Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > GENERAL DISCUSSION > General gun discussions
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

General gun discussions This is a place to lounge and discuss firearm related topics with other forum members.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 02-21-2013, 7:36 PM
David1983's Avatar
David1983 David1983 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: orange county
Posts: 621
iTrader: 39 / 100%
Default Hornady critical defense...

Thoughts on this hollow point for home defense?

Any info would be greatly appreciated
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 02-21-2013, 8:04 PM
Bangzoom's Avatar
Bangzoom Bangzoom is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: High Desert
Posts: 6,613
iTrader: 41 / 100%
Default

expensive but very good

My cop buddy recommended it to me
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 02-21-2013, 8:18 PM
desertexplore desertexplore is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4,225
iTrader: 14 / 100%
Default

I am using them in 9mm for HD after reading all of the articles on them. I'm sure they will work fine.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 02-21-2013, 8:36 PM
Special Agent R's Avatar
Special Agent R Special Agent R is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Fair Oaks
Posts: 361
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Sheriff buddy recommended them to me as well. 9mm & 40cal here.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 02-21-2013, 8:38 PM
k1dude's Avatar
k1dude k1dude is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: la Republika Popular de Kalifornistan
Posts: 11,516
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

Are you sure your LEO friends aren't recommending Critical Duty and not Critical Defense?
__________________
"Show me a young conservative and I'll show you a man without a heart. Show me an old liberal and I'll show you a man without a brain." - Sir Winston Churchill

"I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue!" - Senator Barry Goldwater
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 02-21-2013, 8:41 PM
cowboy777's Avatar
cowboy777 cowboy777 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 428
iTrader: 19 / 100%
Default

I built a false wall with drywall on both sides as a target & put 8 wet phone books behind it. Shot it with this hornady round in 45 at about 6-7 yards. I recovered the bullet in the last phone book with zero expansion. It was so perfect I could reload it & shoot it again. I've taken pictures and will be emailing hornady about this.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 02-21-2013, 9:18 PM
desertexplore desertexplore is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4,225
iTrader: 14 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by k1dude View Post
Are you sure your LEO friends aren't recommending Critical Duty and not Critical Defense?
Oops on my end, I'm using Critical Duty. Sorry to the OP and members here, my bad. But, I think the Duty and Defense lines are pretty much the same?

Last edited by desertexplore; 02-22-2013 at 1:00 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 02-21-2013, 9:22 PM
Travis590A1's Avatar
Travis590A1 Travis590A1 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 5,233
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

I use PDX-1's in all my handguns.

Sent from my LG-P925 using Tapatalk 2
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 02-21-2013, 9:29 PM
AleksandreCz AleksandreCz is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,037
iTrader: 5 / 100%
Default

Assault Bullits !!!!

On a more serious note its good stuff the Bullet is great for Self-Defense and the rest of the components are well made and reliable.
__________________
I'm forever blowing bubbles,
Pretty bubbles in the air,
They fly so high,
Nearly reach the sky
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 02-21-2013, 9:48 PM
fremont lapua's Avatar
fremont lapua fremont lapua is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Fremont
Posts: 577
iTrader: 9 / 100%
Default

May have to use FMJ in San Francisco, they are trying to ban hollow point ammo. They say it is military ammo even though the military can not use hollow point ammo. What is this state doing to us.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 02-21-2013, 9:51 PM
Reductio's Avatar
Reductio Reductio is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 1,923
iTrader: 5 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cowboy777 View Post
I built a false wall with drywall on both sides as a target & put 8 wet phone books behind it. Shot it with this hornady round in 45 at about 6-7 yards. I recovered the bullet in the last phone book with zero expansion. It was so perfect I could reload it & shoot it again. I've taken pictures and will be emailing hornady about this.
Um, duh? What did you expect to happen when the hollow point got filled up with drywall?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by CSACANNONEER View Post
Ah, the old "form over function" argument. I guess some people would rather be seen with a hot blonde who won't put out than with a "Neil 8" who will make you .
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 02-21-2013, 10:04 PM
StuckInTheP.R.O.Ca's Avatar
StuckInTheP.R.O.Ca StuckInTheP.R.O.Ca is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Ca
Posts: 2,940
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reductio View Post
Um, duh? What did you expect to happen when the hollow point got filled up with drywall?
Its designed with a polymer "flex tip" that is supposed to prevent the cavity from getting clogged when going through barriers. Its inly supposed to deform in tissue or media that simulates tissue like ballistics gel.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 02-21-2013, 10:18 PM
digdug74's Avatar
digdug74 digdug74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Orange County, Ca
Posts: 1,014
iTrader: 40 / 100%
Default

Did pretty good in this guy's gel test (one my favorite youtube gun channels, BTW):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkOV3MJI1FU

I actually keep this load in my G35 in my nightstand. Less because I think it's the ultimate SD round, but rather, because it was what Turner's had in stock behind the counter when I walked in a few months ago.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 02-21-2013, 11:12 PM
k1dude's Avatar
k1dude k1dude is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: la Republika Popular de Kalifornistan
Posts: 11,516
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by desertexplore View Post
Oops on my end, I'm using Critical Duty. Sorry to the OP and members here, my bad. But, I think the Duty and Defense lines are pretty much the same.
I believe Critical Defense expands rapidly and is therefore better for less penetration through interior walls and resulting collateral damage. Critical Duty expands slowly allowing better penetration through walls, car doors, and windshields. They are very different.
__________________
"Show me a young conservative and I'll show you a man without a heart. Show me an old liberal and I'll show you a man without a brain." - Sir Winston Churchill

"I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue!" - Senator Barry Goldwater
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 02-21-2013, 11:52 PM
desertexplore desertexplore is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4,225
iTrader: 14 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by k1dude View Post
I believe Critical Defense expands rapidly and is therefore better for less penetration through interior walls and resulting collateral damage. Critical Duty expands slowly allowing better penetration through walls, car doors, and windshields. They are very different.
Hmmm... I got my Critical Duty for free, 2 boxes. I assumed it's good enough for HD, Hope I didnt pick the wrong HD ammo.

ADD- Looks like I am going to get my answer here from Hornady- The difference between Critical DUTY® & Critical DEFENSE®

Last edited by desertexplore; 02-22-2013 at 12:12 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 02-22-2013, 1:17 AM
k1dude's Avatar
k1dude k1dude is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: la Republika Popular de Kalifornistan
Posts: 11,516
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by desertexplore View Post
Hmmm... I got my Critical Duty for free, 2 boxes. I assumed it's good enough for HD, Hope I didnt pick the wrong HD ammo.

ADD- Looks like I am going to get my answer here from Hornady- The difference between Critical DUTY® & Critical DEFENSE®
You should be fine unless you live in an apartment, condo, small lot home, or if you have kids or other relatives living in the house. You wouldn't want Critical Duty going through too many walls and hurting an innocent.
__________________
"Show me a young conservative and I'll show you a man without a heart. Show me an old liberal and I'll show you a man without a brain." - Sir Winston Churchill

"I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue!" - Senator Barry Goldwater
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 02-22-2013, 1:19 AM
Sir Stunna Lot's Avatar
Sir Stunna Lot Sir Stunna Lot is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 849
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cowboy777 View Post
I built a false wall with drywall on both sides as a target & put 8 wet phone books behind it. Shot it with this hornady round in 45 at about 6-7 yards. I recovered the bullet in the last phone book with zero expansion. It was so perfect I could reload it & shoot it again. I've taken pictures and will be emailing hornady about this.
People arent made of paper, try ballistic gellatin and report back...
__________________
Hi
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 02-22-2013, 2:12 AM
desertexplore desertexplore is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4,225
iTrader: 14 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by k1dude View Post
You should be fine unless you live in an apartment, condo, small lot home, or if you have kids or other relatives living in the house. You wouldn't want Critical Duty going through too many walls and hurting an innocent.
Exactly what I was thinking as well. Thanks again.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 02-22-2013, 4:33 AM
Zartan's Avatar
Zartan Zartan is offline
In Memoriam
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Mountain House, Ca
Posts: 6,269
iTrader: 9 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Travis590A1 View Post
I use PDX-1's in all my handguns.
So do I, but I've seen a few videos of the tip getting clogged with clothing/denim, preventing expansion. I too have been thinking about Critical Defense, or Zombie Max, just a different colored tip.


__________________
"If he won't walk, walk him...be nice"
-Dalton



WTS: 870 Barrel Clamp/Railed Mount

http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/...af415fafe8.jpg
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 02-22-2013, 5:23 AM
wild_weasel's Avatar
wild_weasel wild_weasel is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Under the Guns
Posts: 1,252
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

I'm happy with the buck ammo I buy at Wal-Mart for home defense;
Remington or Federal 115gr JHP for my 9mm's
Remington 125 JHPs for my 357 Magnums’
Winchester White Box 230gr FMJ in my 45 Autos
I doubt if any evil doer would be able to tell me the difference between bulk and premium ammo.

Cheers,
W-W
__________________

Towards thee I roll, thou all-destroying but unconquering whale; to the last I grapple with thee; from hell's heart I stab at thee; for hate's sake I spit my last breath at thee.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 02-22-2013, 12:54 PM
negolien's Avatar
negolien negolien is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 4,830
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

I have Critical Defense and Gold dots staggered in my 1911 and glock 20. I Like the Critical Defense rounds becuase they feed better in my 1911 and they don't get clogged up with clothing if you're forced to use em in defense.
__________________
"Men sleep peacefully in their beds at night because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."

George Orwell

http://www.AnySoldier.com
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 02-22-2013, 2:39 PM
ODub ODub is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 473
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Wink

Quote:
Originally Posted by wild_weasel View Post
I'm happy with the buck ammo I buy at Wal-Mart for home defense;
Remington or Federal 115gr JHP for my 9mm's
Remington 125 JHPs for my 357 Magnums’
Winchester White Box 230gr FMJ in my 45 Autos
I doubt if any evil doer would be able to tell me the difference between bulk and premium ammo.
Whoa there, there is a HUGE difference in the terminal performance when you go from FMJ bulk ammo to a purpose-built defense load.

A FMJ bullet is built to punch clean holes in paper, while not fouling your gun or the range with excessive lead. This design also causes the bullet to punch through drywall, clothing, and flesh and keep going. Can you say "innocent bystander"?

A self defense or home defense JHP is designed to hit the same materials and rapidly expand, thus expending all of its energy in a target or obstacle. This creates huge wound channels and prevents the round from over penetrating and hitting other objects. Fewer unintended consequences.

That being said, I'd rather not be shot with a JHP or a FMJ
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 02-22-2013, 4:00 PM
MudCamper's Avatar
MudCamper MudCamper is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Sebastopol
Posts: 4,575
iTrader: 34 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by desertexplore View Post
But, I think the Duty and Defense lines are pretty much the same?
No. Critical Defense is designed for reliable expansion in tissue, after penetrating clothing. (The hollow points don't clog with clothing because of the little rubber widget.)

Critical Duty is designed for the FBI penetration tests, i.e., at least 12 inches of penetration in gel after passing through glass/wood/wallboard/etc.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 02-22-2013, 4:35 PM
Trenchfoot's Avatar
Trenchfoot Trenchfoot is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Little Manila
Posts: 7,293
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

I'm a fan of Speer Gold Dot's in my 1911 for home, and Buffalo Bore .38+P LSWCHP in my carry gun.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 02-22-2013, 11:32 PM
mabilis_matulis's Avatar
mabilis_matulis mabilis_matulis is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Sitting outside the basement
Posts: 5,121
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

I want to have one of those bullets..
__________________

"its hard to face the problem if the problem is your face"
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 02-22-2013, 11:46 PM
diveRN's Avatar
diveRN diveRN is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: 32.7555° N, 97.3308° W
Posts: 1,744
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

I keep Critical Defense loaded in .40 and emptied a magazine-full into a watermelon once. All rounds cycled through the gun flawlessly.

The watermelon didn't make it.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 02-23-2013, 12:12 AM
desertexplore desertexplore is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4,225
iTrader: 14 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by diveRN View Post
The watermelon didn't make it.
Haha, funny, thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 02-23-2013, 12:46 PM
DPmax DPmax is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 330
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by diveRN View Post
I keep Critical Defense loaded in .40 and emptied a magazine-full into a watermelon once. All rounds cycled through the gun flawlessly.

The watermelon didn't make it.
Sounds like Critical Defense would be perfect for defending yourself against Vegans!
__________________
Never follow the advice of Calguns Addicts,
They clearly don't know what they are talking about.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 02-23-2013, 1:49 PM
vliberatore's Avatar
vliberatore vliberatore is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Washington
Posts: 10,055
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Default

I keep my Critical Defense in my spare mag on my HD gun.

Only reason it isn't in the gun is that I like my Remington 124gr +P JHP a little better
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by fighterpilot562 View Post
Damn it man! We could have got drunk, called a taxi and drop by Kest house with a mega phone.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 02-23-2013, 2:11 PM
Purgatoiry's Avatar
Purgatoiry Purgatoiry is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 162
iTrader: 9 / 100%
Default

Everything I've read about critical defense seems like a gimmick. It doesn't pass FBI protocols and it seems like they somehow turned that around into a selling point for home defense. If I'm trusting an ammo to protect myself & my family I'm sticking with what's been field tested and reliable. Critical defense had a history of FTF's and any ammo that slaps a different coloured plug and says it's for zombies pretty much confirms to me it's a joke.
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 02-23-2013, 3:10 PM
BKinzey's Avatar
BKinzey BKinzey is offline
OT Banned
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Hollywierd
Posts: 4,390
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Here's a good but $$$ suggestion.

Any round you buy for HD should cycle reliably thru your firearm. As a test you should run 100 rounds thru your gun and not have any problems other than draining your wallet. In a HD situation you don't want your firearm to get finicky with your selected ammo.
__________________
Rogue American, Media Mercenary.
"A firearm is just a tool. Any tool can be used as a weapon, but the most powerful weapons were written."
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 02-23-2013, 3:14 PM
desertexplore desertexplore is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4,225
iTrader: 14 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Purgatoiry View Post
Everything I've read about critical defense seems like a gimmick. It doesn't pass FBI protocols and it seems like they somehow turned that around into a selling point for home defense. If I'm trusting an ammo to protect myself & my family I'm sticking with what's been field tested and reliable. Critical defense had a history of FTF's and any ammo that slaps a different coloured plug and says it's for zombies pretty much confirms to me it's a joke.
Interesting posting and a good read. Can you please give me more info on the ammo failing the FBI trails? It would help me out as the topic is very interesting to me. Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 02-23-2013, 5:05 PM
vliberatore's Avatar
vliberatore vliberatore is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Washington
Posts: 10,055
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Purgatoiry View Post
Everything I've read about critical defense seems like a gimmick. It doesn't pass FBI protocols and it seems like they somehow turned that around into a selling point for home defense. If I'm trusting an ammo to protect myself & my family I'm sticking with what's been field tested and reliable. Critical defense had a history of FTF's and any ammo that slaps a different coloured plug and says it's for zombies pretty much confirms to me it's a joke.
About the FTFs, I've had one when inserting a mag forcefully in my M&P with the slide open. Repeated it many times without an issue and never had a FTF other than that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by desertexplore View Post
Interesting posting and a good read. Can you please give me more info on the ammo failing the FBI trails? It would help me out as the topic is very interesting to me. Thanks
From earlier in the thread:

Quote:
Critical Duty is designed for the FBI penetration tests, i.e., at least 12 inches of penetration in gel after passing through glass/wood/wallboard/etc.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by fighterpilot562 View Post
Damn it man! We could have got drunk, called a taxi and drop by Kest house with a mega phone.

Last edited by vliberatore; 02-23-2013 at 5:15 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 02-23-2013, 5:11 PM
tdyoung1958 tdyoung1958 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Santa Cruz, PSRoCA
Posts: 798
iTrader: 6 / 88%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by David1983 View Post
Thoughts on this hollow point for home defense?

Any info would be greatly appreciated
good round, as long as your gun feeds it, my Sig 1911 hates them but loves Golden Saber
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 02-23-2013, 6:34 PM
MudCamper's Avatar
MudCamper MudCamper is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Sebastopol
Posts: 4,575
iTrader: 34 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by desertexplore View Post
Interesting posting and a good read. Can you please give me more info on the ammo failing the FBI trails? It would help me out as the topic is very interesting to me. Thanks

Critical Defense was designed to be a civilian self defense round. If you want maximum expansion you get CD. If you want barrier penetration then get Critical Duty or some other brand designed for that. Don't compare apples to oranges. Any round that passes the FBI test will by design be harder and expand less. I don't plan on having to shoot through car windshields very often.
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 02-24-2013, 1:30 AM
desertexplore desertexplore is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4,225
iTrader: 14 / 100%
Default

I got 2 boxes of Duty for free and funny thing now is I probably couldn't find the Defense rounds anywhere in Nor Cal. Since I'm stuck with them, I'm sure the Defense would will work fine in my P226 and Glock 17 if needed. I do like the heavier 135 grain bullet better as well.

Thanks for this thread topic. I know it's a boring topic for some, but I love talking various JHP ammo and performance.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 7:29 AM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2021, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.
All opinions, statements and remarks made by Calguns.net on this web site and elsewhere are solely attributable to Calguns.net.



Seams2SewBySusy