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  #41  
Old 03-08-2016, 8:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladin View Post
What you may not realize is how close CLEOs stay to one another. CoPs may want to stay on better terms with their sheriff than their own residents because they may wish to get the sheriffs endorsement for running for sheriff when s/he resigns (or a letter of recommendation for some other sheriff's or CoP position) vs. residents to whom the CoP does not answer: CoPs answer to the city council and/or mayor.

IIRC, in San Mateo County, every month the CoPs of the county all get together and have a meeting, to coordinate, stay "on the same page". Every month each of those CoPs has a meeting with the county's sheriff. CLEOs are "joined at the hip." They suffer from serious "peer pressure" and "group think." Plus, there are state and national chiefs of police and sheriffs associations where they all network and want to "go along to get along". CLEOs care about advancing their careers (paying mortgages, kids' college, vacations, etc.), and not about whether the "serfs" get to carry to defend their own and families' lives.
Absolutely. The last COP of Lompoc was a PO in Santa Maria, CA when Santa Barbara Co. Sheriff Brown was the chief there and would not void his bladder without Brown's permission.

When the Lompoc City council were doing there search for a new Chief they chose a candidate from out of the area, in part to break that bond.
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Last edited by Fjold; 03-08-2016 at 1:50 PM..
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  #42  
Old 03-08-2016, 2:57 PM
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It's not the Sheriff's choice to give up the power to issue LTCs to city residents. That power belongs to the city Chief of Police. He can opt to issue any time that he wishes and the sheriff has no say in the decision. Ask Santa Barbara County Sheriff Brown, he *****ed and moaned about the City of Lompoc issuing their residents LTCs but he could do nothing to stop it.

I would be glad to help with information/experience for anyone who wants to work with city governments to try to get local LTC procedures in place.

I worked for 5+ years with the politicians in the City of Lompoc to get their LTC policy in place and it is the first city in Santa Barbara County to go to self issue.
I should have mentioned other than the 3 most "conservative" cities I listed (Coronado, Escondido and Carlsbad), this will probably take a few years. You might have to replace city council members at elections and then wait for the current chief to resign or be fired. But with relief from the federal courts nowhere in sight, why wait any longer to begin??? As more and more cities issue, it is harder and harder for the holdouts and sheriff to justify not issuing CCWs themselves. IIRC, this is what happened in Fresno Co. after Sheriff Mims took over and readily issued CCWs. After a few years, Fresno PD changed their policy and started liberally issuing CCWs.

Last edited by Paladin; 03-10-2016 at 8:35 PM..
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  #43  
Old 03-08-2016, 4:09 PM
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Paladin, thank you for the effort. I'm surprised and disappointed by the lack of positive response.
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  #44  
Old 03-08-2016, 4:33 PM
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it looks like its squeaky wheel time. Maybe a freedom of information request for the Memorandum of Understanding for each of the cities. Then go from there and work your way up the ladder until possible facetime with some elected officials, or Chief of Police. Then get phone #s and call the crapout of their offices.
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  #45  
Old 03-09-2016, 10:27 AM
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I live in Carlsbad. I have asked my chief of police for a CCW permit, he told me it must go through the SDSD. So there you have it.

You can't believe how much work we have done here for gun rights. It's taken us almost two years to get a permit for Gunther Guns to open a firing range here. That may happen next summer, IF we are lucky. This is a conservative town but we still have idiots on our city council.

Yes, change takes time here. We are not sitting on our butts but we also realize the obsticles we face here. I'm getting old so this may be passed on to the next generation to finish.
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  #46  
Old 03-09-2016, 12:05 PM
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Jami Jah, there will ALWAYS be idiots on city councils. San Diego city is full of them.

The one thing in life I have never figured out is why we put the dumb ones in charge of everything.
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  #47  
Old 03-09-2016, 1:12 PM
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^^^^ Because dumb ones vote for them. They seem to speak and comprehend a different language.
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  #48  
Old 03-09-2016, 5:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimi Jah View Post
I live in Carlsbad. I have asked my chief of police for a CCW permit, he told me it must go through the SDSD. So there you have it.
If you read the first page of this thread, you would know that is not "it." You only must go thru the sheriff because your chief WANTS you to. Your chief does not WANT to deal with the issue of CCWs. That's what this whole thread is about: getting chiefs (those ID'ed in the OP), to rescind their MOUs with the sheriff and to start issuing CCWs for "self-defense" as GC. Gunnies in Coronado, Escondido, and Carlsbad (picking the "easiest" targets first), need to make the chief change his mind. How? As already stated, by pressuring him directly and if that does not work, by pressuring your city council members, your mayor, your city manager (if you have on), and, probably, city attorney.

Since you guys live right in your own cities, this will be a lot easier than something requiring you to show up at county supervisors meeting, much less legislative hearings in Sac.

Do not be surprised if this takes a couple of city council election cycles (to replace antis with pros and to convince others to merely change their positions).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimi Jah View Post
Yes, change takes time here. We are not sitting on our butts but we also realize the obsticles we face here. I'm getting old so this may be passed on to the next generation to finish.
I remember when we won Heller in 2008 and McDonald in 2010, we were expecting to win Shall Issue by 2012, then 2013 with 2014 latest. Now, here we are in 2016, Scalia is dead and we're probably about to lose Peruta en banc, so who knows when we have a new pro-RKBA majority on SCOTUS and when we'll have a winnable case seeking cert after that....

I, too, would like to carry before I'm ...

That's why I started these LA and SD Co. threads: to crack the anti CCW county strongholds in CA. Unfortunately for me, there are ZERO cities in SF, San Mateo, Alameda or Contra Costa counties with anything but minor Repub majorities. At least you guys have got a chance to improve your situation....

Last edited by Paladin; 03-10-2016 at 8:38 PM..
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  #49  
Old 03-10-2016, 9:11 AM
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The problem remains, our local PD's will not issue. I can argue with my Chief until I'm blue in the face and I will get the same response.

The SDSD can issue, but they won't. They have the final say here, whether it's right or wrong, legal or illegal.

Only a large public incident like a terrorist attack can change those views here. Even so, that incident in SB last year didn't change much there either.

Getting quiters to stay and fight and attempting to lower the foreign immigration rates could help, but it seems to be fashionable to say you are quitting here and immigrants do not bring the concept of gun rights with them.
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  #50  
Old 03-10-2016, 11:03 AM
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immigrants do not bring the concept of gun rights with them

That's why they are letting them in.
Even illegals will be able to vote. What the h&^l happened to OUR COUNTRY?
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  #51  
Old 03-20-2016, 1:56 PM
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Back in early July 2015 I made 5 posts in the OT "707 Banter" thread to try to motivate, guide and help Sonoma gunnies to organize to push your sheriff to accept SD as GC. You should review those suggestions. Use "Advanced Search"; enter "Banter" and "Search Titles Only" in "search by keyword", use "Paladin" as "search by username", and select "Posts" on the lower left in "Show results as". I did 5 posts over July 11th and 13th, with this being the first post:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...r#post16593010
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  #52  
Old 03-23-2016, 8:13 PM
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The four most likely cities to instructions their chief of police to issue are La Mesa, El Cajon, Escondido, and Oceanside. SDCGO is discussing the option with members of each council.
Under state law (Penal code) a police chief has the same authority to issue a CCW as the sheriff. A police chief works for the council so he won't do it unless told to by the council he works for.
We believe we have the votes. Now it's just a matter of working it through the process and we are in an election year.
I'm hoping to have one or all 4 vote on it by the end of the year.

-Michael
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  #53  
Old 04-17-2016, 6:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SD County Gun Owners PAC View Post
The four most likely cities to instructions their chief of police to issue are La Mesa, El Cajon, Escondido, and Oceanside. SDCGO is discussing the option with members of each council.
Under state law (Penal code) a police chief has the same authority to issue a CCW as the sheriff. A police chief works for the council so he won't do it unless told to by the council he works for.
We believe we have the votes. Now it's just a matter of working it through the process and we are in an election year.
I'm hoping to have one or all 4 vote on it by the end of the year.

-Michael
Sorry to bring up an older post, but I just stumbled into this one. I'm a La Mesa resident. How can I get involved?
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  #54  
Old 04-18-2016, 8:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SD County Gun Owners PAC View Post
The four most likely cities to instructions their chief of police to issue are La Mesa, El Cajon, Escondido, and Oceanside. SDCGO is discussing the option with members of each council.
Under state law (Penal code) a police chief has the same authority to issue a CCW as the sheriff. A police chief works for the council so he won't do it unless told to by the council he works for.
We believe we have the votes. Now it's just a matter of working it through the process and we are in an election year.
I'm hoping to have one or all 4 vote on it by the end of the year.

-Michael
Still sucks for us unincorporated county residents though.....we're stuck squarely under Gore's bloody thumb despite having decent support by the County BoS
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  #55  
Old 04-20-2016, 10:50 PM
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Anybody else in Coronado? I know the mayor, most of city council, and did a charity fashion show with chief Jon Froomin. I can ask around about feelings on the matter.

I don't check forums much, but will try to check here.

Anyone interested in working on this, shoot me an email. Sensei@coronadokarate.com
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  #56  
Old 04-25-2016, 6:17 AM
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To get involved in this effort, email me at SDCGOSCHWARTZ@GMAIL.COM

-Michael
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  #57  
Old 04-30-2016, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by nadodave View Post
Anybody else in Coronado? I know the mayor, most of city council, and did a charity fashion show with chief Jon Froomin. I can ask around about feelings on the matter.

I don't check forums much, but will try to check here.

Anyone interested in working on this, shoot me an email. Sensei@coronadokarate.com
Me too. Richard Bailey has received the endorsement from SDCGO - maybe we can leverage that... Of course, we are always working against the "that doesn't happen here" mentality.
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  #58  
Old 05-02-2016, 7:02 PM
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Richard Bailey is a pro liberty, pro 2a candidate, he is a great choice for Mayor of Coronado and we hope that anyone who lives there votes for him!
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  #59  
Old 06-09-2016, 6:06 PM
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The loss of the Peruta en banc decision means that CA CCW law won't be improving for awhile, so that makes these city PD reform efforts in anti counties all that much more vital.
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  #60  
Old 06-10-2016, 9:12 AM
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Peruta now has given Bill Gore all the ammo he needs to prevent CCW's from being issued here.

Glad I saved my money and didn't apply. It would have been better spent donating to his re-election campaign.
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  #61  
Old 06-10-2016, 8:47 PM
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El Cajon, La Mesa, Escondido, and Oceanside all still look very good to direct their police chief to issue.
It is very important that Mike Diaz and Jason Paguio get elected in Chula Vista too. That means supporting them by donating money to them and donating your time.
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  #62  
Old 06-12-2016, 8:08 AM
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Peruta now has given Bill Gore all the ammo he needs to prevent CCW's from being issued here.

Glad I saved my money and didn't apply. It would have been better spent donating to his re-election campaign.
Or get someone good (both qualified, experienced enough, and competent for being sheriff), to run against him/replace him in 2018 and getting enough voters to actually vote for "change" CGNers can believe in.

If you guys wait for Gore to announce, he'll probably game the system to get who he wants to replace him (probably an anti). (Read online re. how sleazy, anti CCW Alameda Co sheriff (yes, lower case "s") Plummer did that to get Ahern in. Plummer said he'd run again, so no one organized and got local/state politico endorsements lined up to run. Then just a couple of weeks before the deadline, he announced he would not run and announced his endorsement of Ahern, who then filed. On the last day to file, Plummer, Ahern and their toadies all went down to where they file and had a party when no one else filed by the deadline. Thus, only 1 candidate => automatic win. )

Quote:
Originally Posted by SD County Gun Owners PAC View Post
El Cajon, La Mesa, Escondido, and Oceanside all still look very good to direct their police chief to issue.
It is very important that Mike Diaz and Jason Paguio get elected in Chula Vista too. That means supporting them by donating money to them and donating your time.
Glad to hear. Your work (and that of LA Co city reformers) is one of the few bright spots of possible new CCW growth in the state.

Yes, politics is a numbers game: money + manpower + voters = success!

I hope your org plans to support a pro-CCW candidate to replace/run against Gore. Don't get suckered by Gore the way Alameda County residents got suckered by that scum Plummer.

Last edited by Paladin; 06-12-2016 at 8:21 AM..
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  #63  
Old 06-12-2016, 12:23 PM
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You don't know how the Sheriff is selected here in San Diego. First, they last for years. Once they decide to retire, a hand-picked replacement is subbed in, usually before the election. Then the local media buys into the "he will keep us safe crappola" and you get Gore ver. 2.0.

Rinse and repeat.
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  #64  
Old 06-14-2016, 12:28 PM
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Anyone know how unincorporated areas within one of the cities mentioned works? I am looking at the granite hills area of El Cajon and it looks like it's in an unincorporated part of El Cajon (with an El Cajon address)...does this matter and would they check the specific address to see if it was incorporated or not?
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  #65  
Old 06-20-2016, 3:32 PM
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Anyone know how unincorporated areas within one of the cities mentioned works? I am looking at the granite hills area of El Cajon and it looks like it's in an unincorporated part of El Cajon (with an El Cajon address)...does this matter and would they check the specific address to see if it was incorporated or not?
Oh I'm sure they would. I also live in an unincorporated City, served by the County Sheriff. I'm screwed.
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  #66  
Old 06-24-2016, 7:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Jimi Jah View Post
You don't know how the Sheriff is selected here in San Diego. First, they last for years. Once they decide to retire, a hand-picked replacement is subbed in, usually before the election. Then the local media buys into the "he will keep us safe crappola" and you get Gore ver. 2.0.

Rinse and repeat.


Didn't you read my post?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladin View Post
If you guys wait for Gore to announce, he'll probably game the system to get who he wants to replace him (probably an anti). (Read online re. how sleazy, anti CCW Alameda Co sheriff (yes, lower case "s") Plummer did that to get Ahern in. Plummer said he'd run again, so no one organized and got local/state politico endorsements lined up to run. Then just a couple of weeks before the deadline, he announced he would not run and announced his endorsement of Ahern, who then filed. On the last day to file, Plummer, Ahern and their toadies all went down to where they file and had a party when no one else filed by the deadline. Thus, only 1 candidate => automatic win. )
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  #67  
Old 07-01-2016, 12:09 PM
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I think Escondido is doable. The Council is fairly conservative, and Chief Carter is supposed to be a good, levelheaded guy.

I think the first step in any attempt like this is to put together a Powerpoint / bullet point type of presentation that quickly hits on the pertinent facts... history of shall-issue reform and an analysis of crime, specifically including those committed by permit holders. Then, we have to think up the objections that would be raised, like liability, and have answers ready. It has to be a two-pronged approach, as it won't do to convince the Chief but not the Council or vice-versa. Both have to be on board. Having examples like Lompoc to point to will help... "They did it, her's how, and nothing bad has happened there."

It's also possible that the "understanding" that issuance is ceded to the Sheriff is politically untouchable. I very much doubt that Mr. Gore will be happy to see any PD in the County issuing permits, and will certainly pick up a phone to the Chief in question, then any and all politicos who could lean on him or her. SDSO might have and be willing to swing a big hammer in the form of interdepartmental cooperation, funding, etc.

Most important, like the La Mesa example given, this needs to be handled very carefully. People screaming about "their rights" or how awful Gore is or the terrorists are coming will poison any attempt to change things.
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Old 07-02-2016, 3:47 PM
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AB 466 is a direct attack on these efforts to liberalize CCW issuance.
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s....php?t=1212119
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  #69  
Old 09-23-2016, 4:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SD County Gun Owners PAC View Post
El Cajon, La Mesa, Escondido, and Oceanside all still look very good to direct their police chief to issue.
It is very important that Mike Diaz and Jason Paguio get elected in Chula Vista too. That means supporting them by donating money to them and donating your time.
Any news on getting SD Co cities' CoPs to issue city CCWs???

In case any of you missed it or want motivation, looks like CGNers are at a critical juncture in pushing West Covina's chief of police to either start issuing CCWs and accept SD = GC, or to find an new job!

Link embedded in quote below from the CA Political Activism forum:

Quote:
Originally Posted by gobler View Post
Tonight our city council voted to change the city law so now "self defense" will be good cause. This will force our police chief to issue CCWs or be replaced. This is a huge victory for us. Although West Covina will be the only city in L.A. county to issue, it will put pressure on neighbouring cities who are also being pressured by their citizens. Now I'm not popping the bubbly yet until the first one is issued but Damn, this is great news.
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Old 09-25-2016, 8:33 PM
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The four cities interested in doing it will start talks about it after the election. All want to do it at once.
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Old 09-25-2016, 11:20 PM
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The four cities interested in doing it will start talks about it after the election. All want to do it at once.
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  #72  
Old 09-26-2016, 6:22 AM
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Guess I need to move a few blocks south into Carlsbad or a few miles east to Esco.

Great work SDCGO!!!
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Old 09-26-2016, 3:11 PM
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Sorry to bring up an older post, but I just stumbled into this one. I'm a La Mesa resident. How can I get involved?
Come to a meeting and we will get you involved, also check out our voting guide and vote 2A
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  #74  
Old 11-17-2016, 8:51 AM
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The four cities interested in doing it will start talks about it after the election. All want to do it at once.
Plz keep us updated, as long as it does not compromise operations....
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Old 11-17-2016, 9:29 AM
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Are there any other cities in CA offering CCW permits in place of the country Sheriffs? Seems those places are already issuing through their sheriff departments.
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Old 11-17-2016, 10:28 PM
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Are there any other cities in CA offering CCW permits in place of the country Sheriffs? Seems those places are already issuing through their sheriff departments.
Lompoc in Santa Barbara county (Thanks Fjold!) and Torrance in LACo.

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  #77  
Old 11-18-2016, 5:47 AM
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ez2b ez2b is offline
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I haven't read this whole thread yet but I am glad I was pointed this direction. I started a thread called moving to San Diego. which is in my near future. and I have a little bit more hope after reading a few pages of this thread.
Since it looks like I am going to be moving to Escondido and reading your guyses post. Escondido is more on the conservative side then I would say most. so I feel a little better about that just a little. So you can guarantee I will be in the fight with all of you and support you 100% .it is going to be weird to have to give up my CCW, hopefully only a little while. I lived in Escondido some 25 years ago for a short time and I will tell you it's the only place I've had a gun pulled on me.

EZ
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  #78  
Old 01-29-2017, 11:34 AM
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Paladin Paladin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SD County Gun Owners PAC View Post
The four most likely cities to instructions their chief of police to issue are La Mesa, El Cajon, Escondido, and Oceanside. SDCGO is discussing the option with members of each council.
Under state law (Penal code) a police chief has the same authority to issue a CCW as the sheriff. A police chief works for the council so he won't do it unless told to by the council he works for.
We believe we have the votes. Now it's just a matter of working it through the process and we are in an election year.
I'm hoping to have one or all 4 vote on it by the end of the year.


-Michael
Quote:
Originally Posted by SD County Gun Owners PAC View Post
El Cajon, La Mesa, Escondido, and Oceanside all still look very good to direct their police chief to issue.
It is very important that Mike Diaz and Jason Paguio get elected in Chula Vista too. That means supporting them by donating money to them and donating your time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SD County Gun Owners PAC View Post
The four cities interested in doing it will start talks about it after the election. All want to do it at once.

Any news/update?

Last edited by Paladin; 01-29-2017 at 5:56 PM..
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  #79  
Old 01-30-2017, 9:19 AM
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Jimi Jah Jimi Jah is offline
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I saw Gore on TV this morning. No discussions of CCW's but plenty about illegal aliens, a term Gore still will not use.

We got the same old tired and debunked crappola about making illegal aliens feel safe so they will report crimes and even appear in court! Nothing has changed with that RINO Gore and the rest of the sanctuary city supporters.

They still don't understand illegal aliens don't trust he police in their own countries, less so here. They don't understand that illegal aliens will not report gang crimes in fear of retaliation. They will not testify in court over immigration fears even though a law in in place to protect them for that.
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  #80  
Old 02-11-2017, 4:59 PM
CbadMom CbadMom is offline
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I know this thread is old but was very helpful!!! I'm in Carlsbad and want to apply for a concealed carry. I had a 5 year restraining order that just lapsed against a violent man and am also a domestic violence advocate, so some unhappy abusers. I want the right to defend myself 🇺🇸
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