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  #1  
Old 07-16-2019, 10:10 PM
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Default Looking for a good unleaded 22-250 load

Thinking about doing some coyote hunting and need a good unleaded load. I have been shooting Superformance 40gr V-Max but that's not gonna fly any longer. Any help would be appreciated.
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  #2  
Old 07-17-2019, 5:42 AM
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You could try the Barnes 53gr TSX and some Varget. That oughta do.
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Old 07-17-2019, 5:52 AM
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For a 22/250 you are going to need something in the 35 gr range.

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.c...-ntx-100-count

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Old 07-17-2019, 6:00 AM
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Originally Posted by pdq_wizzard View Post
For a 22/250 you are going to need something in the 35 gr range.

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.c...-ntx-100-count

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+1,

Most 22.250s have a 12" or 14" twist barrel and the 14s won't stabilize the 50 grain copper bullets. The 12" twist barrels are marginal, some will and some won't. If you have the 1:9" twist Savage then you can shoot the heavier bullets.
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Old 07-17-2019, 6:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Fjold View Post
+1,

Most 22.250s have a 12" or 14" twist barrel and the 14s won't stabilize the 50 grain copper bullets. The 12" twist barrels are marginal, some will and some won't. If you have the 1:9" twist Savage then you can shoot the heavier bullets.
Correct. I was thinking of 53gr Sierra bthp, which worked very well in my 22-250.[1-12 twist]
TSX was an oppsy on my part. Sorry OP.
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Old 07-17-2019, 8:09 AM
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and you will be better off with the Barnes TTSX and not the TSX. Better expansion
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  #7  
Old 07-17-2019, 1:27 PM
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If you are leaving a 40 grain Vmax Id say you should try the 35 or 40 grain Nosler lead free.
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Old 07-17-2019, 3:51 PM
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Originally Posted by MongooseV8 View Post
If you are leaving a 40 grain Vmax Id say you should try the 35 or 40 grain Nosler lead free.
Way, way too frangible! Those are varmint bullets, not predator bullets. I have used the 50gr LFBT in the 250 and even those are not the best choice, but will work. I would suggest something more along these little new:

https://www.lehighdefense.com/index....er-38gr-bullet

https://www.lehighdefense.com/index....er-45gr-bullet

Reasonably priced, shoot well, and work exactly as advertised.
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Old 07-17-2019, 4:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bisley View Post
Way, way too frangible! Those are varmint bullets, not predator bullets. I have used the 50gr LFBT in the 250 and even those are not the best choice, but will work. I would suggest something more along these little new:

https://www.lehighdefense.com/index....er-38gr-bullet

https://www.lehighdefense.com/index....er-45gr-bullet

Reasonably priced, shoot well, and work exactly as advertised.
I use the 36 grain Varmint Grenades at 4400+ fps out of my 22.250 AI on coyotes. It makes a little tiny entry hole and explodes their internals. I haven't had a coyote take more than one step when hit out to about 400 yards.

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Old 07-17-2019, 5:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fjold View Post
I use the 36 grain Varmint Grenades at 4400+ fps out of my 22.250 AI on coyotes. It makes a little tiny entry hole and explodes their internals. I haven't had a coyote take more than one step when hit out to about 400 yards.

Last I looked NOSLER made Nosler bullets, as I was referencing to. I can't attest to VG bullets as I refuse to use anything by that company. But When a 50gr Nosler at just under 4000fps leaves a hole the size of my fist, but not very deep, in the vitals and it still tries to get up, I wouldn't dream of trying a 35 or 40gr. And not once, but twice, in a matter of minutes apart. Granted it would not have gotten far most likely, but still not what I would recommend after seeing it. I had the same exact scenario with the 50gr Nosler LFBT on three fox with the .223 as well. That's when I started looking at the Lehigh. The idea of fracturing but still having the base keep penetrating sounded like the best of both worlds. Another member on here has taken two with them, with much lower speed from a .223 to boot, and with the same placement both were DRT. Which makes sense as they were designed specifically for depredation, not varmints.

Again, just what I've experienced.
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Old 07-17-2019, 6:21 PM
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My comment was about frangible varmint bullets being used on coyotes. I use them a lot and have probably taken 50 or so coyotes with them in the last ten years. All of them one shot kills.
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  #12  
Old 07-17-2019, 7:08 PM
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My comment was about frangible varmint bullets being used on coyotes. I use them a lot and have probably taken 50 or so coyotes with them in the last ten years. All of them one shot kills.
There are many frangible bullets on the market. I am speaking directly about the Nosler LFBT, never said all frangible bullets were not good. Big, big difference.

The NTX 35gr might be a good option too. I almost forgot about that one. I know Al Morris of Foxpro has had great success with it in the 250. It worked better for me in the .223 than the 50gr Nosler LFBT. I disected both the NTX and LFBT and found that the NTX has a much denser substance that looks like clay that fills the bullet instead of the copper sinter, which looks like loose packed saw shavings of copper in the LFBT. You can see why it would tend to splash if you ever looked inside. I have pictures somewhere of it. Also explains why the NTX don't seem to be as destructive on ground squirrels too, which is what I have heard about the VG as well, but can't attest personally to those.
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Old 07-18-2019, 3:27 PM
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Sorry Bisley I dont agree. The Nosler lead free bullets are no where near as frangible as a Hornady Vmax....which thousands of people prefer for coyotes. Like posted above they are great for both pelts and terminal affect.

The OP is currently using Vmax and a Nosler lead free is a close alternative.
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Old 07-18-2019, 4:54 PM
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Are you talking about the older Noslers? They used to make lead free bullets with a powdered copper core.
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Old 07-18-2019, 9:10 PM
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Originally Posted by MongooseV8 View Post
Are you talking about the older Noslers? They used to make lead free bullets with a powdered copper core.
I don't know about a copper "powder", but they are made with sinter, which is like I described earlier as looking like saw shavings. Let me explain in some lengthy detail.

After deciding to switch to lead free years ahead of schedule just to be ready I began playing with the Hornady 35gr NTX. I had a friend who had lost several coyotes with the 40gr Nosler LFBT. So bad that he actually never recovered any. Only bullet he had that problem with in his .223. This is why I chose the NTX to play with. I had found a load that worked great in my three .223's with the NTX and continued using it. There was a night and day difference between the NTX and the V-Max obviously. Then Nosler introduced the 50gr LFBT. I figured with an additional 25% more weight that they might be better for coyotes and still work for squirrels, so I found a load that worked in all three guns also for the 50gr LFBT. Then while shooting squirrels at a friends ranch on a couple of occasions we noticed we tell which bullet was being used just by the reaction to squirrels being hit. The NTX would have a good toss now and then, but not consistently. The LFBT on the other hand would throw them around very, very well. This made me start to wonder why. That is when I decided to tear into them, literally. Here is what I found.

The first one was the Nosler 50gr LFBT (Lead Free Ballistic Tip). pulled the tip, peeled the jacket back and found a bunch of loose copper shavings sitting under a clear plastic retainer. I did not have to scrape it to get it to come out, it literally poured right out. They were not very tightly packed in there.






So then I did the same with the 35gr NTX. After removing the tip, and under a clear plastic retainer as well was this "substance". Best visual I can give is that it looked like clay dust. And unlike the Nosler, this "dust" was packed in there very tight and solid. You can see the clumps still held together in the picture. Some came loose as I pulled it apart, but much of it was still in a solid state. This reminded me of the non-toxic e-shot I use for shotgun. It is a compressed powder formed into a ball. It can be broken into powder with a pair of pliers, but the heat and compression from being shot keeps it together as it flies and hits. Isn't science crazy?







Then came the real world testing. Three fox in one night with the Nosler LFBT in a .223 with less than hoped fr results. While they were all certainly dead and recovered, a second shot was needed just in case because we were hunting at night and didn't need wounded fox running around someone's orchard. That's a great way to lose your privliges.

Next was to try the same 50gr LFBT in a much quicker .22-250. Two coyotes on one stand with similar results. The first shot was a chest shot. It went down but tried to get up slowly like a drunken sailor. it probably wouldn't have made it but a handful of steps, but again, at night in someone else's orchard you don't want to risk having messy coyotes laying around at random for their workers or family to have to see. As you can also see, the second shot in the neck was pretty much a splash wound as well.




The second coyote from the same stand was a nice shot right behind the front leg, as you can see. And while it went down, it did try to creep away as well. This one left what looked like a lead core bullet exit hole, but it is the entry hole. Very much another splash type wound.




So my final conclusion was yes, while they will kill, so will a FMJ, but that does not make it an ideal choice. I know others have reported having good results with the LFBT, but my experience has not been that. I have also had others tell me they have had similar experience with the LFBT as well. This is why for coyotes I have gone to the Lehigh Controlled Chaos in 62gr and 55gr for both my .223 and .22-250 since they are 1-8 and 1-9 twist respectively. The 1-12 twist H&R has 38ge Lehigh Controlled Chaos and 35gr NTX loaded for it.

As another note, after literally a truck bed full of rabbits, with pictures as well, I will only use the NTX for cottontail. The LFBT cut even jacks in half, let alonr cottontail. The NTX tend to leave a small entrance with a reasonable exit wound, still allowing me to salvage it instead of leaving rabbit soup.

Again, this is just what I have kept a semi detailed account of. I know not everyone has the same experiences, but dozens and dozens of the same results sure tend to leave a definite opinion in my mind instead of just hearing someone on a rando keyboard tell me how good or bad they work. Personally if I were looking just to use it on coyotes and I had a 1-12 or 1-14 I would start with the 38gr Lehigh if I had to do it all over again. If I wanted a dual purpose load which meant a much cheaper bullet for blasting squirrels as well as coyotes occasionally, I would start with the 35gr NTX. Just my random thoughts through lots and lots of time, $$$$, and testing.
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Old 07-18-2019, 11:14 PM
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Hmm I wish I could get that kind of result using them on ground squirrels. Im shooting them at some blazing speeds and occasionally get a tossed rat. I miss the leaded days.
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Old 07-19-2019, 12:07 PM
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Hmm I wish I could get that kind of result using them on ground squirrels. Im shooting them at some blazing speeds and occasionally get a tossed rat. I miss the leaded days.
It was a sad, sad, sad day this last July 1st. We all miss the leaded days.

If your twist rate will allow, try the 50gr Nosler LFBT. The 35 & 40gr worked noticably better for me than the NTX, but the 50gr really tosses them around to my liking, even in the .223. I expected the faster moving lower weight bullets to do it the best, but I was happily wrong. The 50's will make a billy goat puke too when you see what they do to rabbits!
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Old 07-24-2019, 8:04 PM
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Thanks for all the info, I am going to try the 36gr VG's since I already have some and had decent luck with them using my Tikka Sporter. I have never hunted with the vG's but I have seen some of the damage, very impressive.

Frank, what powder(s) have you had good luck with?
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Old 07-25-2019, 9:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Bisley View Post
It was a sad, sad, sad day this last July 1st. We all miss the leaded days.

If your twist rate will allow, try the 50gr Nosler LFBT. The 35 & 40gr worked noticably better for me than the NTX, but the 50gr really tosses them around to my liking, even in the .223. I expected the faster moving lower weight bullets to do it the best, but I was happily wrong. The 50's will make a billy goat puke too when you see what they do to rabbits!
Im using the 55 grain version in my 243AI at about 4125-4150fps. I have a pile of the 224 40 grainers Ive used in a 223. Both work but not like the lead versions
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