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Survival and Preparations Long and short term survival and 'prepping'. |
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#81
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So why is a 1oz silver eagle coin $68??
Shouldn't be around $30? Just started looking at buying some of these.. not sure I "get it".. If you're buying PM then don't you want to buy coins that are just a couple of bucks over the spot price of the metal? http://www.apmex.com/category/1659/....=041713Cat1659
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“People believed that the opposite of war is peace. The truth is that the opposite of war is more often slavery” - Battlestar Galactica Member: Patron member NRA, lifetime member SAF, CRPA |
#82
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Looked over APMEX and they are sold out of circulated (i.e. used) American Silver Eagles. All that is left is the collector or numismatic ones.
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All things being equal... |
#83
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I notice that physical gold and silver eagles and maple leaf's are about sold out everywhere. So obviously there's a disconnect between physical PM's and paper PM's. I don't trust paper PM's since they are so overleveraged. Since the supply of physical PM's is so low, that tells me demand is incredibly high, and paper PM's are distorting the market.
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"Show me a young conservative and I'll show you a man without a heart. Show me an old liberal and I'll show you a man without a brain." - Sir Winston Churchill "I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue!" - Senator Barry Goldwater |
#85
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Im buying, Here is a good start
http://www.comparegoldprices.com/ https://www.comparesilverprices.com/ Been buying gold and silver for the last 10 years and have always made out good on these dips. Make it 10 to 15% of your portfolio and save it for a rainy day. It will go back up.
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"Only the mob and the elite can be attracted by the momentum of totalitarianism itself. The masses have to be won by propaganda." —Hannah Arendt |
#86
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Maybe I posted before, I can't remember, but premiums are sky high.
Paper silver is cheap, but physical silver jeez the rolls of silver dimes on ebay, the premium is ... value $82 and retail around $125 shipped and more...and I was paying around $135 in Dec. for the same thing when it was $32 an oz Liberty coin at https://libertycpm.com/silver/ $200 for $10 worth of silver is a lot cheaper, but maybe there's something I don't know, which could easily be the case |
#87
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Liberty is good on the price. The only hurdle is inventory sometimes but they will do rain checks if they don't have stock.
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"Only the mob and the elite can be attracted by the momentum of totalitarianism itself. The masses have to be won by propaganda." —Hannah Arendt |
#89
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"spot" and what someone is going to sell an ounce for are two very different things. Silver 'spot' prices have dropped quite a bit in the past month, the price of actually buying silver hasn't dropped anywhere near as much.
As to gold being worthless as some have posted here, that's about as intellect-laden as those 18 year old CEO's of over-valued dot-com companies that said "this time it's different"....right before the dot-com implosion. Gold has been a valuable commodity for thousands of years, that's not going to change simply because of iPhones and hybrid cars. |
#90
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From what I am hearing PHYSICAL gold is somewhat easy to find, but PHYSICAL silver is very hard to find and even if you do it will cost $7-8 over spot.
We Are Witnessing UNPRECEDENTED Shortages Of Ammo, Physical Gold And Physical Silver All Over The United States "The physical silver market is, in a word, ugly. There is no telling at this point when mint inventories will return to normal, but you can be sure it will not happen within the next 8 weeks. Most dealers, at this point, are selling their current customer demand forward, meaning they are selling product they do not presently have, expecting to pull from future mint allocations. Consequently, future allocations will face pressure from today’s demand." The reason why the prices are going back up is that the paper futures being dumped on the market is not suppressing the demand for physical. When these futures come due, there won't be enough physical to cover the contracts and dealers will have to offer to pay out cash in exchange, if the contract holders accept that. It is sort of like that BCG company taking money for an inventory that may not even exist. PM should be viewed primarily as wealth preservation and not an investment. |
#91
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Good to see this thread. My wife and I started buying when silver was at 33 and gold was at 1600, about 3 months ago. Being new to it, I researched for days before buying and everything said "BUY NOW". Nothing I read, stated it would fall this low. Kind of frustrated. We spent 700 on 1/10 gold and the rest silver. Now the lot is worth about around 600. Pissed. I guess I'll buy more then.
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#92
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#93
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I always tell people to only buy what you're willing to lose. And gold/silver should NOT be viewed as an investment. It is a store of wealth in uncertain times. You should keep a minimum amount regardless of what's happening with all your other money. Could gold drop back to $250/0z? Yes. Could silver drop back to $5/Oz? Yes. It's not probable, but it's possible. Plan accordingly. PM's should only be a small portion of a well balanced portfolio - traditionally around 5%. But in uncertain times you could bump that to 10%.
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"Show me a young conservative and I'll show you a man without a heart. Show me an old liberal and I'll show you a man without a brain." - Sir Winston Churchill "I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue!" - Senator Barry Goldwater |
#94
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HAHA! No, not at all. We invested for two reasons. One, is that we know it would be easier to save money if we can't go out and easily spend it, although we are GREAT at saving money to begin with. Kind of an experiment in this sense. The other, is that we are intermediate preppers and invest in several things that can be used to barter. We will ultimately only have what we can carry. I don't plan to sell our PMs unless there is a financial emergency. I'm just shocked that it is dropping this low. There was a whole lot of, "Experts forecast a 30% price increase in silver, in 2013". Guess not, but doesn't matter anyway cause we aren't selling. We are just kind of trying all kinds of new stuff as far as prepping and investing goes. Still learning.
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#95
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You should have bought another equal $ amount last week. Averaging your two purchase prices together would put you even today. Buy some gold today if you have the cash.
Another thing that will cheer you up is taking a look at the 10 year price chart every day. |
#96
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Pshhh, BROKE! Haha, that's funny cause I do do that. AND yes, it makes me feel better. But then again, I feel bad that I wasn't buying ten years ago. ARGH!
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#98
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check this place out for silver and gold
http://www.bluevaultsecure.com/
checked out blue vault the other day for silver and gold. some good prices on 10.00 ounce bars on the day i went it was 1.79 over spot. Also they can order in items to. Gold bars were 38.00 over spot If you rent a safe deposit box, they bump up the limit you can buy that day a limit of 20 american eagle but if you had a safe deposit box with them you could buy 60 If you buy over 1500 no tax. |
#99
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The challenge with bar stock in quantities over 1 oz, i.e. not the Pamp Suisse packaged and pretty containers but the 4 oz, 10 oz and larger bars, is in selling it. Most vendors wont give you spot price for it. I have seen 5%-15% below spot for true bullion silver in mint condition. Coins and the Pamp Suisse bars, I get spot for but nothing larger.
The above has been my experience for silver only. I wish I had that problem with gold ingots
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All things being equal... |
#100
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#101
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Silver
I'm not into leaving a large amount of silver or gold in a safe deposit box either.
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#102
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If one of your reasons for buying PMs is in the event of a SHTF situation, how would you get to it if it's stored in a safety deposit box?
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"The Second Amendment is a doomsday provision, one designed for those exceptionally rare circumstances where all other rights have failed—where the government refuses to stand for re-election and silences those who protest; where courts have lost the courage to oppose, or can find no one to enforce their decrees. However improbable these contingencies may seem today, facing them unprepared is a mistake free people get to make only once." - Justice Alex Kozinski, 9th US Circuit Crt of Appeals |
#103
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Gold and silver are mainly useful as currency, if the dollar crashes, and your cash isn't worth anything. So if you wanted to get a plane ticket to leave the country, and go someplace more stable, you could use gold to buy that ticket. If things are actually totally SHTF, then gold and silver won't be worth anything. It's only useful if worldwide markets are still intact, and the collapse is just in the USA.
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#104
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To understand the value of currency (any currency, but particularly precious metals as they have inherent value instead of artificial value), you must first comprehend what money represents: it is a token representing a given amount of a person's time and labor. Originally, people bartered goods and labor directly. But that is inefficient and impractical. For example, lets say you are a carpenter. You are hungry, so you go to a farmer and offer your services to build him a barn. In exchange, he offers you a goat at the completion of the job so you can feed yourself. But it's going to be hard to work for a week building a barn with no food in your belly. The problem is your labor is not liquid: you can not use it instantly to acquire what you need. As another example, lets say you are a stone carver. You want to buy a piece of land far from where you currently work. Over the years, you have made a number of of carved stone monuments. Are you going to haul several tons of carved rock across valleys, rivers, and mountain passes so that you can offer them in exchange of the plot of land you wish to purchase? In this case, the fruits of your labor are not portable. Now let's bring money into the picture. Money is a token that has a certain value as established by the society in which that currency is used. As you perform beneficial work for other people in your society, they compensate you for your time, your efforts, and your skill. Instead of giving you goats, or whatever they happen to have to compensate you, they instead give you a number of tokens (say, 1 oz gold coins) of established value in exchange for the goods or services you provided to them. In essence, those coins represent a piece of your life. The more valuable the goods and services your provide, or the longer you provide them, the more tokens you are compensated with. Likewise, you can then take those coins, which are both liquid and very portable, and use them to purchase the goods and services of other individuals. To summarize, money is nothing more than tokens that allow a person to exchange a piece of his life (time and labor) for a piece of another person's life (time and labor). (As an aside, this is why I believe a person should have the right to defend their property using any means, up to and including lethal force. Because when a person steals your money or possessions, they are stealing a part of your life. This is also why I am 100% opposed to welfare and other unconstitutional government "wealth redistribution" programs. Charity is a private affair and can only be determined individually by the person who's choosing to voluntarily surrender the tokens of their time and labor.) In a real SHTF scenario, many people will be bartering goods and services directly. But the same impracticalities I discussed above will apply. People will still need to have some type of currency with which to exchange goods and services in a liquid and portable manner. And since fiat money will be worthless, then precious metals will become the obvious currency of choice. There is still a lot to be learned from the people who lived thousands of years before us. Too bad liberals don't get that.
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"The Second Amendment is a doomsday provision, one designed for those exceptionally rare circumstances where all other rights have failed—where the government refuses to stand for re-election and silences those who protest; where courts have lost the courage to oppose, or can find no one to enforce their decrees. However improbable these contingencies may seem today, facing them unprepared is a mistake free people get to make only once." - Justice Alex Kozinski, 9th US Circuit Crt of Appeals Last edited by Spyguy; 01-31-2014 at 11:07 PM.. Reason: Changed "entitlement" to "wealth redistribution" for clarity. |
#105
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There was quite a story about a burglary at a bank in South America - not sure if it was Argentina or ? over a new years eve weekend a few years back - they cleaned out everyone's safe deposit boxes and of course the contents being uknown the insurance pay off left many short.
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#106
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To each is own
In the case of a total dollar collapse it will be up to each and every individual to decide what they will use for money or barter. You may give nothing for an ounce of silver where as I might pay handsomely for something needed. I have a large and expansive property which may need labor to farm - I may offer food, ammo or silver in payment to that labor - that is my choice. People wanting to work may choose not too if the pay is silver - but I suspect many will.
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#107
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I would not give you a sack of rice for a piece of metal in SHTF scenario. Just saying.
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1A - 2A= -1A :( |
#108
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What if you had 10,000 sacks of rice?
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Certified Ragaholic |
#109
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Perhaps not in the first few weeks or months. But eventually, some form of societal construct will develop. Apocalyptic anarchy will not last forever. In fact, it will last shorter than most people realize. Either groups of good guys will band together and hammer out something similar to what our Founders created, or groups of bad guys will become tyrannical overlords. Either way, there will be a need for currency, and fiat money won't be worth anything except as toilet paper.
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"The Second Amendment is a doomsday provision, one designed for those exceptionally rare circumstances where all other rights have failed—where the government refuses to stand for re-election and silences those who protest; where courts have lost the courage to oppose, or can find no one to enforce their decrees. However improbable these contingencies may seem today, facing them unprepared is a mistake free people get to make only once." - Justice Alex Kozinski, 9th US Circuit Crt of Appeals |
#111
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paper gold to bust?
I'll just put this little link right here:
http://www.infowars.com/are-we-on-th...per-gold-scam/ |
#112
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I see this happening if it were ever to happen.
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http://govnews.ca.gov/gov39mail/mail.php Thank your neighbor and fellow gun owners for passing Prop 63. For that gun control is a winning legislative agenda. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6Dj8tdSC1A contact the governor https://govnews.ca.gov/gov39mail/mail.php In Memory of Spc Torres May 5th 2006 al-Hillah, Iraq. I will miss you my friend. NRA Life Member. |
#114
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ETFs
Ever since silver and gold ETFs started they sold 3x the shares of bullion they held. I think it's actually 5% in gold and maybe 12.5% in silver at some of them. Ever since that's been the new and cry of infowars and the haters who think its got to be under your mattress or it's not real.
I've owned them in the past. They are a very affordable tool to invest retirement account funds in PMs, and guess what you can't take possession of physical metals in most IRAs only self directed and PM IRAs with lots of storage requirements and fees ( plus commissions ) so again the ETF is a valued means for a person with a small IRA to gain some exposure to PMs at ridiculously low costs. Why infowars and others who decry them selling shares for bullion they don't hold forget one very important FACT, and that is their customers who buy the shares don't want to hold the bullion either! Quote:
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#115
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Silver spot price down to $23.50, far cry from $48 a couple years ago. Trend is still moving down.
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Custom made Tail Gunner Trailer Hitch for sale. http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...php?p=17820185 "Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side kid" -Han Solo "A dull knife is as useless as the man who would dare carry it" |
#116
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How the market is manipulated...........
Gangster State America Paul Craig Roberts Prison Planet.com May 14, 2013 There are many signs of gangster state America. One is the collusion between federal authorities and banksters in a criminal conspiracy to rig the markets for gold and silver. My explanation that the sudden appearance of an unprecedented 400 ton short sale of gold on the COMEX in April was a manipulation designed to protect the dollar from the Federal Reserve’s quantitative easing policy has found acceptance among gold investors and hedge fund managers. The sale was a naked short. The seller had no gold to sell. COMEX reported having gold only equal to about half of the short sale in its vaults, and not all of that was available for delivery. No one but the Federal Reserve could have placed such an order, and the order came from one of the Fed’s bullion banks, one of the entities “too big to fail.” Bill Kaye of the Greater Asian Hedge Fund in Hong Kong and Dave Kranzler of Golden Returns Capital have filled in the details of how the manipulation worked. Being sophisticated investors of many years of experience, both Kaye and Kranzler understand that the financial press runs with the authorized story planted to serve the agenda that has been put into play. Institutional investors who have bullion in their portfolio do not want the expense associated with storing it securely. Instead, they buy into Exchange Traded Funds (ETF) and hold their bullion in the form of a paper claim. The largest, the SPDR Gold Trust or GLD, trades on the New York Stock Exchange. The trustee and custodian is a bankster, and only other banksters are able to turn investments into delivery of physical bullion. Only shares in the amount of 100,000 can be redeemed in gold. The price of bullion is not set in the physical market where individuals take delivery of bullion purchases. It is set in the paper futures market where short selling can drive down the price even if the demand for physical possession is rising. The paper gold market is also the market in which people speculate and leverage their positions, place stop-loss orders, and are subject to margin calls. When the enormous naked shorts hit the COMEX, stop-loss orders were triggered adding to the sales, and margin calls forced more sales. Investors who were not in on the manipulation lost a lot of money. The sales of GLD shares are accumulated by the banksters in 100,000 lots and presented to GLD for redemption in gold acquired at the driven down price. The short sale is leveraged by the stop-loss triggers and margin calls, and results in a profit for the banksters who placed the short sell order. The banksters then profit again as they sell the released gold into the physical market, especially in Asia, where demand has been stimulated by the sharp drop in bullion price and by the loss of confidence in fiat currency. Asian prices are usually at a higher premium above the spot prices in New York-London. Some readers have said “don’t bet against the Federal Reserve; the manipulation can go on forever.” But can it? As the ETFs such as GLD are drained of gold, their ability to cover any of their obligations to investors diminishes. In my opinion, these ETFs are like a fractional reserve banking system. The claims on gold exceed the amount of gold in the trusts. When the ETFs are looted of their gold by the banksters, the gold price will explode, as the claims on gold will greatly exceed the supply. Kranzler reports that the current June futures contracts are 12.5 times the amount of deliverable gold. If more than 8 percent of these trades were to demand delivery, COMEX would default. That such a situation is possible indicates the total failure of federal financial regulation. What the Federal Reserve has done in order to maintain its short-run policy of protecting the “banks too big too fail” is to make the inevitable reckoning more costly for the US economy. Another irony is the benefactors of the banksters sale of the gold leeched from the gold ETFs. Asia is the beneficiary, especially India and China. The “get out of gold line” of the US financial press enables China to unload its excess supply of dollars, accumulated from the offshored US economy, into the gold market at a suppressed price of gold. Kranzler points out that not only does the Fed’s manipulation permit Asia to offload US dollars for gold at low prices, but the obvious lack of confidence in the dollar that the manipulation demonstrates has caused wealthy European families to demand delivery of their gold holdings at bullion banks (the bullion banks are essentially the “banks too big to fail”). Kranzler notes that since January 1, more than 400 tons of gold have been drained from COMEX and gold ETF holdings in order to satisfy world demand for physical possession of bullion. Again we see that institutions of the US government are acting 100% against the interests of US citizens. Just who does the US government represent? Dr. Paul Craig Roberts is the father of Reaganomics and the former head of policy at the Department of Treasury. He is a columnist and was previously the editor of the Wall Street Journal. His latest book, “How the Economy Was Lost: The War of the Worlds,” details why America is disintegrating. |
#117
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I don't care for prisonplanet
But it does not mean they are always wrong. This story was dropped for the Boston bombing but I will again register my complaint with the lame stream media for not investigating this further. If in fact the FED short sold gold 72 hours or less before its collapse in the market someone should have to explain that.
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#118
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When including tax, looks like local stores here in the Bay area, are all selling about $8 above spot for AES. Even if you purchase online and factor in shipping and handling,we are still looking at around $6 above spot.
I haven't started into silver until this past month. Too bad I didn't start several years ago. Honestly I think this isn't the best time to start because of premiums, so I have just been purchasing moderately this month, and will stack them aside. The way I have rationalized it, is this is sort of a fun hobby, where I am not truly "spending" money, just transferring into a different asset. |
#119
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What tax? Buy over the minimum!
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#120
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$1500, while isn't a huge amount when it comes to an investment. I'm not really looking at silver as a classic investment, but more as a hedge against inflation. And its kind of fun to stack a little at a time.
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