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  #41  
Old 01-02-2015, 8:51 PM
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I'm thinking that since these cards are issued by an FFL and are NOT forwarded to the state for record keeping it would stand to reason that if you wanted a replacement card you would need to go back to the FFL from which you were originally issued.
Not necessarily the original clerk who issued the card but the original FFL business where the original form is kept.
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  #42  
Old 01-02-2015, 8:51 PM
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Mmmm......so maybe it's just our stores policy. I thought DOJ was requiring it. Thanks for the input.
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  #43  
Old 01-02-2015, 9:01 PM
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they should have just stuck with the issued cards just like the hsc this new internet system sucks balls it takes too much time and ties up a computer which could be used for running a dros hand written cards are soo much easier
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  #44  
Old 01-02-2015, 9:05 PM
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So, get one from a FFL that won't go out of business like I did for my HSC.
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  #45  
Old 01-02-2015, 9:14 PM
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It sounds all jacked up before it got started. The plan was there was no plan.......kind of like the government
was involved.
-g
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  #46  
Old 01-02-2015, 9:15 PM
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Are the questions the same as the ones found on the HSC?
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  #47  
Old 01-02-2015, 9:16 PM
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The sign I saw in bold letters at my local Big 5 said you had to have a credit card to even get a FSC it said it is a mandatory requirement. I asked the clerk if it was for receiving the 25$ payment or to prove residency he didn't even know offhand it was news to him. I was all isn't that clearly unconstitutional and possibly discriminatory or at the very least a little economically biased since not everyone has credit cards so it shouldn't be a prerequisite he said he would have to ask the manager who then said he would have to call the corporate office who would then in turn would need call the DOJ since they weren't informed of any other options. I have never been so happy it was the 30th and I was picking up a rifle with just a valid CDL since it already looks like it going to be a freaking mess.
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  #48  
Old 01-02-2015, 9:22 PM
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Leave it up to the CADOJ to screw up things even worse than before, seems like a tactic to discourage customers, so much for a "free market".!
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  #49  
Old 01-02-2015, 9:46 PM
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Well the clerk took my card into a locked back room (much like calif politics) and charged $15.00 to Cali doj. No receipt given but can be requested via e-mail at doj's website. Then up at the register charged me $10.00 for big 5 to pay for the cost that doj charges them to be able to give out the freaking card! You get a receipt for that. The questions are easy no brainers: safe to shoot at water, legal age for handgun, legal age to buy a long gun, legal way to transport,when does legal right to protect themselves end, when is it not legal to use a gun to protect yourself, the answers are straight forward and you can miss seven out of thirty. I just answered 24 tole it quick , I had to pee....
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  #50  
Old 01-02-2015, 9:48 PM
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Oh and you are not allowed to answer your phone during the test, lest you think of cheating.
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  #51  
Old 01-02-2015, 9:49 PM
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Doj needs the credit card to get their money right then.
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  #52  
Old 01-02-2015, 10:00 PM
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yes this is true I took my test at Bass Pro Shop and I lost my handgun safety certificateand I have to go back to Bass Pro Shop and get a copy of it but it doesn't have to be exactly the same person who gave you the test the first time that give you the card
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  #53  
Old 01-03-2015, 12:57 AM
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Hopefully I can answer some of the above questions since today was our first day of issuing the new Firearm Safety Cards.

1. What if I lose my card? How do I get a replacement?
The certified instructor that issued the card is the only one that can issue a replacement card. Why? Because the new system in place give each instructor their own individual sign on to the FCS system. I can't access another person's logs of test-takers even if they work at out store. So, only the certified instructor that gave you your card is able to do re-issues. Pretty lame if you ask me.

2.Why is a credit card necessary?
Because DOJ requires payment upon issue of each individual card, your credit card is required to pay for it. Unlike the DROS system, which bills FFLs at the end of each month for each DROS submitted, the FCS system bills at the issuance of each card. In the event you don't have a credit card, my store MAY be able to take care of the charge for you with our store credit card and collect your cash or check. Not every FFL will be able to do this and to tell the truth, I'd prefer that you pay the bill to DOJ (and our $10 fee) yourself. Again a little lame but it's the hand DOJ has dealt us.

Also, if you DROS'd a long gun in 2014 and haven't picked it up yet, you will have to show that you have the new FSC before the FFL can deliver your long gun to you. That means if you don't have one, you'll have to take the test and get one on the spot. What I've seen in just one day......the pay for it upfront by only credit card scheme that DOJ has implemented is cumbersome. We were initially told that FSC's were going to be available throughout he DROS system and billed to us along with DROS. What actually happened isn't what DOJ initially said and since they didn't reveal any of this upfront, most FFLs are scrambling to make the system work. One upside is that EVERY FFL should have access to FSC's if they did HSC previously. Before, the certified instructors had to purchase a 10-pack of HSC cards from DOJ in advance. It was always a balancing act to have enough cards on hand vs. needs. The new system is more of an ala carte system. You only buy a card when you actually need one and they are printed directly from an online website, so you shouldn't run into the case of any FFL being out of cards in the future.

Overall, DOJ has implemented a flawed system (shocker) that needs some tweaks to make it work much better.
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  #54  
Old 01-03-2015, 1:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FortCourageArmory View Post
Hopefully I can answer some of the above questions since today was our first day of issuing the new Firearm Safety Cards.

1. What if I lose my card? How do I get a replacement?
The certified instructor that issued the card is the only one that can issue a replacement card. Why? Because the new system in place give each instructor their own individual sign on to the FCS system. I can't access another person's logs of test-takers even if they work at out store. So, only the certified instructor that gave you your card is able to do re-issues. Pretty lame if you ask me.
Couldn't you save a copy of the certificate when you print it?
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  #55  
Old 01-03-2015, 2:21 AM
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ccw x-41 is valid for handguns/ concealed weapons approved by issuing agency. ccw exempt from fsc. I got it. Thanks system crashed no fsc for now at ffls.

Last edited by edgerly779; 01-03-2015 at 12:51 PM..
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  #56  
Old 01-03-2015, 3:00 AM
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... or you could just bring in your current/valid hunting license.
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  #57  
Old 01-03-2015, 3:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsrious View Post
... or you could just bring in your current/valid hunting license.
^^^ This for me. Some day I might get a safety card, but for the rifle action I have on order this will have to do.

Really, a test to exercise a fundamental constitutional right?
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  #58  
Old 01-03-2015, 4:16 AM
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^^^ For long guns yes. My hsc expired so I will use my hunting license until I dros a handgun then I will have to take test. my old card was from ffl long gone.
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  #59  
Old 01-03-2015, 4:36 AM
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Did I hear you don't need this card if you have a current CA. CCW?
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  #60  
Old 01-03-2015, 5:26 AM
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so I can still use my HSC for handguns.

I can use my hunting liscence for long guns instead of getting a FSC?
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  #61  
Old 01-03-2015, 5:40 AM
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your talking about the hand gun safety thing

I thought big 5 only sold long rifles at least all the ones here do
you only need driver license
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  #62  
Old 01-03-2015, 5:40 AM
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Are the exemption same like with HSC?
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  #63  
Old 01-03-2015, 6:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teg33 View Post
Are the exemption same like with HSC?
I THINK I read on here yesterday that a guy with a CCW still had to get
a FSC to pick up a long gun. Very lame. Pete
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Last edited by GM4spd; 01-03-2015 at 6:15 AM..
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  #64  
Old 01-03-2015, 6:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MCM View Post
Did I hear you don't need this card if you have a current CA. CCW?
Quote:
Originally Posted by GM4spd View Post
I THINK I read on here yesterday that a guy with a CCW still had to get
a FSC to pick up a long gun. Very lame. Pete
Turners rep posted an answer to my question here yesterday
my CCW makes me exempt
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  #65  
Old 01-03-2015, 6:42 AM
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Thanks 12v. Good to know. Finally a break, tiny but a break never the less.
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  #66  
Old 01-03-2015, 6:53 AM
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So now, in order to purchase a firearm, and if you need this FSC, you must have a credit card? So basically, you must have a credit card to exercise your rights?! Very cool...
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  #67  
Old 01-03-2015, 8:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edgerly779 View Post
ccw x-41 is valid for handguns/ concealed weapons approved by issuing agency. nothing to do with long guns. Should suffice for hsc card ???? long guns.
As Librarian pointed out, the written law clearly says otherwise - there is seemingly no ambiguity about it. The law says that a CCW holder is exempt from the FSC in every respect.

Quote:
a) The following persons, properly identified, are exempted from the firearm safety certificate requirement in subdivision (a) of Section 31615:
...
(9) Any individual who has a valid concealed weapons permit issued pursuant to Chapter 4 (commencing with Section 26150) of Division 5.
Meaning CCW is exempt from this:
Quote:
31615. (a) A person shall not do either of the following:
(1) Purchase or receive any firearm, except an antique firearm,
without a valid firearm safety certificate, except that in the case
of a handgun, an unexpired handgun safety certificate may be used.
(2) Sell, deliver, loan, or transfer any firearm, except an
antique firearm, to any person who does not have a valid firearm
safety certificate, except that in the case of a handgun, an
unexpired handgun safety certificate may be used.
(b) Any person who violates subdivision (a) is guilty of a
misdemeanor.
(c) The provisions of this section are cumulative, and shall not
be construed as restricting the application of any other law.
However, an act or omission punishable in different ways by different
provisions of this code shall not be punished under more than one
provision.
(d) This section shall become operative on January 1, 2015.

Last edited by SkyHawk; 01-03-2015 at 8:35 AM..
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  #68  
Old 01-03-2015, 8:42 AM
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I could see FFLs having a bunch of $15 pre-paid debit cards on hand. Collect $25 cash. Use debit card for HSC transaction. No dispute. No CC. No problem!
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  #69  
Old 01-03-2015, 8:45 AM
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Can I pay with EBT?
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  #70  
Old 01-03-2015, 8:54 AM
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Prepaid visa
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  #71  
Old 01-03-2015, 9:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cool Gun Wife View Post
Here is a link to the study guide - can be downloaded as a pdf. http://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/ag...rms/hscsg.pdf?

Sorry I could not make it pretty
..............This is it $25 and answer these 30 questions, Way to easy Drill Sergeant
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  #72  
Old 01-03-2015, 9:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FortCourageArmory View Post
Hopefully I can answer some of the above questions since today was our first day of issuing the new Firearm Safety Cards.

1. What if I lose my card? How do I get a replacement?
The certified instructor that issued the card is the only one that can issue a replacement card. Why? Because the new system in place give each instructor their own individual sign on to the FCS system. I can't access another person's logs of test-takers even if they work at out store. So, only the certified instructor that gave you your card is able to do re-issues. Pretty lame if you ask me.

2.Why is a credit card necessary?
Because DOJ requires payment upon issue of each individual card, your credit card is required to pay for it. Unlike the DROS system, which bills FFLs at the end of each month for each DROS submitted, the FCS system bills at the issuance of each card. In the event you don't have a credit card, my store MAY be able to take care of the charge for you with our store credit card and collect your cash or check. Not every FFL will be able to do this and to tell the truth, I'd prefer that you pay the bill to DOJ (and our $10 fee) yourself. Again a little lame but it's the hand DOJ has dealt us.

Also, if you DROS'd a long gun in 2014 and haven't picked it up yet, you will have to show that you have the new FSC before the FFL can deliver your long gun to you. That means if you don't have one, you'll have to take the test and get one on the spot. What I've seen in just one day......the pay for it upfront by only credit card scheme that DOJ has implemented is cumbersome. We were initially told that FSC's were going to be available throughout he DROS system and billed to us along with DROS. What actually happened isn't what DOJ initially said and since they didn't reveal any of this upfront, most FFLs are scrambling to make the system work. One upside is that EVERY FFL should have access to FSC's if they did HSC previously. Before, the certified instructors had to purchase a 10-pack of HSC cards from DOJ in advance. It was always a balancing act to have enough cards on hand vs. needs. The new system is more of an ala carte system. You only buy a card when you actually need one and they are printed directly from an online website, so you shouldn't run into the case of any FFL being out of cards in the future.

Overall, DOJ has implemented a flawed system (shocker) that needs some tweaks to make it work much better.
Are you able to access and use the listed exemptions? Military, valid hunting license and others working?
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  #73  
Old 01-03-2015, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TKM View Post
EBT?
An EBT card took the place of food stamps.
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  #74  
Old 01-03-2015, 10:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wrangler John View Post
Really, a test to exercise a fundamental constitutional right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by NIKSD View Post
So now, in order to purchase a firearm, and if you need this FSC, you must have a credit card? So basically, you must have a credit card to exercise your rights?! Very cool...
Quote:
Originally Posted by CG of MP View Post
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the privilege of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be allowed unless you take a government test, pay a government fee, obtain a government mandated license, and have credit good enough to be issued a private lending card from an independent large bank, the card must then be used to pay both the government and another private business money to secure an individuals privilege to own only listed arms that have been approved by the government.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRICKSTER View Post
So what is the difference between this and requiring some type of civics test for voter registration?
The FSC is required to purchase a firearm (in California), not to keep and bear arms. The Second Amendment guarantees the right to keep and bear arms. It says nothing about a right to purchase new firearms with no requirements whatsoever.

Anyone who already owns one or more firearms - is there anyone reading this who doesn't already own one or more firearms? - can exercise their right to keep and bear arms all they want without a FSC, just as they did before Jan. 1. Don't get me wrong, I don't support the FSC law, but to say you can't exercise your right to keep and bear arms without a FSC is incorrect.
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  #75  
Old 01-03-2015, 10:36 AM
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Honestly, with the amount of information the government knows about our firearms(CA DOJ especially), the last thing I would worry about is them knowing my credit or debit info.

Unless you're afraid of a data breach... But that applies anywhere you use your card.

If you're buying a FSC it's probably to buy a long arm... And since 1/1/14 they've been recording your serial number, favorite color, dck size, and everything in between. If you're buying a pistol or already own one, well, they've been doing it even longer for those.
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  #76  
Old 01-03-2015, 10:52 AM
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This system is a complete clustereff.

And yes, the login for the instructor is specific to that person (not a general FFL login).

So if the employee who gives you the FSC either quits or gets fired you are SOL on getting a replacement.
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  #77  
Old 01-03-2015, 10:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FortCourageArmory View Post
What I've seen in just one day......the pay for it upfront by only credit card scheme that DOJ has implemented is cumbersome. We were initially told that FSC's were going to be available throughout he DROS system and billed to us along with DROS.

What actually happened isn't what DOJ initially said and since they didn't reveal any of this upfront, most FFLs are scrambling to make the system work. One upside is that EVERY FFL should have access to FSC's if they did HSC previously. Before, the certified instructors had to purchase a 10-pack of HSC cards from DOJ in advance. It was always a balancing act to have enough cards on hand vs. needs. The new system is more of an ala carte system. You only buy a card when you actually need one and they are printed directly from an online website, so you shouldn't run into the case of any FFL being out of cards in the future.

Overall, DOJ has implemented a flawed system (shocker) that needs some tweaks to make it work much better.

And yet, ironically, the CA DMV is open today for "special Saturday hours" in accommodating illegal aliens so they can get California Drivers' Licenses. You can barely get the DMV to do anything extra, and they've cut their staff, hours, and customer service ability for us lesser folk, and it's disgusting special provisions are being made for people on my taxes and costs from MY licensing fees.

But have you noticed something? It's nearly impossible to ever reach someone at the CA DOJ, and when you do, they are misinformed. There is very little if any action to get issues resolved in a timely manner, and they have a clear animosity toward servicing CITIZENS of the Unites States pursuing their civil rights.

But for some reason, and without fail, and few to no mistakes without any delay, the CA Handgun Roster is always up to date, always managed without error.

There should have been no hiccups with this new FSC bullcrap, as they've know it was going into force for several months. With that in mind, it should have merely been an endorsement to your existing HSC card for a lesser cost, like an M1 motorcycle endorsement is to your existing license. I guarantee if you already have your HSC card, you are surely already quite safe with long-guns as well - most any of the safety attributes and rules still apply, and there is nothing that could be said about long-guns wherein there is a different safety need than those applied to handguns, unless some 1 or 2 questions address no magazine disconnect, and no loaded-chamber indicators as they apply to handguns, but then again - if you are relying on that in the first place, you are dead wrong; and as I recall, the HSC test never addresses these matters either in its bag of question.

Furthermore, if you have an HSC already, you've likely bought at least a few long-guns in the time that you've had your HSC card. This whole thing is merely a stunt to gain revenue and spurn, harass, and antagonize CA citizens that are expressing their 2nd Amendment Rights.

Intentional games of grand master fuster-cluck with an asinine motive to intimidate and belittle, raining down from CA Legislature, and the CA DOJ.

Eventually, a really pissed off group of frogs are going to jump out of that pot, and get hopping.
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Originally Posted by Librarian View Post
What compelling interest has any level of government in knowing what guns are owned by civilians? (Those owned by government should be inventoried and tracked, for exactly the same reasons computers and desks and chairs are tracked: responsible care of public property.)

If some level of government had that information, what would they do with it? How would having that info benefit public safety? How would it benefit law enforcement?
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  #78  
Old 01-03-2015, 11:16 AM
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ke6guj ke6guj is offline
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I could see FFLs having a bunch of $15 pre-paid debit cards on hand. Collect $25 cash. Use debit card for HSC transaction. No dispute. No CC. No problem!
that would be a good idea except for the service charge that goes along buying the pre-paid card.
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Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA?

No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.
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  #79  
Old 01-03-2015, 12:00 PM
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Ok so you have to go to same place/ clerk for replacement cert. If that is not possible for whatever reason, could you (out of frustration) just retake test(s) and pay fee(s) ?
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  #80  
Old 01-03-2015, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by NIKSD View Post
So now, in order to purchase a firearm, and if you need this FSC, you must have a credit card? So basically, you must have a credit card to exercise your rights?! Very cool...
feel free to build your own firearms too
you dont need any papers, or license or government checks

as long as your legal to own one and its not an illegally built weapon in CA

so you have options
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