?


YOU are the one insisting he get his money back not me

Quote:
Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post
Ummm, I underlined the "crux" of the matter of what you said. I already told you that you pay with "pre-tax dollars." So I was in fact correct as you pointed out with your underlined statement. Your "post tax" stuff doesn't concern me, nor is it germane to this conversation. Either way, you should continue to pay into SS because you will earn more in the long run. I paid with the same pre and post tax dollars that you did at one time, so why don't I get my small return of what I already put into it? Nothing more, nothing less.

Your confusion is that you are incorrectly lumping two independent careers with different SS tax laws into one melting pot.
NO WRONG AGAIN. The deal you made does that not me


Quote:
Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post
Whereas the beginning of my working years I paid into SS. It wasn't until later in life that I switched and my SS taxes came to a halt. At that point, everything I paid into it should allow me to collect a small percentage of my paid "fair share." At no point should I get one additional dime from the system after I left it. Again, I've never made that claim, however you seem to have created that myth in your own mind.
It's not on my head it's the deal you made when you took an SS Exempt Job. Blaming my is pure ignorance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post
"Special deal"??? No it's just a market of one's money. You get only a portion of what you put into SS, that's understood. Had I left the system to be a homeless person for the next 40 years, I'd still receive benefits based upon how much I put in, since I met the 40Q threshold. Albeit it would be minimal.

So because I went to a different system and continued to work, you're saying that I shouldn't get the same return as the hypothetical guy who just stops working all together yet he contributed the exact same amount that I did, only he still gets "his" of what he paid into it in the end?


No try again, I'm saying it's because you got to build your defined benefit pension SS tax Exempt. Pure fact.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post
That's called socialism and you evidentially seem to support it.
LOL choice you are whining because your participation is one socialist precludes you from getting handouts from the other, but accuse me of supporting socialism.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post

But I don't want the "same deal" as you. I only want my percentage of what I put into it so far. That's what you don't understand. I don't want anything after the day I stopped paying into SS.
Again I never said that. You will get exactly the % you deserve, just not the one you want.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TrailerparkTrash View Post

What "deal?" Previously you were the one who was crying about not getting any return on your taxes. You're the one crying that you have to continuously pay into SS, yet you will get your FULL allotted and calculated percentage upon reaching a specific age. You're the one evidentially crying and alluding to the fact that you have a sucked retirement and you want everyone else around you to have the same.

Again two things:

1) Bernie lost the election Son, get over it.
2) We're always hiring. Join us. You'll like the "benefits" you sorely keep bringing up.

Simply leaving the SS system shouldn't mean that the government now keeps what I contributed and give it ALL to someone like YOU. Again, that's socialism and I don't support it. However with YOUR "greed," it's perfectly acceptable for you to take someone else's contributed money, while that same person gets nothing in return.

See what you like like when I hold the hypocritical mirror up in front of you?

You're confusion has lumped two different systems into one debate and that's where the flaw lies with your argument.
[/QUOTE]

No my flaw was trying to educate an idiot.

I'm done.
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  #102  
Old 05-20-2017, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by 71MUSTY View Post
YOU are the one insisting he get his money back not me



NO WRONG AGAIN. The deal you made does that not me




It's not on my head it's the deal you made when you took an SS Exempt Job. Blaming my is pure ignorance.





No try again, I'm saying it's because you got to build your defined benefit pension SS tax Exempt. Pure fact.




LOL choice you are whining because your participation is one socialist precludes you from getting handouts from the other, but accuse me of supporting socialism.




Again I never said that. You will get exactly the % you deserve, just not the one you want.
No my flaw was trying to educate an idiot.

I'm done.[/QUOTE]


I'd agree with you if you were right.

For the 3rd time, we're always hiring.
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  #103  
Old 05-20-2017, 12:07 PM
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Socialism. Lol.
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  #104  
Old 05-20-2017, 7:31 PM
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No my flaw was trying to educate an idiot.

I'm done.

I'd agree with you if you were right.

For the 3rd time, we're always hiring.
[/QUOTE]

Not only do you not know what you talk about you also do not know who you talk about.


Why would I want to work for a government the hires people too dumb to understand what social security exempt means or that what makes the two discussions one is the government contract they signed. Why would I work for any entity that passes over the best and brightest to meet their Affirmative Action Quotas. My parents were both government workers. They too, just like you cried about how unfair life was.

Second, in response to you ridiculous false accusations about me, I planned my carrier in such a way where I would never need a $ from the government for anything. I also planned my carrier in such a way I would never have to go to work and kiss up to people too dumb to understand what social security exempt means nor take orders from them.

So no I don't want your Social Security or even mine, no I never want to have to kiss up to an idiot to get a paycheck and if I had to sit next to someone this ignorant every day I'd go insane.

I paid SS taxes on 100% of my income, never collected, unemployment, disability or paid sick leave, In fact I never collected a dime for any government program. I put kids thru college without student loans, grands or scholorships (Aerospace Engineer, Doctor and a MSW) built a very nice nest egg, and never ever once had to go on the internet crying that Social Security is being unfair to me.

All that after getting kicked out of the third grade.

So go ahead cupcake accuse me of being the Bernie Lover

Hell TTrash your so upset about this I'd give you my SS if I could.

And I never ever once had to go on the internet crying that Social Security is being unfair to me.

I did spend some time once on the internet trying to teach a government employee why his Socialist programs weren't giving him the freebies He thought he deserved.

But it didn't work because all he could do is repeat stupid things, whine, and make false accusations about me.

In the end I let him return to the trailer park and continue his rant about how unfair the world is.
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  #105  
Old 05-20-2017, 10:06 PM
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71, You're still here?
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  #106  
Old 05-20-2017, 11:24 PM
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Somewhat related.....On a radio talk show the question was asked....Should Bill Gates get SS checks? Surprisingly the overwhelming vote from callers was yes.
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Old 05-21-2017, 3:02 PM
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71Musty; You need to check your facts. Not everyone that is in PERS is exempt from Social Security payments. Some are, like corrections employees and maybe The CHP, but others still pay into the fund I know because I was a state employee, was paying into PERS and was paying Social Security taxes.

Are you saying that I shouldn't be able to collect the SS retirement payments that the Government promised me? I think you may need to dial your extreme butthurt down a little bit and get your facts straight before you keep on bloviating without doing some research.
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  #108  
Old 05-21-2017, 3:16 PM
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71Musty; You need to check your facts. Not everyone that is in PERS is exempt from Social Security payments. Some are, like corrections employees and maybe The CHP, but others still pay into the fund I know because I was a state employee, was paying into PERS and was paying Social Security taxes.

Are you saying that I shouldn't be able to collect the SS retirement payments that the Government promised me? I think you may need to dial your extreme butthurt down a little bit and get your facts straight before you keep on bloviating on without doing some research.
I am not LE, but currently another form of 'public servant'. I have paid into SSI since 1979 and for the past 17 1/2 years have paid into both SSI and CalPers.

So I have about 38 years of SSI contributions and over 17 years of CalPers contributions. Shouldn't I expect to receive the benefits of both?
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Old 05-21-2017, 4:35 PM
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I am not LE, but currently another form of 'public servant'. I have paid into SSI since 1979 and for the past 17 1/2 years have paid into both SSI and CalPers.

So I have about 38 years of SSI contributions and over 17 years of CalPers contributions. Shouldn't I expect to receive the benefits of both?
Yes. Based on the SSA website and the WEP formula. Provided at least 30 years are "qualifying" years.
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  #110  
Old 05-21-2017, 5:05 PM
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Originally Posted by highpower View Post
71Musty; You need to check your facts. Not everyone that is in PERS is exempt from Social Security payments. Some are, like corrections employees and maybe The CHP, but others still pay into the fund I know because I was a state employee, was paying into PERS and was paying Social Security taxes.

Are you saying that I shouldn't be able to collect the SS retirement payments that the Government promised me? I think you may need to dial your extreme butthurt down a little bit and get your facts straight before you keep on bloviating without doing some research.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutch3 View Post
I am not LE, but currently another form of 'public servant'. I have paid into SSI since 1979 and for the past 17 1/2 years have paid into both SSI and CalPers.

So I have about 38 years of SSI contributions and over 17 years of CalPers contributions. Shouldn't I expect to receive the benefits of both?
Neither of you are Social Security Exempt. So no I'm not suggesting you lose anything. I am telling the guys who are SS EXEMPT the they agreed to have their SS limited when they went SS EXEMPT.

They want the same deal from SS as you even though all their pension payments were made SS tax free and yours weren't. Instead of paying SS Tax like you all that money went into their pension.

See the difference now? Perhaps they paid SS tax on previous jobs and side jobs but being SS EXEMPT on their Government Job is what gets them limited.

Fixing what they claim is unfair would actually be unfair to you.
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  #111  
Old 05-21-2017, 11:37 PM
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It's called "anger management." Don't come into a cop forum with your bottle of "whine" and your cheese. For the third time, we're always hiring.
...But first, you have to pass the tests.
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  #112  
Old 05-24-2017, 11:35 PM
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71mustang,

You keep mentioning you'd have to live to 101 to get back all of what you've paid into the system. I read somewhere that most people receive 100% back of what they actually paid in 39 months. People who retired 20-30 years ago were not paying much into the system at all compared to todays worker. My father told me he paid probably $1600 into the system over his working life. His contributions were so small when he first started working that he never noticed them.He's been retired more than 25 years now.

My agency is a 1937 Act agency. We pay into our county retirement system (not PERS), plus get to pay into social security. In a couple of years I will be applying for SSI. Double dipping? You bet! I paid into both my whole life, and no. I don't get any retirement medical benefit, or 6 figure retirement. Those are truly unicorns. Only the upper echelon (very very few) get that. Sorry you're doing so poorly, but career choices have consequences. I got lucky and did research 35+ years ago and knew i would have a defined retirement etc... BTW, I know a heck of a lot of business owners, and not a single one of them would trade jobs with me. They all believe we earned whatever retirement benefits we're entitled to.

Take care.
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  #113  
Old 05-25-2017, 2:36 AM
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71mustang,

You keep mentioning you'd have to live to 101 to get back all of what you've paid into the system. I read somewhere that most people receive 100% back of what they actually paid in 39 months. People who retired 20-30 years ago were not paying much into the system at all compared to todays worker. My father told me he paid probably $1600 into the system over his working life. His contributions were so small when he first started working that he never noticed them.He's been retired more than 25 years now.

My agency is a 1937 Act agency. We pay into our county retirement system (not PERS), plus get to pay into social security. In a couple of years I will be applying for SSI. Double dipping? You bet! I paid into both my whole life, and no. I don't get any retirement medical benefit, or 6 figure retirement. Those are truly unicorns. Only the upper echelon (very very few) get that. Sorry you're doing so poorly, but career choices have consequences. I got lucky and did research 35+ years ago and knew i would have a defined retirement etc... BTW, I know a heck of a lot of business owners, and not a single one of them would trade jobs with me. They all believe we earned whatever retirement benefits we're entitled to.

Take care.
Once again you were not SS EXEMPT so you should collect. The people complaining here are the ones who WERE SS EXEMPT so their SS benefit is limited. Very simple to understand.
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  #114  
Old 05-25-2017, 7:40 PM
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71mustang,

I paid into both my whole life, and no. I don't get any retirement medical benefit, or 6 figure retirement. Those are truly unicorns. Only the upper echelon (very very few) get that.

Take care.
Sarge,
I retired from a 37 act county also, the only thing I would dispute in your statement is the 6 figure retirement. Go to www.Transparentcaliforna.com
and you can see many many 100k plus retirements among even plain patrol officers. In my county under the 3@50 and the cafeteria plan virtually all Sgt's and above make 120k plus.
What chaps my balls is they then immediately come back and work per diem at the courthouse or backgrounds taking a spot that some of us lowly retired deputies could use.
Ah well, the wife keeps me busy enough around the house I guess.
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