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  #1  
Old 05-14-2013, 5:07 PM
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Default Question for police officer regarding motorcycles

Any of you gentleman or ladies ever pull over a motorcycle that doesn't have their motorcycle stamp on there license? If so, what are the usual consequences? A buddy of mine continually rides w/o one. I keep on telling him that he could get into serious trouble...But as of now i'm unsure. Any guidance is appreciated.
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Old 05-14-2013, 5:10 PM
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They could be issued a citation for 12500(b)CVC


12500.
(a) A person may not drive a motor vehicle upon a highway, unless the person then holds a valid driver’s license issued under this code, except those persons who are expressly exempted under this code.

(b) A person may not drive a motorcycle, motor-driven cycle, or motorized bicycle upon a highway, unless the person then holds a valid driver’s license or endorsement issued under this code for that class, except those persons who are expressly exempted under this code, or those persons specifically authorized to operate motorized bicycles or motorized scooters with a valid driver’s license of any class, as specified in subdivision (h) of Section 12804.9.

(c) A person may not drive a motor vehicle in or upon any offstreet parking facility, unless the person then holds a valid driver’s license of the appropriate class or certification to operate the vehicle. As used in this subdivision, “offstreet parking facility” means any offstreet facility held open for use by the public for parking vehicles and includes any publicly owned facilities for offstreet parking, and privately owned facilities for offstreet parking where no fee is charged for the privilege to park and which are held open for the common public use of retail customers.

(d) A person may not drive a motor vehicle or combination of vehicles that is not of a type for which the person is licensed.

(e) A motorized scooter operated on public streets shall at all times be equipped with an engine that complies with the applicable State Air Resources Board emission requirements.
(Amended by Stats. 2007, Ch. 630, Sec. 3. Effective January 1, 2008.)
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Watch come Wednesday. It's going to be a landslide. Forget the polls, look at the census data, trump screwed up. Tell you what though if trump had made peace with woman and hispancis he could have pulled this off. But he kept at em. Just couldn't shut up.
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Old 05-14-2013, 5:12 PM
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vehicle confiscated?
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Old 05-14-2013, 5:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ksaeger31 View Post
vehicle confiscated?
No. Fine in the $150+ range.
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Originally Posted by waterfern View Post
Watch come Wednesday. It's going to be a landslide. Forget the polls, look at the census data, trump screwed up. Tell you what though if trump had made peace with woman and hispancis he could have pulled this off. But he kept at em. Just couldn't shut up.
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Old 05-14-2013, 5:17 PM
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Thanks trickster! appreciate your help. Stay safe out there.
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Old 05-14-2013, 5:46 PM
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I could have sworn they were towable with a 30 day impound. It's been a while, so I could definitely be wrong.

The unlicensed to drive portion under the towing authority?
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Old 05-14-2013, 7:32 PM
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I could have sworn they were towable with a 30 day impound. It's been a while, so I could definitely be wrong.

The unlicensed to drive portion under the towing authority?
12500(a) we would tow as it was a misdemeanor violation, 12500(b) is a infraction and we would not tow as they are licensed, just out of class. Legally, I guess that you could stretch it claiming that it all falls under 12500, but it wouldn't fly in my area and I don't believe that the 30 day impound law applies for vehicles driven out of class.
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Watch come Wednesday. It's going to be a landslide. Forget the polls, look at the census data, trump screwed up. Tell you what though if trump had made peace with woman and hispancis he could have pulled this off. But he kept at em. Just couldn't shut up.
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Last edited by TRICKSTER; 05-14-2013 at 7:51 PM..
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  #8  
Old 05-14-2013, 8:19 PM
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Default No M1 endorsement..

Those get towed, for Storage. Rider walks with a 12500(b) CVC cite. These can be easy to spot, dragging their feet from the light all the way across the intersection, helmet straps hanging down, unsteady in the corners.
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Old 05-14-2013, 9:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John1960 View Post
Those get towed, for Storage. Rider walks with a 12500(b) CVC cite. These can be easy to spot, dragging their feet from the light all the way across the intersection, helmet straps hanging down, unsteady in the corners.
Its funny you say that. I see riders do that all the time. Hes been riding for about alittle over a year and adapted really quick. You wouldnt believe the amount of riders that I come across that actually dont have an mc license.
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Old 05-14-2013, 10:28 PM
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vehicle can be towed for 22651(o) VC if no M1 endorsement. if license is suspended and MC is registered under their name can result in a 30 day impound 14601.6 VC
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Old 05-15-2013, 8:25 AM
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vehicle can be towed for 22651(o) VC if no M1 endorsement. if license is suspended and MC is registered under their name can result in a 30 day impound 14601.6 VC
This ^^^^ Can't let him continue to operate the MC if he is out of class.
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Old 05-15-2013, 9:04 AM
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Originally Posted by jay_cue View Post
vehicle can be towed for 22651(o) VC if no M1 endorsement. if license is suspended and MC is registered under their name can result in a 30 day impound 14601.6 VC
22651(o) is for registration expired over 6 months.
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Originally Posted by waterfern View Post
Watch come Wednesday. It's going to be a landslide. Forget the polls, look at the census data, trump screwed up. Tell you what though if trump had made peace with woman and hispancis he could have pulled this off. But he kept at em. Just couldn't shut up.
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  #13  
Old 05-15-2013, 10:08 AM
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Quote:
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22651(o) is for registration expired over 6 months.
You are correct, we would tow under the p section...
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  #14  
Old 05-15-2013, 4:28 PM
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Quote:
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Those get towed, for Storage. Rider walks with a 12500(b) CVC cite.
What we do.
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Old 05-16-2013, 1:29 PM
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under the B section its a $260 fine. If you get your bike towed and held for the 30 day impound its a $260 tow fee and $60 a day which adds up to $2320 in fees. Really not worth it if you think about it.
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Old 05-21-2013, 10:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TRICKSTER View Post
22651(o) is for registration expired over 6 months.
yeah sorry typo O is for registration. P for unlicensed.
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  #17  
Old 05-22-2013, 12:04 PM
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In the IE most are dismissed upon completion of a MSF rider training course and the m1 endorsement.
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Old 05-22-2013, 1:06 PM
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You may get the ticket dismissed or reduced if you get a M1, if your bike is towed you wont get any of that money back. Do the class
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Old 05-23-2013, 8:42 AM
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I can only recall pulling over one person without the endorsement.
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Old 05-23-2013, 9:55 AM
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I know a few guys who ride with no M1. Usually they just hammer down and run when they see the flashing lights. When they end up getting caught (they nearly always do, sometimes after a nasty crash, lack of an M1 is the least of their problems.
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  #21  
Old 05-23-2013, 12:20 PM
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Default Walking without an M1....

I believe in the M1 as evidence of training that will make you a safer Motorcycle rider, thus less likely to get yourself killed as a result of a motorist failing to yield, etc.
To support this premise, I often run the plate of the bike, then subsequently run that registered owners name through DMV to check for the endorsement.

Couple this with some other articulable reasonable suspicion and you can tow a lot of bikes, and just maybe provide the impetus for a person to take the training, thus increasing their odds for survival.

To the OP, I wouldn’t consider it “serious trouble”, more of an expensive inconvenience.
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Old 05-23-2013, 4:05 PM
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I wouldn't consider someone having the endorsement to be well trained or being safer. the written test is a joke, studied while I waited in line and passed. I took the route of taking the motorcycle safety course for the driving portion which eliminates the need to do the driving portion at the DMV. however you can easily do the driving portion at the DMV, which is just demonstrating you can ride in a circle at slow speeds. this is difficult for a sports bike, but people rent out small 125cc bikes which make it pretty easy. doesn't show you necessarily know how to ride and/or will be safe. (to be sure this isn't taken as a personal jab, this is a blanket statement) having a motorcycle and have no M1 is stupid. the least you would have to do is rent a small bike or heck find a friend that has one and drive it in a circle. otherwise pay $300 or however much it is to take the motorcycle safety class and be properly licensed. the class is cheaper than having your bike impounded and havin to pay those fees. I've seen people with brand new motorcycles and not even have a permit let alone the endorsement. I find it idiotic that someone can spend $10k on a bike and not get a license which cost nothing in comparison to the bike.
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Old 05-23-2013, 4:09 PM
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My favorite is playing the name game because they aren't carrying ID at all. You know, guilt of not having the M1 to begin with.
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Old 05-24-2013, 8:09 PM
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They're at least getting cited and most likely getting their bike stored for 22651 (p) VC. I've never heard of a 30 day impound for this situation. 30 day impound is if your license is suspended or revoked or if you've NEVER been issued a driver's license. In this scenario your friend has been issued a driver's license he's just out of class so unless its suspended or revoked it won't be taken for 30 days.
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Old 06-14-2013, 4:59 PM
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We tow bikes all the time for 12500(b) as they do not have a valid license to ride a motorcycle.
12500(b) A person may not drive a motorcycle, motor-driven cycle, or motorized bicycle upon a highway, unless the person then holds a valid driver’s license or endorsement issued under this code for that class, except those persons who are expressly exempted under this code, or those persons specifically authorized to operate motorized bicycles or motorized scooters with a valid driver’s license of any class, as specified in subdivision (h) of Section 12804.9.
We take them for 30 days. If they get their m/c endorsement during that 30 day period, they can come to an impound hearing and we will lift the hold.
if they run for being 12500(b), they just go to jail tired, and we still take the bike, plus they now most likely are facing felony evading charges.
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Old 06-18-2013, 6:37 AM
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Out of class does not mean unlicensed. We impound and cite but bike is avail for release to a licensed rider with proper endorsements
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Old 06-21-2013, 12:27 AM
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To the OP. just tell your buddy to get his endorsement that way he doesnt have to worry about fines, impounding, ect.
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Old 06-24-2013, 2:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Falconis View Post
My favorite is playing the name game because they aren't carrying ID at all. You know, guilt of not having the M1 to begin with.
I commonly refer to this as the "12-5 shuffle".
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Old 06-24-2013, 7:36 PM
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Impound under 14602.6(a) VC. Driver can always request a tow hearing.
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Old 06-24-2013, 8:05 PM
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Bike would get towed, period!

Hopefully that is all the guidance "your buddy" needs.
Wondering why "your buddy" isn't the one posting the question though.
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Old 09-01-2013, 12:16 PM
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thanks for all the info guys...So my "buddy" got his permit. What if he's caught on the freeways or riding at night...you know coming home from work?
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  #32  
Old 09-01-2013, 12:21 PM
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Also
Can
Be a misdeanor
If the officer chooses that course
Which can be worse, especially for gun rights, or ccw applications as to having a misdo on your record
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Old 09-01-2013, 1:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John1960 View Post
I believe in the M1 as evidence of training that will make you a safer Motorcycle rider, thus less likely to get yourself killed as a result of a motorist failing to yield, etc.
To support this premise, I often run the plate of the bike, then subsequently run that registered owners name through DMV to check for the endorsement.

Couple this with some other articulable reasonable suspicion and you can tow a lot of bikes, and just maybe provide the impetus for a person to take the training, thus increasing their odds for survival.

To the OP, I wouldn’t consider it “serious trouble”, more of an expensive inconvenience.
There's something bizarre about the fact that you need an endorsement to operate a motorcycle but need no additional endorsement or change in license class to careen down the highway with a 45 foot motorhome.
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Old 09-01-2013, 2:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cruising7388 View Post
There's something bizarre about the fact that you need an endorsement to operate a motorcycle but need no additional endorsement or change in license class to careen down the highway with a 45 foot motorhome.
Trying to make sense out of California laws are ya?
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  #35  
Old 09-01-2013, 2:44 PM
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Also, the M1 endorsement is not proof of training. If you can pass the written exam and take the DMV skill exam on a bike big enough to meet M1 standard (150CC or larger, IIRC), you can jump on your just-purchased Electra Glide and go for it. I administer an MSF course provider these days and we get students who have done exactly that. They tend to call us to take the BRC after they've crashed or near-crashed, unfortunately.
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Old 09-01-2013, 3:48 PM
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Where do you offer your MSF course
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Old 09-01-2013, 3:59 PM
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Hey OP, is your friend an illegal alien? If so and he is in L.A. District they will not tow him at all per the chief haha.
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Old 09-02-2013, 3:14 AM
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Quote:
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Trying to make sense out of California laws are ya?
Yeah, don't do that!
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