Briar Patch

[USMCM16A2]

Folks,



We knew the laws that are coming down the turn pike were going to happen. the Insurance for gunowners, turn in your hi-caps, and low-caps. Ammo registration, ammo limits, evrything we bought before these bans ex-post facto confiscation. Guys, our lawyers are on the job and watching these situation. This is going to be our Civil Rights battle, just be patient. They are going balls out to stomp us out. Trow me into the Briar patch. A2

[njineermike]

Originally Posted by USMCM16A2

Folks,



We knew the laws that are coming down the turn pike were going to happen. the Insurance for gunowners, turn in your hi-caps, and low-caps. Ammo registration, ammo limits, evrything we bought before these bans ex-post facto confiscation. Guys, our lawyers are on the job and watching these situation. This is going to be our Civil Rights battle, just be patient. They are going balls out to stomp us out. Trow me into the Briar patch. A2

They better be on it fast, because those clowns in Sacramento have absolutely nothing stopping them.

[stitchnicklas]

Originally Posted by njineermike

They better be on it fast, because those clowns in Sacramento have absolutely nothing stopping them.

YES THEY DO.

courts,lawyers and a stud named gura

[glocksmith]

Originally Posted by stitchnicklas

YES THEY DO.

courts,lawyers and a stud named gura

This bad mofo >

[MadMax]

My concern is that we get six months to turn everything in and it doesn't even get in front of a judge for two years.

I know its a little paranoid but with the video I watched this morning it seems a lot closer to reality.

[IVC]

Originally Posted by MadMax

My concern is that we get six months to turn everything in and it doesn't even get in front of a judge for two years.

That's what preliminary injunctions are for.

The law doesn't take effect until it's all sorted out. Abortion bills are handled this way.

[speedrrracer]

Originally Posted by IVC

That's what preliminary injunctions are for.

The law doesn't take effect until it's all sorted out. Abortion bills are handled this way.

yeah, that's what they're for, but that doesn't mean we automatically get one

What do you think the odds are of getting one? I'm thinking slim to none. I'm only just starting to read on these things, but it seems (generally) the courts pretty much fall all over themselves deferring to the state.

Look at NY -- they outlawed Heller's own gun, and there's no PI over there (yet). How is that possible?

[IVC]

Originally Posted by speedrrracer

yeah, that's what they're for, but that doesn't mean we automatically get one

What do you think the odds are of getting one? I'm thinking slim to none. I'm only just starting to read on these things, but it seems (generally) the courts pretty much fall all over themselves deferring to the state.

Look at NY -- they outlawed Heller's own gun, and there's no PI over there (yet). How is that possible?

There is no such thing as a guaranteed PI, but it's not as bad as you might think. The "merit of a case" is the primary factor in granting a PI, but there are very important additional factors, primarily the "irreparable injury" caused by the lack of PI.

Almost all new proposed laws are on shaky legal grounds to begin with and are crafted in precisely the way to cause the maximum injury to the legal gun owners. In addition, the scope of 2A has not yet been completely settled by the SCOTUS and we have several circuit splits and pending certs. This makes the proposed laws prime candidates for PI - let the legal cases get to SCOTUS and figure out what is and isn't constitutional before causing an irreparable harm to the tens of millions of law abiding citizens.

A simple explanation for how PI-s work is here.

NY case hasn't been to the courts yet - it will be challenged for sure.

[elSquid]

Originally Posted by MadMax

My concern is that we get six months to turn everything in and it doesn't even get in front of a judge for two years.

I know its a little paranoid but with the video I watched this morning it seems a lot closer to reality.

When San Francisco passed its handgun ban the NRA got an injunction. It took ~3 years for the ban to be tossed, but in the interim nobody had to give up their handguns in SF.

http://www.sfgate.com/news/article/S...an-3218562.php

-- Michael

[Wherryj]

Originally Posted by MadMax

My concern is that we get six months to turn everything in and it doesn't even get in front of a judge for two years.

I know its a little paranoid but with the video I watched this morning it seems a lot closer to reality.

I'm not worried about that. I am certain that CalGuns, the NRA and/or the SAF via lawyers like Mr. Kilmer/Michaels, etc. already have briefs for an injunction ready.

There's very little chance that any of these laws will actually go live without getting to a court, and most likely without getting to a pretty high court. If nothing else, we'll all have plenty of time to arrange for our move out of state before having to comply.

[MadMax]

Right on thank you for letting me know, it made me fell a lot better.

[stitchnicklas]

i foresee Alan Gura becoming very rich with california tax dollars

[MadMax]

Originally Posted by stitchnicklas

i foresee Alan Gura becoming very rich with california tax dollars

One can only hope

[Hoooper]

Originally Posted by stitchnicklas

i foresee Alan Gura becoming very rich with california tax dollars

this was my first thought

[Dark Paladin]

Originally Posted by stitchnicklas

i foresee Alan Gura becoming very rich with california OUR tax dollars

FTFY. . .

[Sgt Raven]

Originally Posted by stitchnicklas

i foresee Alan Gura becoming very rich with california tax dollars

Between here NY and all the other places it's cropping up, we need a bunch of A. G. clones to fight all the battles brewing.

[Wherryj]

Originally Posted by stitchnicklas

i foresee Alan Gura becoming very rich with california tax dollars

I also hope so, yet THIS is one of the biggest reasons that we continue to see politicians willfully violating the Constitution. They have "no skin" in the game. They pass whatever they want and "let the courts decide".

There are several problems:
1. They SWORE AND OATH to PROTECT the Constitution. What they are doing is intentionally subverting it.
2. THEY aren't the ones who pay for the damage, it is ALWAYS the citizens, in loss of rights and loss of money. We pay the bill for the courts for BOTH sides AND we're the ones losing our rights.

There MUST be an amendment to stop this. I'd suggest that ANY author or co-author of ANY legislation-from school board/city council to federal level-that is struck down on Constitutional grounds be forever banned from ANY political office.

Think of it as a "felony" offense for a politician. You chose to do the crime, you WILL do the time and it isn't coming off your record. As a politician, your job is to protect the Constitutiion, not see just how close you can get to gutting it without getting caught.

[-hanko]

Originally Posted by Wherryj

I also hope so, yet THIS is one of the biggest reasons that we continue to see politicians willfully violating the Constitution. They have "no skin" in the game. They pass whatever they want and "let the courts decide".

There are several problems:
1. They SWORE AND OATH to PROTECT the Constitution. What they are doing is intentionally subverting it.
2. THEY aren't the ones who pay for the damage, it is ALWAYS the citizens, in loss of rights and loss of money. We pay the bill for the courts for BOTH sides AND we're the ones losing our rights.

There MUST be an amendment to stop this. I'd suggest that ANY author or co-author of ANY legislation-from school board/city council to federal level-that is struck down on Constitutional grounds be forever banned from ANY political office.

Think of it as a "felony" offense for a politician. You chose to do the crime, you WILL do the time and it isn't coming off your record. As a politician, your job is to protect the Constitutiion, not see just how close you can get to gutting it without getting caught.

Great points, and they also include the VOTERS.

When 50% or so Cal-Gunners favor mandatory background checks, while knowing that statistically they do ZERO to reduce violent crime, it's not hard to understand why Califorinia political arse-wipes get elected.

-hanko

[robcoe]

Originally Posted by USMCM16A2

Folks,



We knew the laws that are coming down the turn pike were going to happen. the Insurance for gunowners, turn in your hi-caps, and low-caps. Ammo registration, ammo limits, evrything we bought before these bans ex-post facto confiscation. Guys, our lawyers are on the job and watching these situation. This is going to be our Civil Rights battle, just be patient. They are going balls out to stomp us out. Trow me into the Briar patch. A2

I am really ****ing sick of being tossed in the ****ing briar patch

[njineermike]

Originally Posted by robcoe

I am really ****ing sick of being tossed in the ****ing briar patch

This

[WootSauce]

Originally Posted by robcoe

I am really ****ing sick of being tossed in the ****ing briar patch

+1 this

It was the same thing with UOC ban passing = LTC

well it's 2013 and I still can't get an LTC...

[phamkl]

Originally Posted by robcoe

I am really ****ing sick of being tossed in the ****ing briar patch

Absolutely.

[morfeeis]

I reserved my truck to move out of this state on Monday, with the news today it just confirms that even at the huge loss i'm taking I MADE THE RIGHT CHOICE. You guys can cling to the "briarpatch" argument, but the forces against you are firm in their resolve. If you don't ready yourselves for a fight your rights will be gone in a year or so.

God speed

[Springfield45]

Originally Posted by morfeeis

I reserved my truck to move out of this state on Monday, with the news today it just confirms that even at the huge loss i'm taking I MADE THE RIGHT CHOICE. You guys can cling to the "briarpatch" argument, but the forces against you are firm in their resolve. If you don't ready yourselves for a fight your rights will be gone in a year or so.

God speed

Don't be surprised when these stupid laws pop up in your new home state. The fight for our rights doesn't end at the California border.

[ElvenSoul]

Ha I fear there will not be enough torches & Pitchforks for when the sleepers awaken

[SpunkyJivl]

Where should I donate? Where will my $ be best put to use to fight this crap. NRA? CGF? Personal check to Alan?

[fishandhunt4ever]

Originally Posted by SpunkyJivl

Where should I donate? Where will my $ be best put to use to fight this crap. NRA? CGF? Personal check to Alan?

You can always donate to my future law school fund...lol

[00Medic]

I'm actually surprised they didn't go the N.Y. way and push it through "closed door, middle of the night, 5min to read and vote on" style.
And I am actually very happy they took the plunge and went FULL retard. It will make it that much easier to shoot these things down in court.

For some reason I am not panicing like I thought I would. As completly asinine as these bills and proposales are I get the feeling the people will rise up and be heard. And I feel courts will help us in the long run.

Just my $0.02

[soopafly]

Originally Posted by USMCM16A2

We knew the laws that are coming down the turn pike were going to happen. the Insurance for gunowners, turn in your hi-caps, and low-caps. Ammo registration, ammo limits, evrything we bought before these bans ex-post facto confiscation.

and they won't even have the common courtesy to give you a reach around...

[mossy]

yeah, i just hope they are not signed or we get a preliminary injunction. i am sure the right people are all over this right now and will tell us whats up when they are ready with their plans.

[stix213]

In Gura We Trust

[mag360]

these people are so stupid! texas is looking *really* good.

[stitchnicklas]

i say we assign a 30 man defense team to guard gura 24/7

[Panda48264]

Even if we take them to court for WHEN they pass these unconstitutional laws, it will take a good chunk of time before anything is repealed. I will continue to support the fight for our constitutional rights, but I'm afraid I'm going to do it in exile.

[wildhawker]

This is going to be an expensive year. Please help us all you can. http://firearmspolicy.org/join.

-Brandon

[totus44]

I heard an interesting suggestion on the radio this morning (SD-Slater's show). A caller proposed a petition for a ballot initiative that if passed, would make state politicians personally liable for authoring/voting/signing bills that are found to be unconstitutional.

I am not an attorney, nor am I versed in State/Federal law - but I thought it was an interesting concept given that we seem to have a supermajority that flies in the face of the constitution with impunity.

[romadant]

Originally Posted by totus44

I heard an interesting suggestion on the radio this morning (SD-Slater's show). A caller proposed a petition for a ballot initiative that if passed, would make state politicians personally liable for authoring/voting/signing bills that are found to be unconstitutional.

I am not an attorney, nor am I versed in State/Federal law - but I thought it was an interesting concept given that we seem to have a supermajority that flies in the face of the constitution with impunity.

I like this idea. A LOT.

I don't know anything about the petition/ballot initiative process though.

[Drawman]

Originally Posted by romadant

I like this idea. A LOT.

I don't know anything about the petition/ballot initiative process though.

May 4, 2011 - Suggested last day for proponent(s) to submit proposed measure to the Attorney General and request a circulating title and summary

IF this task is going to be undertaken, time is short. I went to the Secretary of State website (and using the examples from the last election cycle above) there is not much time to get this rolling

[compulsivegunbuyer]

That grandfather bill will include your RAW's too.

[Wherryj]

Originally Posted by totus44

I heard an interesting suggestion on the radio this morning (SD-Slater's show). A caller proposed a petition for a ballot initiative that if passed, would make state politicians personally liable for authoring/voting/signing bills that are found to be unconstitutional.

I am not an attorney, nor am I versed in State/Federal law - but I thought it was an interesting concept given that we seem to have a supermajority that flies in the face of the constitution with impunity.

I don't see how you will ever make them financially liable, but my idea of making them responsible via a permanent ban from office (ANY OFFICE) could work. After all, "serving" as a politician IS a "privilege", not a right.

Such a privilege should be approached with a great understanding for the RESPONSIBILITY it demands. Tap dancing around the Constitution should not be done lightly.

As it is now politicians are not only held harmless, they are able to BENEFIT from losing these cases. They get tips on how to attempt the next attack on our rights. This should be treated like shooting at, but NOT HITTING, a law enforcement officer. Sure, no damage was actually done, but it is still a VERY SERIOUS attempt and must be dealt with promptly.