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2nd Amend. Litigation Updates & Legal Discussion Discuss California 2A related litigation and legal topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel. |
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#2161
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Patience, grasshoppers. |
#2163
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#2164
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In my opinion all cases with abridgment of Rights at issue the law should be suspended until resolved. Patience is not an option when it comes to government interference with our Rights.
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F@$% Joe Biden Quote:
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#2165
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As shown, they can get things through if they want, which shows that they have no incentive to get this done. Don't try to imply other things.
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Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein |
#2166
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This ^^^^^
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Remember, you can post here because they died over there. www.BlackRiverTraining.com |
#2167
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So do you think the judges heard the case in March and wrote their decisions and are sitting on them, or do you think they heard the case, sat around for now going on 8 months and will whip something up later when they get around to it?
They cant possibly remember anything besides the gist of the case at this point. |
#2168
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It's like online shopping using overnight shipping. It's only "overnight" from the point the shipment is ready, so you end up with multiple days waiting for it. In the roster case, our item "hasn't shipped yet."
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NRA Benefactor Member |
#2169
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They have all the documents and they also wrote down anything from the orals they were interested in. Orals were only to ask questions and get clarifications anyway. The legal arguments are written down by each side.
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NRA Benefactor Member |
#2170
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Plus, what happens when some idiot says every single law in existence infringes on his rights? In your nightmare system, we then suspend every law, and live in the Wild West as the judicial system is forced to iterate through every law on the books, taking centuries to resolve? Yeah, bad idea and then some.
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#2171
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Orals are recorded. There is most likely a transcript of the oral arguments that can be referred to.
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#2172
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#2173
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You are correct. However, there IS precedent for government NOT having a blanket presumption of constitutionality. One example that comes to mind is the Voting Rights Act - where States found to have a history or rights suppression had to get pre-approval from DOJ before making new laws affecting voting rights.
This is exactly what I would like to see for the relatively few States that continue to treat 2A rights as privileges. Politically, given that 40+ States already treat those rights appropriately, I would think it would be an easy (er) political lift. Another from here in CA is the prison system, which was put under Federal receivership. I'd like to see the same kind of thing done to the gun unit at DOJ - which would help address the under the table regs, Rube Goldberg background check system designed to prevent instant approvals and require maximum human intervention (cost) and an organization dedicated to doing the Legislatures dirty work.
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Proud CGN Contributor USMC Pistol Team Alumni - Distinguished Pistol Shot Owner of multiple Constitutionally protected tools |
#2174
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If you believe that Rights are inherent in being a Human and totally unrelated to government, than it is easy to understand that they have been abridged regardless of what the courts say.
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F@$% Joe Biden Quote:
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#2175
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It also only works if you assume that the politicians are ethical and honest, that they don't pass laws that they want to see enforced for decades and will pass more laws when those previous laws have been tossed out in court. Sadly, it is a bad assumption to believe that.
Take a look at the CA smog impact fee and how that was handled. It shows that the government did not care about what was right, just what they could get away with. They don't face the fear of jail for their theft of money and fraudulent acts. The same law was tossed in FL, but continued to be enforced in CA until years later it was tossed. Then they had a form that could be filled out to get a refund, but they did not send notice to those who they had collected the fee from.
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Kemasa. False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse. Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong. Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein |
#2176
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Sure. What I meant was that the orals are more of a formality where judges clarify any issues they might personally have. Most of the case is decided based on references and legal arguments in briefs.
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NRA Benefactor Member |
#2177
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Until that determination is made, you cannot claim that our rights are infringed because you are still in the process of *determining* whether you're right or wrong. If/when our side wins, of course we will say "our rights HAVE BEEN infringed all this time," but it's a moot point since the courts will reverse the law at that time anyways. However, if we lose, then the other side says: "see, we told you so. You were fine all along."
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NRA Benefactor Member |
#2178
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Q: Is our side putting all our eggs in the Pena basket, or are there other attacks (legal or political) on the roster that I don't know about?
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240+ examples of CCWs Saving Lives. |
#2179
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I too am interested if there are any other irons in the fire on the roster as a whole, I’m not aware of any.
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#2180
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There's NSSF V. State of California, but i think that one is just primarily going after Microstamping.
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#2183
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Thanks for the replies, guys.
Yeah, I guess we're ----ed until Trump/Pence can replace Kennedy or 1 of the 4 antis with another Scalia clone. FWIW I saw an article that suggested Roy Moore losing the race for senator from AL may ensure that Kennedy steps down at the end of this term. Why? Because it increases the odds that Dems could win the Senate in Nov and stop any Trump SCOTUS pick from Jan 2019 until he leaves office in Jan 2021. Kennedy would not want that to happen. He knows how SCOTUS needs a full complement of justices to function optimally and 2 years of only 8 justices would be a disaster.
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240+ examples of CCWs Saving Lives. |
#2184
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#2185
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The article noted that Gorsuch clerked under Kennedy and that two of the top picks on Trump's "short list" also clerked for Kennedy. Since Kennedy sees that Trump's "taste" in judges is similar to his taste in law clerks, the "spin"/theory may have some validity: Kennedy may not be opposed to Trump choosing his replacement in 2018 versus who knows in 2020.
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240+ examples of CCWs Saving Lives. Last edited by Paladin; 12-15-2017 at 6:08 PM.. |
#2186
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#2188
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While Kennedy may be a Republican, that does not mean that he is a Trump fan or supporter. So the question is how he views Gorsuch's appointment and what promises would be needed to get him to retire. I would think that a very short list of proposed nominees might help. |
#2190
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Waiting for SCOTUS to consider the request. Follow along as SCOTUSblog - http://www.scotusblog.com/2018/01/pe...5/#more-265307
First conference was today.
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ARCHIVED Calguns Foundation Wiki here: http://web.archive.org/web/201908310...itle=Main_Page "The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."Ann Althouse: “Begin with the hypothesis that what they did is what they wanted to do. If they postured that they wanted to do something else, regard that as a con. Work from there. The world will make much more sense.” Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs. |
#2192
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I lost track ...
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ARCHIVED Calguns Foundation Wiki here: http://web.archive.org/web/201908310...itle=Main_Page "The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."Ann Althouse: “Begin with the hypothesis that what they did is what they wanted to do. If they postured that they wanted to do something else, regard that as a con. Work from there. The world will make much more sense.” Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs. |
#2194
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It was just a momentary disconnection from the Collective.
You don't think that he holds all this info in his head by himself, do you? He's OK now.
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#2197
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Someone forgot to give Librarian the latest firmware update
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Settle down, folks. The new "ghost gun" regulations probably don't do what you think they do. |
#2198
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Sometimes I think Lib is a bot. I don't know how he knows so much information and regurgitate it at will. He's probably a T-1000 and CGN is Skynet. They probably created him to store data and to maintain the site.
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WTB: 2.5” Colt Python 2.5" Smith & Wesson Model 19 2.5" Smith & Wesson Model 66 4" Smith & Wesson Model 19 3.5" Smith & Wesson Model 29 Colt Series 70 1911 Sig Sauer West German P228 Glock Gen5 19/17/34 MOS |
#2199
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It’s the CGN software alert monitor/moderator |
#2200
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He/She might need an update here pretty soon based on the last comment.
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