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Calguns LEOs LEOs; chat, kibitz and relax. Non-LEOs; have a questions for a cop? Ask it here, in a CIVIL manner.

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  #41  
Old 08-25-2013, 5:16 PM
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1CavScout 1CavScout is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuelx View Post
Big Samoan guy high on PCP??? You could probably hit him with a TRUCK and he wouldn't feel it...
yeah, it was pretty crazy. The guy was naked, sweaty and 5150. My ASP was just flexing when I was striking him. Not much effect at all. We eventually took a leg out and got enough people on top of him to get him under control.
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  #42  
Old 08-28-2013, 2:10 PM
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Straight stick!
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  #43  
Old 08-28-2013, 2:27 PM
Samuelx Samuelx is offline
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Originally Posted by 1CavScout View Post
yeah, it was pretty crazy. The guy was naked, sweaty and 5150. My ASP was just flexing when I was striking him. Not much effect at all. We eventually took a leg out and got enough people on top of him to get him under control.
Great job!
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  #44  
Old 08-29-2013, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by non sequitur View Post
"There's nothing like a nice piece of hickory."

- The Preacher
Well said!



The ASP and variants suck!!! Anyone who says they are good as impact weapons, I'd challenge to say they never used one on a tough and assaultive suspect. Those ASPs are more of a "disco" baton because you gotta fling it out all silly and such, like youre on the dance floor. A regular PR-24 is better and a straight stick is primo. Size and mass (don't get disgusting ) really matter when striking someone with an impact weapon.

I've always thought that the lighter and thinner ASP variants force the user to strike multiple times, whereas the heavier straight sticks "may" cause the same if not more damage with few strikes to a suspect. In today's litigious society, fewer impacts on a suspect just looks better than multiple strikes. I think the light weight ASP in more times than not, forces the user to strike more often than a heavier straight stick. This is just my opinion and not based on any facts or studies.

Now, acknowledging that im about to compare apples to moon rocks, I will say that swinging the heavier baseball bat at a fast pitch will knock the ball out of the park (usually). Wheras swinging an ASP at a fast pitch ball would probably just break the ASP 90% of the time. There's just no mass behind the swing of an ASP.
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  #45  
Old 08-29-2013, 11:28 AM
Samuelx Samuelx is offline
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TPT, you're right, size matters.

Basic physics says Force = mass x acceleration and Kinetic Energy = 1/2 x mass x velocity(squared)

How much impact you can get will depend on Both how heavy your baton is and how quickly/fast you can swing it. If really light, you can swing fast but won't have much effect - might sting a little bit (which is why I find the manufacturers marketing "air weight" type batons absolutely ridiculous); if really heavy, you won't be able to swing it very fast, it will tend to "push" rather than "pop", and you won't be able to easily change direction or deliver fast follow up strikes. How quickly you can swing it or how hard you can hit with it will also depend on things like strength, dexterity, body mechanics, etc. And effectiveness also can depend on impacted area(s) as well. The "ideal" baton is going to be different for different people - length, weight, grip diameter, materials, design, etc.

FWIW, a little while ago, I submitted a proposal to change our standard issue impact weapon from the side handle baton to a straight baton (still keeping the side handle as optional) and suggested an approved range of specs so that everyone would not be locked in to a one size fits all baton. Haven't heard anything back so far.

Last edited by Samuelx; 08-29-2013 at 11:31 AM..
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  #46  
Old 09-11-2013, 10:16 PM
Jack's Smirking Revenge Jack's Smirking Revenge is offline
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29" straight stick. The peacekeeper is pretty cool but not authorized where I work.
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  #47  
Old 09-18-2013, 2:35 AM
JM2012 JM2012 is offline
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I prefer my very beaten up and well worn (from sliding past the cage next to my seat, not from actual use!) 26" straight stick.

I've carried an ASP, an RCB, and old fashioned wood. I've actually used both the ASP and wood stick on actual criminals and both did their job. I've never had a situation where I thought the extra 3" of a 29" stick would make the slightest bit of difference. Real fights are not like DT training sessions.

Additionally, I've found that often the mere presence of a straight stick in a baton ring serves to discourage some of those who are contemplating resisting.
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