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Centerfire Rifles - Manually Operated Lever action, bolt action or other non gas operated centerfire rifles.

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  #41  
Old 11-21-2019, 3:55 PM
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Tom, I'm gonna need some glass! if I'm gonna shoot like elk hunter, there. I can't bring the front sight into as clear a focus as I want to, and the rear semi buckhorn was a dark blob.

IMG_0971.jpg

In spite of that, this thing put 15 of 15 rounds onto a 15" gong @ 100 yards (sitting, both elbows on the bench). Nice way to break me in to .45-70.

Loads were commercial Remington, 405 gr sjsp, safe for Trapdoor rifles. From a 24" barrel, they're claimed to clock 1330 with a 100-yard zero. Figure they're travelling 1250 from the muzzle of my 18.5" Marlin. Easy on the shoulder, but good grief, that momentum.

I'm hooked.
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  #42  
Old 11-21-2019, 4:27 PM
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We got to get out to the Mojave. Anybody know if the fire restriction are lifted ?

Thats one purdy gun you have there
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  #43  
Old 11-21-2019, 4:43 PM
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I'm 70 and the glass helps a lot. The CB 45-70 I bought after the 30-30. The lower 30-30 is a mid 50's RC it is my wife's rifle. There's a lot of finish difference in all 3, used for comparisons. All shoot good. I still prefer a good iron sight but my eyes work better with the glass. All are nice guns but still not my favorites. I really don't think the op should be to leary of the new Marlins but it's his money and I would be just as cautious as he is. If I wanted a .38/.357 I would pay the extra and buy one of the new Winchesters, I've seen them and I like them except for the tang safety and rebound hammer. Other than that they are a well made rifle. Thanks for putting up with my 2 cents worth.

CB.jpg

RC.jpg

Last edited by elk hunter; 11-21-2019 at 4:51 PM..
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  #44  
Old 11-21-2019, 4:45 PM
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^ ^ ^ Nice! elk hunter. Thanks for the photos.




Quote:
We got to get out to the Mojave.
I was *going* to go for the 100-mile drive to hit the Mo-Jay-Vee today, but didn't have the time last night to load up for an early departure, so instead I drove just 25 miles to Angeles Shooting Ranges.

You bet we better! hit the Mojave.
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  #45  
Old 11-21-2019, 4:59 PM
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Chris and Mark: I got my Talley today and put a "Tasco World Class 1.5-4.5x32mm" on my .45. I'll send a picture to Mark tomorrow[Fri]. In-expensive scope I know, but, it will help with load development and hitting what I aim at. It actually seems to work pretty good.

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  #46  
Old 11-21-2019, 5:05 PM
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I could put my Ruger's Leupy 2.5 X 28 on my 1895... I have the pic rail rig from my '94 SBL...

*ponder*

And I said I'd never! scope a lever gun.
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  #47  
Old 11-21-2019, 5:11 PM
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Quote:
elk hunter

Thanks for putting up with my 2 cents worth.

Actually, we wish you'd post more often, truth be told.
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  #48  
Old 11-21-2019, 5:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 200Apples View Post
I could put my Ruger's Leupy 2.5 X 28 on my 1895... I have the pic rail rig from my '94 SBL...

*ponder*

And I said I'd never! scope a lever gun.
Any glass or iron sight that helps is a good thing what ever you decide to do will be a plus. That's a nice lever gun ya got there, I really like a straight grip like yours. What ever the op ends up with I hope he enjoys it for many years of safe fun shooting. I put that slip on recoil pad on to make it a little longer in the butt and to give me a sissy pad for shooting heavy loads. Light loads in these lever guns are just a ton of fun to shoot.
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  #49  
Old 11-21-2019, 6:29 PM
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Why not simply buy an older JM lever gun?
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  #50  
Old 11-21-2019, 6:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Milsurp1 View Post
Why not simply buy an older JM lever gun?
I thought that the price of the JMs would come down a little when they started making good guns again. It doesn't seem like they have the quality up.

The people who own the JM stamped guns are real proud of them and the $$ shows it, plus there isn't a whole bunch out there for sale.
You also have to be careful of the JM stamped guns. A lot of them were made and stamped JM by Remington. Some of them are really bad. Assembled by butthurt employees in the early 2000s..
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  #51  
Old 11-21-2019, 7:30 PM
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C&R JM Marlins can be bought for under $600 on GB.
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  #52  
Old 11-21-2019, 7:31 PM
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Quote:
elk hunter

The CB 45-70 I bought after the 30-30.

Attachment 851384
Quote:
Any glass or iron sight that helps is a good thing what ever you decide to do will be a plus. That's a nice lever gun ya got there, I really like a straight grip like yours. What ever the op ends up with I hope he enjoys it for many years of safe fun shooting. I put that slip on recoil pad on to make it a little longer in the butt and to give me a sissy pad for shooting heavy loads. Light loads in these lever guns are just a ton of fun to shoot.

Holy Toledo, Ohio. Is that a .45-70 Cowboy w/ an octagonal barrel and full-length mag tube?



I do like my new, used 1895 GS, but I've become accustomed to the palm swell/pistol grip buttstocks and curved levers. Nothing finer than a blued 22" 1895... but I prefer shorter barrels for shorter overall-length guns.

Gotta be someone out there with a pistol-grip, walnut stock and forend on a stainless 1895 that wants a straight stock. We can swap buttstocks, forends, trigger plates (curved for straight) and levers! Oh boy oh boy oh boy...




Quote:
elk hunter

I would pay the extra and buy one of the new Winchesters, I've seen them and I like them except for the tang safety and rebound hammer. Other than that they are a well made rifle.
Those Miroku Winchesters are subperb. In fact, WE KNOW someone in this thread that recently acquired one, new, in .45 Colt... and I would agree with you. Nothing wrong with a Winchester 1892... perhaps the most beautiful lever carbine made (I own a Miroku Browning Winchester 1892 in .44 Magnum). I just cotton to my Marlins.





Quote:
Milsurp1

Why not simply buy an older JM lever gun?
Quote:
golfish

I thought that the price of the JMs would come down a little when they started making good guns again. It doesn't seem like they have the quality up.

The people who own the JM stamped guns are real proud of them and the $$ shows it, plus there isn't a whole bunch out there for sale.
You also have to be careful of the JM stamped guns. A lot of them were made and stamped JM by Remington. Some of them are really bad. Assembled by butthurt employees in the early 2000s..

Even the older, "good" JM-stamped guns from the early-90s and before can have their issues, such as the "Marlin jam (or, "letting in two" [from the mag])... that stuff can be easily fixed.

What the older guns have is that they were made by skilled professionals that knew their trade, and the factory machine work and assembly was better; it was as it should always be, not like what comes off the factory floor these days. At least the new guns have "good bones", as I mentioned when I spoke about the problems my recently-made 1894 SBL had.

Once a lever Marlin is made right, there's nothing like it.
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  #53  
Old 11-21-2019, 8:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 200Apples View Post

Those Miroku Winchesters are subperb. In fact, WE KNOW someone in this thread that recently acquired one, new, in .45 Colt... and I would agree with you. Nothing wrong with a Winchester 1892... perhaps the most beautiful lever carbine made (I own a Miroku Browning Winchester 1892 in .44 Magnum). I just cotton to my Marlins.
The Japanese really make a nice rifle. The 92 short rifle has to be my favorite lever fun.

I kind of kicked myself for not getting the new R92 in 44mag. The next one will be for sure. Reloading has really opened up a lot more calibers for me.
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  #54  
Old 11-21-2019, 9:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 200Apples View Post
Actually, we wish you'd post more often, truth be told.
Yes, Apples is correct. Thank you for your 2 cents Elk hunter! And thank you for the pics! Very nice!

I really don't know much about guns other than what I read in these forums and see on youtube. And I think some of you who know what you are talking about probably know how dangerous it is to trust some forums and youtube. I think I got lucky with you bunch!
Since I know so little, and I'm not very handy, I went with a custom Marlin shop and spoke to the gentleman who owns it, Lew. I asked him if he could please treat my rifle like it was one he would pass down to his grand kids, and to do whatever he thinks is necessary to make it function well and reliable. Here is what he said he will do:

Trigger Job on factory components
Action smoothing
Dehorn factory lever
Dehorn loading port
Barrel, remove & recrown w/11 target crown
Loading gate, modify for easy unloading/downloading
Smooth, round, deburr trigger & refinish
Floppy trigger fix
Test fired & sighted-in at 50 yards with Hornady ammunition

He also said he would try a bunch of different rounds to make sure they all function well and cycle without problems. Even if I could do this stuff myself, I live in a two bedroom one bath apartment with my daughter's Barbie dolls everywhere. I don't have a work bench to do this stuff. I really wish I did. But I do play the lottery every week, so maybe one day? Haha.
Thanks again everyone! I'm really enjoying this thread! Lever gun people are good people!
Your pal,
jerdog3
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  #55  
Old 11-21-2019, 9:13 PM
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Have two JM Marlins. 22 and 45 LC. Bought a newer non JM 357/38. Very rough action and would occasionally lock up.

$125 to the gunsmith to clean the assembly gunk out. Stone a few parts and replace the plastic follower with a metal one.

Works great. Smooth fast and easy. No lock ups or problems.

Moral of the story is buy the non JM and let the gunsmith de flaw it and you will be happy. Bonus is the price is lower so it works out well financially.
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  #56  
Old 11-21-2019, 9:50 PM
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Every new marlin I've examined has canted barrel/canted sights.

If you're using a scope or sticking with the factory rear sight then its not a big deal but if you're using a receiver sight you will see the front sight tilted to the left.

That's what you're going to get from a new Marlin!
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  #57  
Old 11-21-2019, 10:19 PM
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Quote:
I went with a custom Marlin shop and spoke to the gentleman who owns it, Lew. I asked him if he could please treat my rifle like it was one he would pass down to his grand kids, and to do whatever he thinks is necessary to make it function well and reliable. Here is what he said he will do:

I'd go with this guy. That is a solid perspective, too. I was able to do most of what's on that list to several of my long guns... but I have a garage work bench and some rudimentary gun tools.

Nothing against the +/- $3000 custom stuff (on your donor Marlin! yet), but the philosophy of this fellow Lew you just now spoke of is very sound.

Good luck! and we wait eagerly for pictures.
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  #58  
Old 11-22-2019, 12:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 200Apples View Post
I'd go with this guy. That is a solid perspective, too. I was able to do most of what's on that list to several of my long guns... but I have a garage work bench and some rudimentary gun tools.

Nothing against the +/- $3000 custom stuff (on your donor Marlin! yet), but the philosophy of this fellow Lew you just now spoke of is very sound.

Good luck! and we wait eagerly for pictures.
Thank you Apples! I don't want to get a bunch of people bothering Lew for a killer deal, but after talking with me and understanding my position, he really worked with me.
Like most of us here, I never envisioned a version of America where our own government would confiscate our guns. I now see that as a very real possibility. For that reason, and because I dream of my grand kids and great grand kids shooting my guns, I am now only acquiring firearms that don't have detachable magazines. Starting with this Marlin.
I think the Ruger GP100 will be next. It's not the sexiest revolver, nor is it the most refined, but it's a tank and will out last generations of my family. And be passed down from one to the next.
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  #59  
Old 11-22-2019, 6:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smittty View Post
Every new marlin I've examined has canted barrel/canted sights.

If you're using a scope or sticking with the factory rear sight then its not a big deal but if you're using a receiver sight you will see the front sight tilted to the left.

That's what you're going to get from a new Marlin!
Well smitty I'm sorry you've had such bad luck looking at Marlins. I have had exactly the other side of that, the one and only Marlin I have seen that was messed up so bad it had to be replaced was a .338 stainless steel gun. The barrel was threaded in crooked and to me that's a pretty serious stuff. A crooked sight I do not see but a forearm that is off center on the mag tube I have seen, it has no effect what so ever on the function of the rifle. The solution for you is to not buy a Marlin or only buy old Marlins. I looked at two older ones the other day a .35 Rem. and a even older .32 Win Spl. I should have bought both of them but held out for cleaner rifles. Have a nice day.
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Old 11-22-2019, 8:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by golfish View Post
Don't think for a minute that ever Henry is perfect. They just have better customer service.

Best bet is to get the gun that your buying in hand and inspect it.
^^^ Bingo. I got a new Big Boy 44 a few years ago. Half the time, it wouldn't feed or eject & the sights were so far off, they couldn't be adjusted or drifted. I sent it back & when it came back, it was worse than before.
Henry sent me a replacement rifle but I didn't want to risk more frustration; when it arrived at my dealer, I let him keep it & got something else.
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Old 11-22-2019, 9:06 AM
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Originally Posted by 200Apples View Post
Tom, I'm gonna need some glass! if I'm gonna shoot like elk hunter, there. I can't bring the front sight into as clear a focus as I want to, and the rear semi buckhorn was a dark blob.

Attachment 851373

In spite of that, this thing put 15 of 15 rounds onto a 15" gong @ 100 yards (sitting, both elbows on the bench). Nice way to break me in to .45-70.

Loads were commercial Remington, 405 gr sjsp, safe for Trapdoor rifles. From a 24" barrel, they're claimed to clock 1330 with a 100-yard zero. Figure they're travelling 1250 from the muzzle of my 18.5" Marlin. Easy on the shoulder, but good grief, that momentum.

I'm hooked.
Apples, that's a nice looking Boar Buster there, and would make a fine rig for some of those bears up in Alaska I'm sure. I hear ya about the eyes getting older. Mine are going in the same direction.
I would entertain a single-shot .45-70 with a 16" barrel; there is something about that caliber that is just kool!
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  #62  
Old 11-22-2019, 9:16 AM
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I have four "pre-Remington" Marlin lever actions. My oldest, a 1936, I inherited from my Dad. It is naturally slicked up due to decades of deer hunting. No issues here except the firing pin is fragile and can break if accidently dry fired (known issue).

My 336CS I bought new in 1994 was perfect right out of the box. It still is.

I bought a new 39A in 1977 that was pretty rough. I actually had to go through 3 rifles at the dealer before selecting one I could deal with. After several work-overs, it is finally smooth as glass and dead-on accurate.

In 2009 I bought a JM 1894 in .45 Colt. It would jam on the lever up-stroke and I had to bevel the front edge on the carrier so it wouldn't hang up on the next cartridge in line. There are some other minor internal issues I haven't worked out yet but it doesn't keep me from enjoying the rifle.

So, JM Marlins are not automatically better. The 39A was largely hand fitted so quality would vary from one rifle to another. Easily corrected (at least in my case) but I would check quality before purchase (even a nice used one). The 336 series is a modern design that relies on precision machining for fit and finish and it shows.

I just wish (and have always wished) that the 336 design would be scaled down to 39A proportions and finally retire the 39A for good. It would be the finest .22 lever action available if they did that.

Dan
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Old 11-22-2019, 10:35 AM
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[QUOTE=200Apples;23624448]Holy Toledo, Ohio. Is that a .45-70 Cowboy w/ an octagonal barrel and full-length mag tube?

Yes it is the short barrel version.
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Old 11-22-2019, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Win231 View Post
^^^ Bingo. I got a new Big Boy 44 a few years ago. Half the time, it wouldn't feed or eject & the sights were so far off, they couldn't be adjusted or drifted. I sent it back & when it came back, it was worse than before.
Henry sent me a replacement rifle but I didn't want to risk more frustration; when it arrived at my dealer, I let him keep it & got something else.
Everyone makes problem things from time to time, it's just part of it. How the company deals with it is what separates them.
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Old 11-22-2019, 10:42 AM
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Something nice, a Mod. 94 in 38-55. Up grade wood and skinner sights.

38-55.jpg
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Old 11-22-2019, 2:00 PM
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Marlin CB 45-70 cast 405 gr. 15 gr. Unique at 50 yd. Top right bullet is a experiment, yep it did make a difference. Actually there are 2 experiments/tests in this group, a hot barrel group and the shot out to the right high 4 ring is seated to deep. Pretty clear this Marlin does not like to change the seating depth much.

Cast.jpg
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Old 11-22-2019, 2:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elk hunter View Post
Something nice, a Mod. 94 in 38-55. Up grade wood and skinner sights.

Attachment 851526
Whao, that is a NICE looking rifle! Great cartridge to boot. That is slick elk hunter.

MLC
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Old 11-22-2019, 2:53 PM
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That's one of the new Maurko 94's, I wish I had bought a Big Boer 94 in .375 but I had some of those dumb moments right about that time.
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Old 11-22-2019, 3:04 PM
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Dang. Nice wood.

Another tidy grouping, too.


I have in hand a bag (250 pcs) of 405 gr LFP from Brazos Bullets, coated with Missouri Bullets' Hi-Tek powdercoat.

I'm gonna assemble me some of these 405 gr LFPs with that 15 grs Unique (I have seen this recipe elsewhere, too), and another, according to IMR/Hodgden consisting of 45.5 grs (starting load, good for 1600 fps but with little pressure, 17,300 CUP) IMR 3031. They list that as a "Trapdoor" load! with 'lever' rifle, and then 'modern' rifle loads even faster.

This is just too much fun and I'm not even shooting today!
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Old 11-22-2019, 6:11 PM
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Let us know how your loads work out, I would caution you on the heavier 45-70 loads if you have never shot any in a light rifle. They can be quiet eye opening to say the least. The 15 gr load of unique in my rifle is just down right fun to shoot and at roughly 1,400 fps it should hunt. Good luck.
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Old 11-22-2019, 6:53 PM
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Originally Posted by elk hunter View Post
Everyone makes problem things from time to time, it's just part of it. How the company deals with it is what separates them.
Exactly. And a manufacturer should know that a customer is already disappointed when a new gun doesn't work, so they should make damn sure it's repaired before shipping it back to the customer....which Henry didn't. Especially when the manual says, "Before your gun was shipped, it was inspected & test fired." (self flattering B.S.) If it was test fired, they would have known it didn't function.

Last edited by Win231; 11-22-2019 at 6:56 PM..
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Old 11-22-2019, 7:01 PM
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Exactly. And a manufacturer should know that a customer is already disappointed when a new gun doesn't work, so they should make damn sure it's repaired before shipping it back to the customer....which Henry didn't.
This isn't the first time that I've read about this.

I do have a solution that worked for me. I wasn't that impressed with Henry's customer service so I sent the President of the company an email.

He sent me new furniture for my H001 that was damaged by me along with a hat and a coffee mug.

When Henry comes out with a side loading 44, I'll be first in line
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Old 11-22-2019, 7:09 PM
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Eventually, I'm still thinking of buying some Skinner Sights.
.

Highly recommend Skinner sights
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Old 11-22-2019, 7:47 PM
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Highly recommend Skinner sights
Your so right, I wish my old eyes could adjust to them. I'm saving them in hopes that my son and grandson will be able to put them to us
.
I really like the "Black and Gold" sights that they make for the Marlin.
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Old 11-23-2019, 9:45 AM
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I always love to hear how all the new Marlins are junk and not even suitable as Fence Posts.

Guys there are 4 different levels of Marlin Rifles. There's the $3-500 guns, and they don't get a whole lot of love at the factory. They are made to that price point and are generally suitable as "Truck Guns" which is exactly what they were designed for. They are made for people who don't have a lot of money but need a gun that goes bang.

Next comes the $7-800 guns and they are much better and generally need little TLC to work really well. Still not all that in the finish department, but much nicer than the cheap guns.

Next is the $1300 guns and they are nice, and that is because they get much more hand work put into them at the factory and get much nicer wood. I have seen a bunch of these go thru my LGS and nobody has whined about them, they are nice!

Then there is the Custom Shop Guns. They start at $3000 and are hand built in the Dakota Arms/Remington Custom Shop in Sturgis SD.

The whining and simple problems that were mentioned in the first part of this thread can be easily fixed in one of two ways.

1. Look at the gun before you buy it. If it sucks don't buy it. Nobody is holding a gun to your head even if you special ordered it. Make the dealer send it back and get another. You don't get to whine and bash the company if you chose to buy a turd. Go look in the mirror and repeat "I am an Idiot" 100 times every morning.

2. go to www.Leverguns.com and read the simple instructions on how to slick these guns up. If you can operate a screwdriver, a file and sandpaper you can do everything needed to make even a turd in to a polished performer.

The difference between all the different levels of these guns is the amount of "hand work" that goes into the assembly of the gun and the quality of the finish IE: metal and wood.

The truck guns get 2x4's for wood and it looks like Black Oxide or cerakote paint for the bluing. And they will eventually smooth out after much cycling if you are too dense to do some simple internal work.

The better guns get nicer wood and get finished to a higher level.

I have not seen one $1300 Marlin that wasn't perfect in everyway and absolutely beautiful. These guns are on par with the Winchester Rifles made by Miroku which also cost @$1300.

Thinking you are going to get quality and perfection at bargain basement prices is kind of naive. But that doesn't mean you can't make the gun nice by putting a little elbow grease into it. Refinishing the wood is not that hard and very rewarding when done. I've done it to many guns and it is fun. See Pics below .

I can do an "Action Job" on a 1894 1895 or 336 in less than 2 hours and after doing a couple you can too.

It ain't that hard! The guns in the pics were both $500 guns. 1895 CB .45-70 on top and 1894 CB .44 Special/ Magnum bottom. Both guns were so plain jane it was pathetic look what a simple wood refinish will do. Both will cycle rounds as fast as you can run the lever, and are accurate too boot.

Randy



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Last edited by W.R.Buchanan; 11-23-2019 at 11:23 AM..
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Old 11-23-2019, 9:49 AM
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elk hunter

Let us know how your loads work out, I would caution you on the heavier 45-70 loads if you have never shot any in a light rifle. They can be quiet eye opening to say the least.

The 15 gr load of unique in my rifle is just down right fun to shoot and at roughly 1,400 fps it should hunt. Good luck.

Thanks again! for sharing your learned experience and advice. It is appreciated. 1400-1500 fps is the upper limit of what I wish to shoot, and that is using the 405 grain slug.

This 7-lb carbine isn't a 10-lb Springfield.
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Old 11-23-2019, 9:58 AM
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Outstanding, Randy!
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Old 11-23-2019, 10:03 AM
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OK Randy, that is interesting about the different grades. I didn't know.
Are there different model numbers, so I can simply order a higher grade to start with?
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Old 11-23-2019, 10:14 AM
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You should go to their web page and click on the custom shop stuff, you might be impressed.
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Old 11-23-2019, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by elk hunter View Post
You should go to their web page and click on the custom shop stuff, you might be impressed.
Thank you for that, so I just did.
A 1894 SBL IN .44 would be of interest, especially if the custom shop would give it a matte finish. I really like the laminate stock as well.
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