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Concealed Carry Discussion General discussion regarding CCW/LTC in California

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  #41  
Old 04-30-2015, 5:47 AM
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Originally Posted by venom12784 View Post
Why not disclose ?all you would have to say is I have a conceal permit and i am not carrying a weapon on me. If they can find out through dispatch you have a permit that could end up being one very pissed off officer.
Did you think this through? The ONLY reason for a cop to care is you might be armed. The ONLY reason IAs mandate disclosure is so the cop knows you're amred.

WHY would anyone care if you're NOT armed?

Ridiculous.
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  #42  
Old 04-30-2015, 7:28 AM
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Why would the LEO be mad about you not disclosing your CCW when you're not carrying? If you're not carrying there's no concern for the LEO. One less thing the LEO has to worry about. Unless your IA requires you to disclose it during ANY LEO encounter there's no reason to do so.
Do you know all the rules for all 58 ia that you can carry in?
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  #43  
Old 04-30-2015, 7:33 AM
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Originally Posted by voodoomedman View Post
Bad guys aren't going to target you for being a civilian with a DL. They Target you if they think you're LEO.

It's not about a cop sifting through your wallet. It's about a thug sifting through your wallet. Might have let you go but thinks your LEO so just kills you.

Again I say moot point if you are always armed.


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Why would a bad guy be going through your wallet if you're carrying, and if your not carrying what does it matter of the bad guy see you have a ccw?
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  #44  
Old 04-30-2015, 7:47 AM
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Originally Posted by venom12784 View Post
Do you know all the rules for all 58 ia that you can carry in?
Why should I? Only need to worry about what my IA requires!!!
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  #45  
Old 04-30-2015, 7:56 AM
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Why should I? Only need to worry about what my IA requires!!!
You never travel out of the county you live in ? Then I guess you wouldn't need to know how others would like you to deal with this type if encounter
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  #46  
Old 04-30-2015, 8:06 AM
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Originally Posted by venom12784 View Post
You never travel out of the county you live in ? Then I guess you wouldn't need to know how others would like you to deal with this type if encounter
You are only obliged to follow the restrictions printed on YOUR permit by YOUR issuing agency regardless of where you travel in CA. So no, it does not matter what other counties do - you do not need to keep track of the rules for 58 different counties even if you travel to them.
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  #47  
Old 04-30-2015, 9:29 AM
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Originally Posted by venom12784 View Post
Why would a bad guy be going through your wallet if you're carrying, and if your not carrying what does it matter of the bad guy see you have a ccw?

He wouldn't if I was carrying. I'd have already defended myself from an attack. If I carry I have my permit. Not only is it required by law but it would be stupid not to.

Not having your gun then maybe you get mugged or jacked. They leave you and take off around corner they look to see what you've got and notice CCW which is essentially a Deputy ID. Decide to go back and wipe you out. Just saying something to consider. Thugs hate cops.

I don't know any decent cop that carried their ID/badge without their weapon for this very reason.

Again though moot point if you always carry.


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  #48  
Old 04-30-2015, 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Sky.Hawk View Post
You are only obliged to follow the restrictions printed on YOUR permit by YOUR issuing agency regardless of where you travel in CA. So no, it does not matter what other counties do - you do not need to keep track of the rules for 58 different counties even if you travel to them.
And that is a problem right there. You can do what you know to be right. You can obey the IA policy to the letter but, if youre stopped by a LEO in a different county or city, you may still be subjected to various problems including detainment, being disarmed or unlawful search. Why? Because you didnt inform properly according to how that LEO was trained. Lots of threads here about the uneven treatment of a CCW.
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  #49  
Old 04-30-2015, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by voodoomedman View Post
...... They leave you and take off around corner they look to see what you've got and notice CCW which is essentially a Deputy ID. Decide to go back and wipe you out. Just saying something to consider. Thugs hate cops.
What?? No, it's not.
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  #50  
Old 04-30-2015, 11:28 AM
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What?? No, it's not.
Maybe he carries one of these:

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  #51  
Old 04-30-2015, 11:35 AM
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Maybe he carries one of these:

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  #52  
Old 04-30-2015, 11:59 AM
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this is about as close to a deputy a ccw is
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  #53  
Old 04-30-2015, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by wisardd1 View Post
No, unless you are armed you DO NOT have to acknowledge your ccw! Per Greg Block. If you don't know who he is, I suggest you look him up and his part in creating the stadards for ccw in California.
LOL...

Please tell us what standards he has helped create???

.
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  #54  
Old 04-30-2015, 12:11 PM
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LOL...

Please tell us what standards he has helped create???

.
I'll second the question .. especially since there is nothing remotely resembling CCW Standards in this state, except for the DOJ requirements.
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  #55  
Old 04-30-2015, 12:20 PM
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Did you think this through? The ONLY reason for a cop to care is you might be armed. The ONLY reason IAs mandate disclosure is so the cop knows you're amred.

WHY would anyone care if you're NOT armed?

Ridiculous.
How does the Leo know your not armed?
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  #56  
Old 04-30-2015, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by venom12784 View Post
How does the Leo know your not armed?
Really? Any LTC individual who is armed will obviously show the LEO their CCW. If they don't... then what's the point in applying for one...
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  #57  
Old 04-30-2015, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by venom12784 View Post
How does the Leo know your not armed?
How does the Leo know ANYONE is not armed?
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  #58  
Old 04-30-2015, 12:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Citadelgrad87 View Post
How does the Leo know ANYONE is not armed?
A ltc isn't anyone. All I am saying I'd that it's a good idea to let the Leo know if you have a ccw and if your carrying or not.
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  #59  
Old 04-30-2015, 12:31 PM
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A ltc isn't anyone. All I am saying I'd that it's a good idea to let the Leo know if you have a ccw and if your carrying or not.
And you're wrong. If you have a CCW but are not carrying, it's a NOT a good idea to let them know. Without the weapon concealed, you ARE everybody.
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  #60  
Old 04-30-2015, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by tima View Post
This. Not sure why you would ever produce it when not carrying. Don't ask for extra attention.
The terms of my CCW require me to inform LEO [on official contact] that I have a CCW. It doesn't say "only when carrying a firearm."

So, I let them know. It has never resulted in a negative reaction, but has resulted in several positive ones.

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  #61  
Old 04-30-2015, 12:37 PM
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The terms of my CCW require me to inform LEO [on official contact] that I have a CCW. It doesn't say "only when carrying a firearm."

So, I let them know.
As its been noted, if your IA requires you to notify the LEO regardless if you're carrying or not then follow your IA rules.

As for those who only have to provide their CCW when they're carrying, lets just keep it as that.
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Old 04-30-2015, 12:38 PM
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And you're wrong. If you have a CCW but are not carrying, it's a NOT a good idea to let them know. Without the weapon concealed, you ARE everybody.
Why am I wrong
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  #63  
Old 04-30-2015, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Lives_In_Fresno View Post
The terms of my CCW require me to inform LEO [on official contact] that I have a CCW. It doesn't say "only when carrying a firearm."

So, I let them know. It has never resulted in a negative reaction, but has resulted in several positive ones.
Interesting - That's the first quoted CCW statement I've seen here that didn't included 'if armed' or 'if carrying a firearm' or something to that effect. Just goes to show everyone need to carefully read the documentation that comes with their LTC.
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  #64  
Old 04-30-2015, 12:45 PM
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Why am I wrong
The ONLY reason issuing agencies (those that do) require self identification is so the cop interacting with the permit holder is in possession of that information, BECAUSE there's a firearm where there normally would not be one. I can think of a few reasons. First, if the cop gets a glimpse of the weapon and is surprised by it, it is likely to be at least very tense, of not dangerous. Second, most cops would like to know the guy is carrying, even if they are fine with it.

What is the reason you think it's a "good idea" to tell a cop when you are not carrying a weapon? The reasons for disclosure only exist if there's a weapon.

It's like feeling some need to tell a cop who is questioning you inside a building about something you witnessed that your driver license requires you to wear corrective lenses. So what?

What is the possible relevance to the interaction? You initially claimed a cop would be mad if he found out you had a permit, were not carrying, and didn't tell him, right? What's the logic behind that thought? Without my weapon, I'm exactly like any other person the cop encounters all day long, except for a card that says, even though I'm not doing it, I can legally carry a firearm.

Why would ANY cop care?

That's why.
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  #65  
Old 04-30-2015, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Sky.Hawk View Post
You are only obliged to follow the restrictions printed on YOUR permit by YOUR issuing agency regardless of where you travel in CA. So no, it does not matter what other counties do - you do not need to keep track of the rules for 58 different counties even if you travel to them.
Sacramento County (typed on renewal) :
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If contacted by law enforcement and carrying a concealed weapon, you must advise the officer of the presence of a firearm either on your person or otherwise present
Funny at my renewal I was informed to always inform the LEO and state whether or not I had the firearm on me.
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  #66  
Old 04-30-2015, 1:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Lives_In_Fresno View Post
The terms of my CCW require me to inform LEO [on official contact] that I have a CCW. It doesn't say "only when carrying a firearm."

So, I let them know. It has never resulted in a negative reaction, but has resulted in several positive ones.
So in an instance when you're not carrying and leave you weapon at home with your carry Lic. next to it, you are in violation of your IA now because you can't show the LEO your LTC even though you are unarmed?

sounds more like the Gestapo. Maybe we should be tattooed.
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Old 04-30-2015, 2:12 PM
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So in an instance when you're not carrying and leave you weapon at home with your carry Lic. next to it, you are in violation of your IA now because you can't show the LEO your LTC even though you are unarmed?

sounds more like the Gestapo. Maybe we should be tattooed.
It would certainly make my job alot easier if all the cretins/thugs/"bad guys" had tattoos on their heads that marked them as such....

We are all adults here and should do what we think is best in each situation taking into account legalities, formalities, etc; but I know that as a LEO I would be more confused than anything if someone showed me a CCW permit but wasn't carrying at that time (or even informed me they had one but didn't have their permit or firearm on them at the time..)
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  #68  
Old 04-30-2015, 2:20 PM
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So in an instance when you're not carrying and leave you weapon at home with your carry Lic. next to it, you are in violation of your IA now because you can't show the LEO your LTC even though you are unarmed?

sounds more like the Gestapo. Maybe we should be tattooed.
I'm guessing that it just never occurred to the people developing the policy that there might be a time when I'm not carrying. I doubt they did it just to exercise power.

I don't mind telling officers I have one. Though I was carrying at the time, telling the CHP officer and acting cooperatively and nonthreatening resulted in my not receiving a ticket, when I clearly was in violation (85 in a 65). Got a warning instead.
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Old 04-30-2015, 3:07 PM
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I'm guessing that it just never occurred to the people developing the policy that there might be a time when I'm not carrying. I doubt they did it just to exercise power.

I don't mind telling officers I have one. Though I was carrying at the time, telling the CHP officer and acting cooperatively and nonthreatening resulted in my not receiving a ticket, when I clearly was in violation (85 in a 65). Got a warning instead.
So what your saying is being not a D bag and being cooperative with Leo can actually help us out . what a thought
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Old 04-30-2015, 3:42 PM
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So what your saying is being not a D bag and being cooperative with Leo can actually help us out . what a thought
Direct question: if I am not carrying for whatever reason, and I get stopped for speeding, is it "d bag" to not tell the cop I have a CCW but am not carrying"

Why?

I asked why you think it's a good idea, is it as simple as "if you don't tell them, you're a d bag?
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Old 04-30-2015, 3:46 PM
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Yup
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Old 04-30-2015, 3:47 PM
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Exactly how hard is it to let them know I have a permit I am not carrying
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Old 04-30-2015, 3:51 PM
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Exactly how hard is it to let them know I have a permit I am not carrying
I don't make decisions based on how hard something is. It's also not hard to tell the cop, yes, I know why you stopped me, I was speeding. But it is stupid.

Telling a cop you have a permit but are not carrying, when not required to do so by your IS, is foolish, gives irrelevent info, and is goofy.

A cop has already weighed in here, pardon me if I attribute his opinion more weight than yours.
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Old 04-30-2015, 4:20 PM
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Exactly how hard is it to let them know I have a permit I am not carrying
It's not hard at all, it's unnecessary. What good does it do for you in any given situation when you show your CCW when you're not carrying?

I'm not sure why we're still debating this issue him. If you carry, you can make your own decisions. So if you want to provide your CCW to the LEO when you're not carrying then so be it. Tell us how it goes afterwards.
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Old 04-30-2015, 4:38 PM
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It's not hard at all, it's unnecessary. What good does it do for you in any given situation when you show your CCW when you're not carrying?
It can show that you are one of the good guys, and might get you out of a ticket. what do you have to lose? Why NOT let them know?
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Old 04-30-2015, 4:43 PM
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I asked Greg Block, he said, No, only when you are armed!
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No, unless you are armed you DO NOT have to acknowledge your ccw! Per Greg Block. If you don't know who he is, I suggest you look him up and his part in creating the stadards for ccw in California.
The only thing you need to know about Greg is that he does not have the authority to issue a License to Carry in this, or any other, state. Nor can he levy restrictions on such permits.

As far as agency policies go, I think OC has one of the more entertaining:
Quote:
If contacted by a sworn peace officer for any reason, license holder shall immediately show their CCW license as proof that they are carrying a concealed weapon. (See #2 at: http://ocsd.org/civicax/filebank/blo...x?BlobID=31605
The license proves you are carrying a concealed weapon? WTF.

Last edited by Dvrjon; 04-30-2015 at 8:18 PM..
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Old 05-01-2015, 11:05 PM
Foul Ball Foul Ball is offline
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The cop will get the info if he/she contacts dispatch so if you're not carrying don't disclose and let him/her figure it out....
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Old 05-03-2015, 1:21 PM
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The Killer Sandwich The Killer Sandwich is offline
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+1 for always carrying my card. I am always carrying so I haven't given it much thought but I think it would differ based on why I'm dealing with the police if I offer my card or not without having a firearm on me.
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Old 05-03-2015, 1:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TACOPS View Post
I had previously been led to believe that when a LEO runs you DL and/or vehicle registration, as part of the electronic records search they are advised that you have a CCW and registered firearms.

Can anyone confirm?

If that is the case, perhaps better to provide full disclosure.
I have heard this also - Until I SEE it - I am thinking its mostly an Urban legend
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Old 05-03-2015, 3:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harley66 View Post
I have heard this also - Until I SEE it - I am thinking its mostly an Urban legend
Think about it. If this WERE the case, no ia would bother mandating that CCW identify to law enforcement.
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