DOJ going after Single Shot exemptions and Rebuild Kits?

[Bobby Hated]

just got back from PPT my railgun to a fellow calgunner, and the guys at the gun store we did PPT at were saying how the DOJ inspector just spent 3 days there, when they usually spend one day.

they said the DOJ was making a special effort to go after Single Shot exemptions and Rebuild Kits. DOJ wanted all paperwork on single shot exemptions so they could follow up with gun owneres to make sure they had not been converted back.

and they were also going after dealers for selling rebuild kits. DOJ apparently has decided by fiat that these are mags if all the parts for a mag are sold together.

anyone know anything about this or can comment from an INFORMED perspective?

thanks

[Bobula]

Nothing in law against either. Attempted underground regulation.

[tenpercentfirearms]

Originally Posted by Bobby Hated

just got back from PPT my railgun to a fellow calgunner, and the guys at the gun store we did PPT at were saying how the DOJ inspector just spent 3 days there, when they usually spend one day.

they said the DOJ was making a special effort to go after Single Shot exemptions and Rebuild Kits. DOJ wanted all paperwork on single shot exemptions so they could follow up with gun owneres to make sure they had not been converted back.

and they were also going after dealers for selling rebuild kits. DOJ apparently has decided by fiat that these are mags if all the parts for a mag are sold together.

anyone know anything about this or can comment from an INFORMED perspective?

thanks

Who is the dealer so we can contact them.

There is nothing the DOJ can do to you once you take possession of your handgun as long as you do not create an assault weapon.

Furhter, there is plenty of documentation that rebuild kits are legal, so the DOJ would probably want to sent a reverssed opinion of their already written explination that rebuild kits are legal.

At this time someone is spreading FUD. It is either the dealer or the DOJ and it needs to be addressed. Please let us know who it is so we can contact them.

[AJAX22]

haha

yeah.... love to get more info on who that dealer was

Sounds like a bit of fud

[halifax]

If the DOJ "has decided by fiat that these are mags if all the parts for a mag are sold together", then the dealer broke the law and needs to be cited or arrested. Did that happen?

[alfred1222]

Originally Posted by halifax

If the DOJ "has decided by fiat that these are mags if all the parts for a mag are sold together", then the dealer broke the law and needs to be cited or arrested. Did that happen?

Why would the dealer be cited or arrested?! if someone puts all of the parts of a 30rnd mag into a bag, and slaps a price tag on it saying that the parts are meant to rebuild pre-ban mags, he is legally selling parts.

[rromeo]

Reread the post you quoted.

[halifax]

Originally Posted by alfred1222

Why would the dealer be cited or arrested?! if someone puts all of the parts of a 30rnd mag into a bag, and slaps a price tag on it saying that the parts are meant to rebuild pre-ban mags, he is legally selling parts.

Originally Posted by halifax

If the DOJ "has decided by fiat that these are mags if all the parts for a mag are sold together", then the dealer broke the law and needs to be cited or arrested. Did that happen?

Well, if the DOJ decided they were magazines like the OP posted, then it follows that the dealer sold large capacity magazines to non-exempt people, doesn't it?

[kemasa]

Originally Posted by halifax

Well, if the DOJ decided they were magazines like the OP posted, then it follows that the dealer sold large capacity magazines to non-exempt people, doesn't it?

Only if that is actually illegal (read the actual law).

[EBR Works]

Originally Posted by halifax

Well, if the DOJ decided they were magazines like the OP posted, then it follows that the dealer sold large capacity magazines to non-exempt people, doesn't it?

So, you are saying that selling a bag of parts that would constitute a complete mag is not legal? Please elaborate how you came to this conclusion.

[halifax]

I am saying that if the DOJ is claiming that a bag of parts is indeed a complete magazine then they should have arrested the dealer or at least cited him. No?

They didn't which somewhat proves they are FOS.

[freonr22]

Tag

[EBR Works]

Originally Posted by halifax

I am saying that if the DOJ is claiming that a bag of parts is indeed a complete magazine then they should have arrested the dealer or at least cited him. No?

They didn't which somewhat proves they are FOS.

Got it. Sorry, I misunderstood.

[halifax]

...

[winnre]

Funny how a bag of magazine parts are just parts but a bag of machine gun parts is a machine gun. Pick a lane!

[seainc]

OP you can PM name of the dealer to "tenpercentfirearms" if you don't want to share it with public. Thanks

[Ubermcoupe]

Originally Posted by winnre

Funny how a bag of magazine parts are just parts but a bag of machine gun parts is a machine gun. Pick a lane!

Well, Constructive possession is a federal thing, but I get what you’re saying.

[Moving Chicane]

Waiting to see/hear which dealer this was; especially since it is in my area!

[winnre]

Hey, they started it with the stupid roster. I say if the gun fails sue the manufacturer. Technically now you can also sue the state since they signed off on it being safe enough to sell in CA.

[Oceanbob]

Total FUD...bet that employee worked at McDonalds last year.

[gant]

total bs, once the gun is yours, you can do whatever you want with it as long as you dont make it a assault weapon

[Bobby Hated]

wow i sure stirred up the hornets nest. this is NOT my opinion. i am just repeating what the store told me. two employees participated in the conversation and relayed this information to me. yes i realize gun store employees are common spreaders of FUD, which is why i was incredulous when they told me this. i diligently questioned them about what they were telling me, like a good calgunner. and came on here asap to post it for discussion, like a good calgunner.

so dont kill the messenger please.

as for posting the name of the shop, is that ethical for me to do? my reservation is by posting the shop name, DOJ can go back there and give them a hard time or who knows what.

i'm going to PM the shop name to tenpercentfirearms since i know he's involved in CGF.

[Bobby Hated]

tenpercentfirearms! you do not have a send private message option on your handle. how do i send you a PM? please PM me so i can reply with the shop name.

[seainc]

you can go to his website www.tenpercentfirearms.com and contact him from there. Thanks

Originally Posted by Bobby Hated

tenpercentfirearms! you do not have a send private message option on your handle. how do i send you a PM? please PM me so i can reply with the shop name.

[Mssr. Eleganté]

One year ago...
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=384265

Eight months ago...
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=445943

Five months ago...
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=480403

[tenpercentfirearms]

Originally Posted by Bobby Hated

tenpercentfirearms! you do not have a send private message option on your handle. how do i send you a PM? please PM me so i can reply with the shop name.

e-mail me. sales@taftguns.com

Why would the DOJ go back and give them a hard time? If anything if the DOJ have been giving them a hard time, they will stop once we empower them with knowledge. Do you think the DOJ comes to my shop and gives me a hard time about anything? They do not. They come and we do our business and everyone is polite and moves on. They know I am not going to buy any of this nonsense, so they don't even try.

[PolishMike]

Let me guess - dealer doesn't do single shot transfers?

I would be willing to bet it is the dealer making this up to scare customers from buying guns at competition. I have heard the same from my customers who have been to a local store.

[jeferd]

There's a brand new gun shop in my area..Folsom, near Sacramento..STS Guns...they are saying the same thing, that DOJ is going after SSE so they would never consider doing it. He was adamant that they are going after SSE, although I pointed out it is perfectly legal. The guy said it is the intent to circumvent the law that they are going after...I told him that the can not do anything if you DID NOT BREAK the law. anyway, same thing being spread up here as well. Maybe they are checking to make sure all documentation is correct, so it's spread that they are cracking down, etc...typical on how FUD is spread.

[SOCAL INFIDEL]

If dealer is selling a California Compliant Product, it's none of his/her business or responsibility with what the purchaser is doing with their OWN property after it legally leaves their shop. And to chime in with what others have said, as long as you don't make it an AW or other "illegal" things, you can do whatever you want to it.

[PolishMike]

I don't get why dealers who don't do sse transfers can't just say that they don't want to do them.

Why start spreading complete crap and trying to scare a customer into buying a gun from you?

[CSACANNONEER]

Originally Posted by halifax

I am saying that if the DOJ is claiming that a bag of parts is indeed a complete magazine then they should have arrested the dealer or at least cited him. No?

They didn't which somewhat proves they are FOS.

Selling complete magazines is only a crime if you do not have a high cap permit. AFAIK, anyone can legally buy from a dealer with a high cap permit but, DOJ will revoke their permit if they do.

[greasemonkey]

Originally Posted by PolishMike

I don't get why dealers who don't do sse transfers can't just say that they don't want to do them.

Why start spreading complete crap and trying to scare a customer into buying a gun from you?

Because they *think* it makes them look better when they can say "those guys are gonna get arrested and you'll lose your guns and go to prison, if you don't want to be a criminal, buy from me." I know it doesn't make sense but that's what I've run into at a lot of the FFL's around here. Except all the shops around here are getting worried because they're losing so much business to PRK...who have been saying the above about them since PRK opened; and yet no charges, arrests or confiscations to date.

A fun story to tell people that talk about PRK's evil "gray area" is the last time they had a major audit, they had their "BOFfers are harassing us" sale and one guy from the team of once agitated agents out for legal blood ended up DROSing a personal firearm from them at the end of the audit.

I've been told RECENTLY by a couple local FFL's the same thing about field agents telling them they'd better not start doing SSE's because "they WANT to go after the FFL's who are doing them." But then there's the issue of want in one hand, crap in the other and see which one has substance.

[curvejunkie]

Originally Posted by PolishMike

I don't get why dealers who don't do sse transfers can't just say that they don't want to do them.

Why start spreading complete crap and trying to scare a customer into buying a gun from you?

This ^.

Absolutely nothing is gained from talking chit about your competition.

[beetle]

I think its a case of the stores that don't do SSE making up stories about those that do. appears to be happening all over. I ran into a very similar situation in the SF Bay Area. Went to a store that I usually don't go to because it was closer to the buyer (was doing a PPT). During the course of the PPT buyer asked me how I got the gun, etc because he had been looking for one for awhile. I explained that I bought it via SSE at which point the store employee immediately branded me as a criminal, the gun as illegal, and that the buyer would go to jail. Needless to say the buyer got freaked out and cancelled the sale wasting my time and his.

[keenkeen]

Originally Posted by jeferd

There's a brand new gun shop in my area..Folsom, near Sacramento..STS Guns...they are saying the same thing, that DOJ is going after SSE so they would never consider doing it. He was adamant that they are going after SSE, although I pointed out it is perfectly legal. The guy said it is the intent to circumvent the law that they are going after...I told him that the can not do anything if you DID NOT BREAK the law. anyway, same thing being spread up here as well. Maybe they are checking to make sure all documentation is correct, so it's spread that they are cracking down, etc...typical on how FUD is spread.

One of the newer shops in CenCal is saying the same thing when asked about doing SSE. Basicly this:

"The local DOJ rep told me that doing SSEs is 'risky' and that they are getting ready to 'go after' the main shop in the area that does them"

Beacuse of this, he is not doing SSE pistols.

Seems to be a standard tactic with the DOJ and new FFLs...

[keenkeen]

Originally Posted by beetle

I think its a case of the stores that don't do SSE making up stories about those that do. appears to be happening all over. I ran into a very similar situation in the SF Bay Area. Went to a store that I usually don't go to because it was closer to the buyer (was doing a PPT). During the course of the PPT buyer asked me how I got the gun, etc because he had been looking for one for awhile. I explained that I bought it via SSE at which point the store employee immediately branded me as a criminal, the gun as illegal, and that the buyer would go to jail. Needless to say the buyer got freaked out and cancelled the sale wasting my time and his.

Oh man, that is the pits. I would have been ticked off at the FFL for sure. (ps you should name the store so we can avoid them)

I guess the next time an FFL asks me how I got an off roster pistol I should have a "cover story" ready...

[halifax]

Although I've never met her, I understand there is a BOF agent that likes to spread FUD and intimidation during inspections. She is probably more anti-gun than over zealous.

Just sayin

[kemasa]

Originally Posted by CSACANNONEER

Selling complete magazines is only a crime if you do not have a high cap permit. AFAIK, anyone can legally buy from a dealer with a high cap permit but, DOJ will revoke their permit if they do.

Incorrect, take a look at the actual law. It used to be 12020, but has since changed numbers and format, but the main points are the same.

[Blackhawk556]

Originally Posted by keenkeen

One of the newer shops in CenCal is saying the same thing when asked about doing SSE. Basicly this:

"The local DOJ rep told me that doing SSEs is 'risky' and that they are getting ready to 'go after' the main shop in the area that does them"

Beacuse of this, he is not doing SSE pistols.

Seems to be a standard tactic with the DOJ and new FFLs...

this is the same thing that is happening with " we the people firearms"in Clovis. they have a FFL 07 license but don't want to get into SSE stuff because their rep told them the same thing. this store sells ARs and AKs, I don't get why they are worried. I bet when OLL were new to this state, reps would tell gun store owners the same crap. now look at how many stores sell lowers.

Sent from Los Alamos Nuclear Facility

[kemasa]

If you call the CA DOJ and ask about it, they say all sorts of things, but they also tend to backdown when you tell them that it is legal. It appears that they are just trying to scare people.

I called about a pistol which was designed after a firearm before 1899 and the claim of a customer who said that other FFLs were doing the transfer due to this "exemption" (which does not actually exist, but I wanted to confirm that, not that the DOJ would admit it).