(CO/10th Circuit) Peterson v. Martinez Official Appeal Thread

[Connor P Price]

Originally Posted by Window_Seat

OAK-DEN is quite a hefty price, but the Denver market has always been one of those that is quite expen$$$ive... I may consider going, but it also depends on exactly when the Nordyke en banc orals are going to be held.

Erik.

I am going out there with the girlfriend to see the area and try to sell her on moving there in a few months. It'd be to rich for my blood to make the trip just to see the case but since I'm headed out there around that time anyway I might as well try to kill two birds with one stone. I'm still waiting on approval to see if that weekend works...

[J.D.Allen]

Originally Posted by hoffmang

Absent more data, Amicus counsel will mean 1 from Brady, 1 from SAF/CGF, and 1 from NRA-CDF.

I expect SAF/CGF counsel to be Alan Gura, but it's early and everyone is gently confused by the court's order. What we can say is that this is unusual and means the court is taking the case very seriously which makes me cautiously optimistic.

I will be amused if this case, which CGF is covering the costs of and helped pull together, ends up being the first one up as it isn't directly in California but is part of the California permit strategy.

-Gene

I love it when a plan comes together.

[hoffmang]

Originally Posted by J.D.Allen

I love it when a plan comes together.

There are lots of reasons we fight on multiple fronts.

-Gene

[Gray Peterson]

Originally Posted by hoffmang

Absent more data, Amicus counsel will mean 1 from Brady, 1 from SAF/CGF, and 1 from NRA-CDF.

I expect SAF/CGF counsel to be Alan Gura, but it's early and everyone is gently confused by the court's order. What we can say is that this is unusual and means the court is taking the case very seriously which makes me cautiously optimistic.

I will be amused if this case, which CGF is covering the costs of and helped pull together, ends up being the first one up as it isn't directly in California but is part of the California permit strategy.

-Gene

Originally Posted by J.D.Allen

I love it when a plan comes together.

Us=The A Team. Denver, Colorado, and Brady/LCAV anti-gun crowd=General Tucco's crew. 10th Circuit Panel=Fighter Jet...

[oaklander]

Originally Posted by Gray Peterson

Us=The A Team. Denver, Colorado, and Brady/LCAV anti-gun crowd=General Tucco's crew. 10th Circuit Panel=Fighter Jet...

I seem to recall that once the black civil rights movement in the 1960's hit stride, you had a few race baiting white politicians who decried progress. Then they eventually lost office.

This is what you will see with our movement. And that is not conjecture - that is based on polling.


Sent from my brain, to yours. . .

[yellowfin]

^ That cannot come soon enough.

[Gray Peterson]

Late yesterday, Alan Gura has sent an acknowledgement form to the 10th Circuit Clerk. He will be arguing on behalf of SAF, CGF, and other state organizations amici in Peterson v. Martinez.

01/26/2012 [9937594] Notice of appearance submitted by Alan Gura for Amici Curiae Buckeye Firearms Foundation, Calguns Foundation, Inc., Citizens Rights Action League, Commonwealth Second Amendment, Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance, Hawaii Defense Foundation, Illinois Carry, Illinois State Rifle Association, Maine Open Carry Association, Maryland Shall Issue, Oregon Firearms Educational Foundation, Scope Inc., Second Amendment Foundation, Inc., Stillwater Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Inc., West Virginia Citizens Defense League Inc. and Wisconsin Carry Inc. for court review. Certificate of Interested Parties: No. Served on 01/26/2012. Manner of Service: ECF/NDA.--[Edited 01/26/2012 by SDS to remove pdf from entry as the pleading has been filed] AG

01/26/2012 [9937605] Notice of appearance filed by Mr. Alan Gura for Wisconsin Carry Inc., West Virginia Citizens Defense League Inc., Virginia Citizens Defense League, Inc., Stillwater Firearms Association, Second Amendment Foundation, Inc., Scope Inc., Oregon Firearms Educational Foundation, Maryland Shall Issue, Maine Open Carry Association, Illinois State Rifle Association, Illinois Carry, Hawaii Defense Foundation, Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance, Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Commonwealth Second Amendment, Citizens Rights Action League, Calguns Foundation, Inc. and Buckeye Firearms Foundation. CERT. OF INTERESTED PARTIES: n. Served on 01/26/2012. Manner of Service: ECF/NDA.

I'm looking forward to the "real argument" that will occur on March 19....

[Connor P Price]

I've already got the time off work to be there. Of course the girlfriend took to long and couldn't get the time off though!!! Now everyone and their mother is involved! Just my luck.

[hoffmang]

I'm likely flying there as well. That week is going to be action packed as the Nordyke oral arguments are that week as well.

-Gene

[freonr22]

Politely, is this watching history unfolding before us? There is an amazing amount of orgs in those notifications..

[press1280]

Originally Posted by freonr22

Politely, is this watching history unfolding before us? There is an amazing amount of orgs in those notifications..

Getting a substantial number of amicus briefs helps for a certiorari grant......

[Connor P Price]

Originally Posted by freonr22

Politely, is this watching history unfolding before us? There is an amazing amount of orgs in those notifications..

I'm just some schmoe on the internet, but IMHO... yes. History in the making indeed. More importantly, this seems to be just a precursor to the best part which is yet to come.

[OleCuss]

I think it entirely possible that in future years the top three 2A cases cited will be Heller, McDonald, and Peterson v. Martinez.

And as to why so many organizations? People like Gray - he's an impressive guy!

[markm]

Originally Posted by Gray Peterson

Late yesterday, Alan Gura has sent an acknowledgement form to the 10th Circuit Clerk. He will be arguing on behalf of SAF, CGF, and other state organizations amici in Peterson v. Martinez.

01/26/2012 [9937594] Notice of appearance submitted by Alan Gura for Amici Curiae Buckeye Firearms Foundation, Calguns Foundation, Inc., Citizens Rights Action League, Commonwealth Second Amendment, Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance, Hawaii Defense Foundation, Illinois Carry, Illinois State Rifle Association, Maine Open Carry Association, Maryland Shall Issue, Oregon Firearms Educational Foundation, Scope Inc., Second Amendment Foundation, Inc., Stillwater Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Inc., West Virginia Citizens Defense League Inc. and Wisconsin Carry Inc. for court review. Certificate of Interested Parties: No. Served on 01/26/2012. Manner of Service: ECF/NDA.--[Edited 01/26/2012 by SDS to remove pdf from entry as the pleading has been filed] AG

01/26/2012 [9937605] Notice of appearance filed by Mr. Alan Gura for Wisconsin Carry Inc., West Virginia Citizens Defense League Inc., Virginia Citizens Defense League, Inc., Stillwater Firearms Association, Second Amendment Foundation, Inc., Scope Inc., Oregon Firearms Educational Foundation, Maryland Shall Issue, Maine Open Carry Association, Illinois State Rifle Association, Illinois Carry, Hawaii Defense Foundation, Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance, Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Commonwealth Second Amendment, Citizens Rights Action League, Calguns Foundation, Inc. and Buckeye Firearms Foundation. CERT. OF INTERESTED PARTIES: n. Served on 01/26/2012. Manner of Service: ECF/NDA.

I'm looking forward to the "real argument" that will occur on March 19....

Congratulations Grey!!!

Good Luck and I hope you win big...for all of us!

markm

[Gray Peterson]

Originally Posted by OleCuss

I think it entirely possible that in future years the top three 2A cases cited will be Heller, McDonald, and Peterson v. Martinez.

And as to why so many organizations? People like Gray - he's an impressive guy!

Reason is that SAF is in my backyard, and look at the states in the list...all of them are orgs from states where CO doesn't recognize their licenses....

[OleCuss]

I like my reason better.

Your reason may be more rooted in fact - but I still like mine.

[Gray Peterson]

Originally Posted by OleCuss

I think it entirely possible that in future years the top three 2A cases cited will be Heller, McDonald, and Peterson v. Martinez.

That's a little scary.....

And as to why so many organizations? People like Gray - he's an impressive guy!

Read the brief which will show why....

[HowardW56]

Originally Posted by Gray Peterson

Late yesterday, Alan Gura has sent an acknowledgement form to the 10th Circuit Clerk. He will be arguing on behalf of SAF, CGF, and other state organizations amici in Peterson v. Martinez.

01/26/2012 [9937594] Notice of appearance submitted by Alan Gura for Amici Curiae Buckeye Firearms Foundation, Calguns Foundation, Inc., Citizens Rights Action League, Commonwealth Second Amendment, Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance, Hawaii Defense Foundation, Illinois Carry, Illinois State Rifle Association, Maine Open Carry Association, Maryland Shall Issue, Oregon Firearms Educational Foundation, Scope Inc., Second Amendment Foundation, Inc., Stillwater Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Inc., West Virginia Citizens Defense League Inc. and Wisconsin Carry Inc. for court review. Certificate of Interested Parties: No. Served on 01/26/2012. Manner of Service: ECF/NDA.--[Edited 01/26/2012 by SDS to remove pdf from entry as the pleading has been filed] AG

01/26/2012 [9937605] Notice of appearance filed by Mr. Alan Gura for Wisconsin Carry Inc., West Virginia Citizens Defense League Inc., Virginia Citizens Defense League, Inc., Stillwater Firearms Association, Second Amendment Foundation, Inc., Scope Inc., Oregon Firearms Educational Foundation, Maryland Shall Issue, Maine Open Carry Association, Illinois State Rifle Association, Illinois Carry, Hawaii Defense Foundation, Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance, Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Commonwealth Second Amendment, Citizens Rights Action League, Calguns Foundation, Inc. and Buckeye Firearms Foundation. CERT. OF INTERESTED PARTIES: n. Served on 01/26/2012. Manner of Service: ECF/NDA.

I'm looking forward to the "real argument" that will occur on March 19....

This will be good........

[terraformer]

Originally Posted by Gray Peterson

Read the brief which will show why....

That doesn't preclude you being a nice and impressive guy...

[Rossi357]

I was wondering why this case wasn't stayed pending Nordyke. Is it because it's in the 10th circuit and not the 9th?

[Gray Peterson]

Originally Posted by Rossi357

I was wondering why this case wasn't stayed pending Nordyke. Is it because it's in the 10th circuit and not the 9th?

That is correct. No Nordyke hold up....

[Window_Seat]

Originally Posted by hoffmang

I'm likely flying there as well. That week is going to be action packed as the Nordyke oral arguments are that week as well.

-Gene

If the arguments are on the same day, will the Court(s) accommodate for a different date?

I will ask for time off for Nordyke

Erik.

[J.D.Allen]

[Stonewalker]

Go team!

[goldrush]

Cool. Shop for the cheapest CCW, and every state has to accept it, if they grant reciprocity to any other state.

If forced to accept permits from states with lesser/different/other standards, states might very well drop their reciprocity schemes and get in the business of selling non-resident permits. They might even impose requirements to visit their state for issuance.

[Gray Peterson]

Originally Posted by goldrush

Cool. Shop for the cheapest CCW, and every state has to accept it, if they grant reciprocity to any other state.

If forced to accept permits from states with lesser/different/other standards, states might very well drop their reciprocity schemes and get in the business of selling non-resident permits. They might even impose requirements to visit their state for issuance.

I already visited the state to apply for the carry license in the first place. That is not at issue in this litigation particularly.

Also, the only "standard" being challenged here, at least on the reciprocity claim, is the home state resident reciprocity requirement as applied by Colorado. Home state requirements done by Florida and New Hampshire are constitutional because they offer non resident licenses.

South Carolina is the only other problem state (though their legislature may fix that this year) because they ban OC, require concealed carry, don't issue non resident licenses except to those who own land there, and the residents of 33 states are SOL.

one more thing: at CA10 level we're arguing about the appropriate ness the judges dismissal of the state party on the reciprocity claim. We're arguing the merits on the non resident license issuance. If CA10 orders issuance of the license....

How that translates into a future scenario you speak of, I have no idea.....

[kcbrown]

Originally Posted by Gray Peterson

That is correct. No Nordyke hold up....

If Nordyke were in the 10th and Peterson were in the 9th, I'm sure the 9th would find some reason to stay the case pending Nordyke...

[HowardW56]

Originally Posted by kcbrown

If Nordyke were in the 10th and Peterson were in the 9th, I'm sure the 9th would find some reason to stay the case pending Nordyke...

That is humorous but doubtful…
The 9th doesn’t seem to care how other circuits have ruled, they craft their own bizarre logic to provide the Supreme Court with additional material to disregard.

[Gray Peterson]

Originally Posted by kcbrown

If Nordyke were in the 10th and Peterson were in the 9th, I'm sure the 9th would find some reason to stay the case pending Nordyke...

If the 9th circuit was just trying to stall out gun cases, it may find the ground being shifted underneath them...

[emcon5]

Here is hoping the 10th come back first, and favorably. It will be interesting to see how the 9th would wordsmith to try and avoid a circuit split.

[Drivedabizness]

CA9 doesn't care about circuit splits...

[Gray Peterson]

Originally Posted by Drivedabizness

CA9 doesn't care about circuit splits...

Yes, but SCOTUS does....

[hoffmang]

Originally Posted by Drivedabizness

CA9 doesn't care about circuit splits...

But they do understand thier implications

-Gene

[wildhawker]

I happen to have a round-trip ticket to Denver. Whatever shall I do with it?


http://store.calgunsfoundation.org/p...p/coin-001.htm

Bingham!

-Brandon

[freonr22]

Originally Posted by wildhawker

I happen to have a round-trip ticket to Denver. Whatever shall I do with it?



-Brandon

Keep waiting for the lapel pins to ship?

[Connor P Price]

^That challenge coin looks awesome!

[krucam]

The NRA CRDF is pushing for more argument time...

01/27/2012 Open Document [9937898] Motion filed by Amici Curiae NRA Civil Rights Defense Fund, et al., to enlarge time for oral argument. Served on: 01/27/2012. Manner of service: ECF/NDA. MB

[press1280]

Originally Posted by krucam

The NRA CRDF is pushing for more argument time...

So they want to hitch themselves onto the case so they can claim victory just like McDonald.....

[hoffmang]

Originally Posted by press1280

So they want to hitch themselves onto the case so they can claim victory just like McDonald.....

No No! This is not ILA, but Civil Rights Defense Fund and this is a joint motion of all the Amici.

You can now read the motion here: http://www.hoffmang.com/firearms/pet...2012-01-27.pdf

-Gene

[Gray Peterson]

Originally Posted by press1280

So they want to hitch themselves onto the case so they can claim victory just like McDonald.....

This isn't ILA. This is the Civil Rights Defense Fund. Different org. Look them up...