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Centerfire Rifles - Manually Operated Lever action, bolt action or other non gas operated centerfire rifles.

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  #1  
Old 03-30-2020, 2:58 PM
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Default Winchester 70 in 30-06, needs work.

I guess now was the wrong time to purchase a project gun.

I've always wanted a Winchester 70 since finding out it was my deceased grandfather's choice of hunting rifle. Even better, someone I knew was offering it up for about $300 for a pre-64 1949 30-06. Even better I thought, I told him to hold it for me and started the transfer after barely seeing it. It definitely needs some work including: Getting a new sight hood, scope rings for my Lo-Pro Redfield 6x scope, and rebelling the entire thing since theres little to no bluing left.

Got everything ordered, minus the sight hood and original sling swivels since Numrich ain't shipping nuthin.

Anybody else restore a 70? Any suggestions and hints that would have made your lives easier?

Sorry for the terrible pictures... moved back to an older phone.




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  #2  
Old 03-30-2020, 3:03 PM
Elgatodeacero Elgatodeacero is offline
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If the bore is good and action locks up properly, I would clean it gently and use it as is.
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  #3  
Old 03-30-2020, 3:07 PM
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Bore and action are good. I have no plans for selling, I just want it to have a more classic look.
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  #4  
Old 03-30-2020, 3:11 PM
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The wear shows honest use, your 1949 date is exactly what I looked for. Enjoy that rifle.
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  #5  
Old 03-30-2020, 3:20 PM
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Keep it clean and oiled and enjoy it. Bluing will cost min 100 -200 bucks.
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  #6  
Old 03-30-2020, 3:35 PM
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Dang, I woulda loved to grab that up! Nice score!

Is that heavy corrosion on the barrel near/under the wood?
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  #7  
Old 03-30-2020, 3:37 PM
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All the above are correct.
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  #8  
Old 03-30-2020, 3:44 PM
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I am lucky enough to own a very early Model 70 in .30-06, that has considerable finish wear (no rust) and handling marks from many decades of hunting all over the country. No way I would ever consider refinishing it, as it's wear is earned the old fashioned way. It belonged to a rancher I had the fortune of working for when I was much younger, and has considerable history behind it.
Something to consider for your treasure.
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  #9  
Old 03-30-2020, 3:57 PM
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Man, that is NICE! Me, I'd clean it up a bit and leave it alone. I'm sure it's good to shoot, so have at it. A '49? Is it D/T for scope mounting? Great rifle you have there.
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  #10  
Old 03-30-2020, 4:28 PM
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Keep it oiled, keep it out of the rain and dew, immediately deal with any signs of rust and don't change anything else.
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  #11  
Old 03-30-2020, 5:13 PM
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I would have jumped on that in a heartbeat.
Good score
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  #12  
Old 03-30-2020, 7:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elk hunter View Post
The wear shows honest use, your 1949 date is exactly what I looked for. Enjoy that rifle.
Quote:
Originally Posted by edgerly779 View Post
Keep it clean and oiled and enjoy it. Bluing will cost min 100 -200 bucks.
Re-bluing will be visible, and I think most people would rather see it as it is. A rifle that's done a lot of work for its owner(s). A new barrel could never get that original rollmarking on it. My CMP Garand came with almost no finish on the barrel and that's the way it will stay.
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  #13  
Old 03-30-2020, 7:56 PM
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Default Model 70

Hate to say but re blueing will ruin the the history of that beauty.
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  #14  
Old 03-30-2020, 8:02 PM
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As others have said leave it be.
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  #15  
Old 03-30-2020, 9:43 PM
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Do not reblue that gun. It will be worth more in the long run without it. Just wipe the metal down with lightly oiled rag. Repeat every time you handle it. And I would probably give the stock a good rub with a little boiled linseed oil. No sandpaper on the stock. In the final analysis, you are not really the owner of that gun. Rather, you are its temporary custodian. The day will come when it will move on to its next custodian. Until then, do no harm.
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  #16  
Old 03-30-2020, 10:23 PM
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All pre-64 Model 70's were D&T at the factory, but only the receiver ring. That was for a rear scope block, and the front block was mounted on the barrel.
The rear bridge D&T started post war, but there are "transitional" rifles too. If you are correct on the DOM, the rear bridge will have one hole for a Redfield mount, and two holes for a Weaver mount.
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  #17  
Old 03-31-2020, 7:27 AM
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Good grief, that's a beautiful rifle as is. Just needs a little rubbin' down.

Leave 'er be (after cleaning and oiling the barrel, action and stock) and shoot it.

What splithoof, THBailey and Trap have said is all on the money.
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  #18  
Old 03-31-2020, 7:52 AM
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Thanks TRAP55 for the D/T clarification.

MLC
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  #19  
Old 03-31-2020, 9:14 AM
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I have to disagree with those that talk about leaving it alone, and being worth more the way it is.

1st. That gun is NOT Rare ! It is the most common pre 64 M70 there is.

2nd the reason why you got it for $300 is because it looks bad. a decent looking pre 64 M70 is more like a $1200 gun. The barrel has had the bluing sanded off, Probably a little rust along with it, and the rest is hand wear from being carried with sweaty hands.

This gun is not a collectors piece. I would not hesitate sending the metal out for Rebluing with someone who knows how to remove the minor blemishes without ruining the Roll Stamping on the barrel I'd refinish the stock myself and re-cut the checkering. But that's me.

I also would NOT put a scope on that gun. If you are actually wanting to keep the gun period correct, it needs a Redfield or Lyman Mod 48 or 57 Receiver Sight which it might already be drilled and tapped for. Look on the left side of the Rear Receiver Ring for two holes. Look on Ebay for a nice sight. (not a new one!) Here's one,,,

https://www.ebay.com/itm/EARLY-LYMAN...oAAOSw6qheco3J

If the gun was in your family and you knew the history of it, then that would be another matter, but you don't, so it is just a gun that was well used. So bring it back to what it used to look like and enjoy shooting it for the rest of your life,,, with a Peep Sight on it !!! Which will make you a better Rifleman,,, worthy of owning "the Rifleman's Rifle!"

Randy
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Last edited by W.R.Buchanan; 03-31-2020 at 9:30 AM..
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  #20  
Old 03-31-2020, 11:25 AM
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First, I have a 1961 M70 FW in .30-06. It was purchased by my father and was his primary deer gun. It replaced his 1959 M94 carbine. I own both now.

Clearly I have an emotional attachment far beyond any "collector" value. Mine show wear from stomping through pastures/woods in upstate NY, bouncing around in the back of our station wagon, and other stories etched in my memory. They will forever remain in their current state (at least on my watch).

On yours, I'd go with whatever you want to do to restore/refurbish it. So I agree with Buchanan. Especially about going out and shooting it.
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  #21  
Old 03-31-2020, 12:50 PM
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If the original finish was removed for whatever reason, I believe I would restore the rifle to its original glory. yeah, it would cost a dime, or three, but if it's not a sentimental thing in its current condition, go for it.

A gun you like, either for its looks or functionality, is a gun you'll shoot, and enjoy.
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  #22  
Old 03-31-2020, 8:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W.R.Buchanan View Post
I have to disagree with those that talk about leaving it alone, and being worth more the way it is.

1st. That gun is NOT Rare ! It is the most common pre 64 M70 there is.

2nd the reason why you got it for $300 is because it looks bad. a decent looking pre 64 M70 is more like a $1200 gun. The barrel has had the bluing sanded off, Probably a little rust along with it, and the rest is hand wear from being carried with sweaty hands.

This gun is not a collectors piece. I would not hesitate sending the metal out for Rebluing with someone who knows how to remove the minor blemishes without ruining the Roll Stamping on the barrel I'd refinish the stock myself and re-cut the checkering. But that's me.

I also would NOT put a scope on that gun. If you are actually wanting to keep the gun period correct, it needs a Redfield or Lyman Mod 48 or 57 Receiver Sight which it might already be drilled and tapped for. Look on the left side of the Rear Receiver Ring for two holes. Look on Ebay for a nice sight. (not a new one!) Here's one,,,


Randy
Hey Randy,

Got a Redfield 6x scope already waiting to be put on it!

I think your reply is the one I'm looking for. Luckily there isn't rust damage at, or pitting for that matter. I feel like if I put the elbow grease into it will have more sentimental value that I can hand off to the grandkids one day. I don't care about affecting resell value because I'm not interested in selling. The rifling is in great shape too so im hoping to get a shooter out of this. Thanks!
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Old 03-31-2020, 9:06 PM
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Pretty sure they are stainless steel if remember right mine says so on the barrel even though its blued it's a 243 varmint master mint except my dad engraved his driver's license number on the floor plate 50 years ago the sheriff was going around at the time loaning out the engraving tool.
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  #24  
Old 04-01-2020, 12:48 PM
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Wow, pre-64 AND made in 1949? What are the odds.

Kidding. Should be an interesting project. My dad gave me his old Model 54, which was the predecessor to the 70. Also in 30-'06. Purchased by my Grandfather in the early 1930s. Beautiful shape but the trigger and sear are a mess and need work before it's shootable again.

Having said that, I wish it was a Model 70. Some notable improvements over the M54 were made when they developed the M70.
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Old 04-01-2020, 1:53 PM
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Hawkeye: The reason for the Lyman Receiver Sight is to promote actual rifle shooting as it was in the year I was born.1949 Optics on Hunting rifles didn't really become popular until the late 1960's as they were generally pretty unreliable things and you always had your iron sights as back ups if the scope cacked.

I had a chance to buy a Griffin & Howe Sporterized Springfield at a gun show in Denver a couple of years ago. This was the high point in sporting rifles until Winchester came out with the M70. The gun had a 2.5X Alaskan Scope mounted on it on a QD G&H side mount and also had the Lyman 48 Receiver Sight base and he had the bridge as well with the gun.

With the Lyman Sight after it is sighted in exactly, You can remove the bridge by a push button, and then if needed you can slip it back on and it returns perfectly to the previous zero. So no matter what happened to the gun you were still in the game. The Scope Mount also repeated perfectly so that would retain it's zero on and off the gun. Those mounts alone are worth $1,000 any day of the week.

I have several .30-06 rifles. One is a Springfield 03A3 Sporter I built (Not done yet trying to emulate the NRA Sporter) It has a Lyman Sight as it will never be used any other way. I also have a Ruger Guide Gun with good Open Iron Sights and a 1-5 X Leupold on it. So I can go either way.

We are talking the Classic American Bolt Action Rifle and what they looked like back in the day when most everyone shot guns with iron sights. These guns were the evolution of the Winchester Lever Action Rifle in the sporting world. After the war all the GI's came home very familiar with peep sights (Garand and Carbine) So they were most popular.

Your gun can have both sighting systems.

Here's some pics of guns like yours, First two pics are Springfields the next two are M70's

Randy




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Last edited by W.R.Buchanan; 06-02-2020 at 8:50 AM..
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  #26  
Old 04-01-2020, 2:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elgatodeacero View Post
If the bore is good and action locks up properly, I would clean it gently and use it as is.
While everyone is entitled to their own opinion I agree to clean it gently. 71 year old rifle in good condition. No re-blue.
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  #27  
Old 04-01-2020, 5:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3006 View Post
Pretty sure they are stainless steel if remember right mine says so on the barrel even though its blued it's a 243 varmint master mint except my dad engraved his driver's license number on the floor plate 50 years ago the sheriff was going around at the time loaning out the engraving tool.
There are some that have Stainless Steel barrels, Winchester used stainless in a number of models, including shotguns. The barrels are coated with a finish called "Japanese Black", because stainless doesn't blue. It wasn't real durable, and usually seen with most of it rubbed off.
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  #28  
Old 04-01-2020, 5:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ki6vsm View Post
Wow, pre-64 AND made in 1949? What are the odds.

Kidding. Should be an interesting project. My dad gave me his old Model 54, which was the predecessor to the 70. Also in 30-'06. Purchased by my Grandfather in the early 1930s. Beautiful shape but the trigger and sear are a mess and need work before it's shootable again.

Having said that, I wish it was a Model 70. Some notable improvements over the M54 were made when they developed the M70.
Original 54 parts are about non-existent. The good news, a majority of Mod 70 parts work in the 54.
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Old 04-01-2020, 5:42 PM
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Clean that thing up and leave it as is. Go ahead and shoot it though.

That is a beautiful piece, please leave it as worn as it is. Broken parts can be replaced without harming it's history to much just to keep it in working order.
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  #30  
Old 04-01-2020, 5:42 PM
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I'm with Randy, collector value is pretty much gone, heirloom so it's not getting sold anyhow. Blue it, finish the stock, freshen the checkering, peep sight, or my preference, a vintage period correct Bausch & Lomb/Kuharsky Brothers mount and rings.

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  #31  
Old 04-01-2020, 7:42 PM
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For perspective, I am a shooter. So COAL -- clean, oil, ammo, "let her fly". Enjoy the shoot and take a moment each trip to think of Grandpa. That is the true worth of a family heirloom.
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Old 04-01-2020, 9:10 PM
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It doesn’t have any collectors value and you are planning on keeping it anyway. Do whatever you want to it.
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  #33  
Old 04-02-2020, 5:14 AM
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If it's not a collector rifle I would refinish the stock and let it go at that.
The barrel is 70 years old so bluing it is akin to polishing the valve cover on a 1974 pinto wagon in original condition.
When it quits shooting and put a new barrel on it that is the time to do any upgrades with the bluing and if you go stainless steel barrel just getting the action blued will save you some money as well.
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  #34  
Old 04-02-2020, 7:40 AM
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Is the butt pad original? Stock has more value if original. Many of these guns had after market recoil pads installed, so original stocks are pretty desirable.
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