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-   -   Stanislaus (https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=352812)

Gray Peterson 10-14-2010 11:25 PM

Stanislaus
 
UPDATE (2014 May 28):
The sheriff's own policy dated 2013-02-27, under 218.2(f)(1) states that "Self Protection" may establish good cause. (See "CCW Policy" .pdf linked at: http://www.scsdonline.com/forms/conc...ns-permit.html). As seen on p. 6 of this thread, several CGNers say the the sheriff is issuing for "Self Protection" per the policy.

UPDATE (2015 Aug 10):
Policy 5/12/2015 at: http://www.scsdonline.com/records/ccw-appointment.html
links to .pdf of new policy where "Personal Protection" = GC

S&W629Lover 10-18-2010 9:09 PM

The coals are hot here in Stanislaus County for getting a CCW. Get down to the Stanislaus County Sheriffs department now and pick up an application, if you're serious and have a clean background.

Kid Stanislaus 10-25-2010 2:12 PM

There's another discussion hereabouts and it appears the Stan. Co. sheriff has seen the light on CCW. Great news.

Sheepdog1968 10-25-2010 3:36 PM

That's good to hear. Any idea how Calaveras county next door is in terms of CCWs?

Standard 10-27-2010 9:06 AM

I got mine in Stanislaus County, "Personal protection outside of the home" was my entire GC statement. No criminal background whatsoever.

Hdawg 11-07-2010 9:54 PM

About two years ago, I applied and was denied due to insufficient good cause. I was required to have completed my training and pay all the fees before I could submit my application. Now I've read in different posts around calguns that the most I have to pay up front is $20 and I can take my training after I have been approved. Also, I have seen that once the sheriff has had me livescanned, I don't have to do it again. Have I read all this right, or am I mistaken? Has the sheriff changed his policy? The documents that are posted here from the Stanislaus sheriff indicate that his policies have not changed. Do I go in and just demand that the law be followed? That seems like it would possibly cause some problems getting approved?

OleCuss 11-09-2010 2:01 PM

I don't think I'd go in and demand that they fix the process. You and I don't carry enough weight.

CGF is planning to educate California's sheriffs on the proper administration of the CCW application system. They may not like the education, but I'm assured it is coming.

For now, we suck it up and go get the CCW permit here in Stanislaus. After all, if you have a clean record the sheriff will almost certainly issue your CCW license - so it really doesn't matter all that much whether you do the training now or later - or whether you pay the entire fee now or pay it later. Right now in Stanislaus it really doesn't matter all that much.

In a county where they tend to deny you it matters. That's because there you'll be paying for a course you would not have had to take if they followed the law - and paid fees you should not have had to pay since they did not issue to you.

Hdawg 11-09-2010 7:58 PM

Ole Cuss, you're right, of course. I'll just have to bite the bullet and pay it all up front again. Do you know if I have to go throught the livescan again?

jmust1991 11-09-2010 8:09 PM

If I live in Ripon, do I go through Stanislaus, or San Joaquin? Or does it matter?

G17GUY 11-09-2010 8:20 PM

Ripon is in San Joaquin county, that sucks.

wildhawker 11-09-2010 9:24 PM

I agree with OleCuss, it's probably better for individual applications to avoid direct conflict and simply focus on getting the license. However, if you're interested in taking a stand, we can certainly appreciate such an outlook and will work with those applicants where it serves to advance the cause.

Hdawg, I suggest getting your license first and then, later, approaching the Sheriff's Dept. in a mailed letter (certified, return receipt requested) demanding the overpayment of fees based upon their improper policy. This is where we can help.

When you go back in to re-apply, you might want to inform the CCW coordinator that you do not believe they can assess more fees than another $20 initial fee since you already paid for the entire process, and that the law states "if the license applicant has previously applied to the same licensing authority...no additional application form or fingerprints shall be required" (PC Section 12052(b).) If they disagree, you may wish consider complying with their direction in order to achieve your objective in the short term. In any case, document document document! Keep good records of who/what/when/why/how and copies of everything.

Everyone, remember this email address: ccw@calgunsfoundation.org

Hdawg 11-10-2010 12:07 AM

Thank you for the input. I will go ahead with the training and then re-apply.

Kid Stanislaus 11-10-2010 11:00 PM

Does anybody know if Christenson puts limitations on how the carry gun is modified? I have CT laser sights on all the guns I want to carry. Is this going to be a problem? I've also bobbed the hammer on a S&W Model 66 snubbie.

OleCuss 11-13-2010 6:31 AM

I don't know of any restrictions based on modifications. They didn't even bother to ask about any mods when I applied.

obeygiant 11-13-2010 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kid Stanislaus (Post 5280928)
Does anybody know if Christenson puts limitations on how the carry gun is modified? I have CT laser sights on all the guns I want to carry. Is this going to be a problem? I've also bobbed the hammer on a S&W Model 66 snubbie.

There is no mention of "modifications" in the Stanislaus CCW Policy or Application,fwiw.

Kid Stanislaus 11-13-2010 7:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by obeygiant (Post 5292407)
There is no mention of "modifications" in the Stanislaus CCW Policy or Application,fwiw.

That's good to hear, I won't even bring it up when I interview. I'm a big fan of CT laser sights and I'd really rather not have to remove them.

Bushsguns 12-08-2010 3:24 AM

Ok question I know if you live in Modesto city limits you have to go through the PD for your CCW. Does anyone have any insight on how they are about issuing?

Gray Peterson 12-08-2010 7:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bushsguns (Post 5412287)
Ok question I know if you live in Modesto city limits you have to go through the PD for your CCW. Does anyone have any insight on how they are about issuing?

This is absolutely positively false. As a resident of a city with it's own PD you have two choices: the city PD or the county sheriff. Please go through your sheriff.

followingtherules 12-08-2010 8:29 AM

Gray-

I met with TPD, and the tried to go directly to SO and explained I had "talked" to TPD. Connie made it very clear, that the SO will not even accept the application or schedule an appt. without a rejection letter from TPD. This is a recent change that the sheriff committed to TPD's CoP so that TPD could "monitor" who is getting permits. So I am back to TPD in January to deal with this issue, pay the money, get rejected, then go to SO, pay the money and get my permit.

Any thoughts?

"just a guy trying to follow the rules..."

Gray Peterson 12-08-2010 8:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by followingtherules (Post 5412903)
Gray-

I met with TPD, and the tried to go directly to SO and explained I had "talked" to TPD. Connie made it very clear, that the SO will not even accept the application or schedule an appt. without a rejection letter from TPD. This is a recent change that the sheriff committed to TPD's CoP so that TPD could "monitor" who is getting permits. So I am back to TPD in January to deal with this issue, pay the money, get rejected, then go to SO, pay the money and get my permit.

Any thoughts?

"just a guy trying to follow the rules..."

Specifically:

Connie made it very clear, that the SO will not even accept the application or schedule an appt. without a rejection letter from TPD.

And I'll make it very clear to Connie: She and her boss the sheriff will take the applications from residents of Turlock without requiring anything else per Salute v. Pitchess, or she along with her boss can join a defendant's roster and be forced to explain under oath to a court why they're violating Salute.

Let me a quote of mine which has somehow ended up in the sig's of quite a few members here: "The Sheriff's will follow the law. Not "or else". WILL".

The sheriff is breaking the law and not "following the rules" of PC12050. Please pm both me and wildhawker, with your RL name, what happened specifically with Connie, and your phone number, I will call and reach out to you.

Do not under any circumstances go to Turlock PD, and do not under any circumstances cooperate with the sheriff's unlawful and illegal demands, especially demands which cost you money.

As a general statement to this board: People who abet a sheriff's illegal demands only supports the sheriff's in their incorrect belief that their own illegal actions are A-OK.

:rant:

Kid Stanislaus 12-08-2010 12:49 PM

GO GET'M GRAY!!

dantodd 12-08-2010 4:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gray Peterson (Post 5412968)
:rant:

RANT ON. RANT OFF.

The Ranter!!


(those damn clap on ads have gotten into my head...)

JohanD 12-08-2010 6:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gray Peterson (Post 5412968)
Specifically:

Connie made it very clear, that the SO will not even accept the application or schedule an appt. without a rejection letter from TPD.

And I'll make it very clear to Connie: She and her boss the sheriff will take the applications from residents of Turlock without requiring anything else per Salute v. Pitchess, or she along with her boss can join a defendant's roster and be forced to explain under oath to a court why they're violating Salute.

Let me a quote of mine which has somehow ended up in the sig's of quite a few members here: "The Sheriff's will follow the law. Not "or else". WILL".

The sheriff is breaking the law and not "following the rules" of PC12050. Please pm both me and wildhawker, with your RL name, what happened specifically with Connie, and your phone number, I will call and reach out to you.

Do not under any circumstances go to Turlock PD, and do not under any circumstances cooperate with the sheriff's unlawful and illegal demands, especially demands which cost you money.

As a general statement to this board: People who abet a sheriff's illegal demands only supports the sheriff's in their incorrect belief that their own illegal actions are A-OK.

:rant:

Bravo! :punk:

OleCuss 12-09-2010 8:48 AM

I confirmed current policy with Connie this a.m. Sheriff will, however, renew licenses previously issued to Turlock residents.

I live in Turlock and if someone wanted me to go to the sheriff's office and show them the relevant case law I'd be willing to arrange for that. I think the sheriff is a good guy and will see reason without getting sued.

Gray Peterson 12-09-2010 10:32 AM

From Brandon:

If you or someone you know reside in the City of Turlock, specifically, or Stanislaus County generally, do not have a carry license, and are interested in reforming Carry License policies and improving issuance in your area, please sign up to participate at https://www.calgunsfoundation.org/volunteer **ASAP**!

-Brandon

dantodd 12-09-2010 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OleCuss (Post 5418723)
I confirmed current policy with Connie this a.m. Sheriff will, however, renew licenses previously issued to Turlock residents.

I live in Turlock and if someone wanted me to go to the sheriff's office and show them the relevant case law I'd be willing to arrange for that. I think the sheriff is a good guy and will see reason without getting sued.

You can be absolutely 100% certain that Brandon and Gray made sure that the sheriff is well aware of all pertinent law. Now Brandon is making sure that he has an opportunity to show his willingness to follow that law.

wildhawker 12-09-2010 4:08 PM

http://images2.layoutsparks.com/1/17...er-tools-1.jpg

Mayhem 12-14-2010 5:21 PM

Quote:

Have you completed a gun safety course?
Attach a copy of the certificate to your
application.

Private Citizens: Safety course must be
taken within 90 days of your application.
Are they asking for it to be taken 90 before and/or after the Application. or do they just want it completed by the end of 90 days.

Reason I'm asking is I have P.O.S.T. Firearms Training certificate and several others training certificates from the mid to late 90's

Do I still have to take training?

obeygiant 12-14-2010 6:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mayhem (Post 5448537)
Are they asking for it to be taken 90 before and/or after the Application. or do they just want it completed by the end of 90 days.

Reason I'm asking is I have P.O.S.T. Firearms Training certificate and several others training certificates from the mid to late 90's

Do I still have to take training?

Within 90 days before or after the Application.

G17GUY 12-14-2010 7:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by obeygiant (Post 5448938)
Within 90 days before or after the Application.

Or 6 months for Judges, county employees, DDA's

Or every year for Custodial (jail sheriff), Reserve officers

wildhawker 12-15-2010 11:06 AM

Sorry, I'm having trouble finding where, exactly, the statute provides (or allows) for a different training period or regimen for classes of applicants created by the Sheriff...

Kid Stanislaus 12-18-2010 4:16 PM

I did my class with WTS in Jamestown today, they are nice folk and get my recommendation. I'll be taking a basic handgun class from them in the Spring. Next step is to get that application and appointment.

Paladin 12-18-2010 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S&W629Lover (Post 5150353)
The coals are hot here in Stanislaus County for getting a CCW. Get down to the Stanislaus County Sheriffs department now and pick up an application, if you're serious and have a clean background.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kid Stanislaus (Post 5186987)
There's another discussion hereabouts and it appears the Stan. Co. sheriff has seen the light on CCW. Great news.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Standard (Post 5197213)
I got mine in Stanislaus County, "Personal protection outside of the home" was my entire GC statement. No criminal background whatsoever.

Quote:

Originally Posted by OleCuss (Post 5272596)
CGF is planning to educate California's sheriffs on the proper administration of the CCW application system. They may not like the education, but I'm assured it is coming.

For now, we suck it up and go get the CCW permit here in Stanislaus. After all, if you have a clean record the sheriff will almost certainly issue your CCW license - so it really doesn't matter all that much whether you do the training now or later - or whether you pay the entire fee now or pay it later. Right now in Stanislaus it really doesn't matter all that much.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wildhawker (Post 5274853)
I agree with OleCuss, it's probably better for individual applications to avoid direct conflict and simply focus on getting the license. However, if you're interested in taking a stand, we can certainly appreciate such an outlook and will work with those applicants where it serves to advance the cause.

So what is the "official" status of Stanislaus acc to CGF: "time to apply" or wait because the Right People still in discussions w/the SO?

wildhawker 12-19-2010 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paladin (Post 5471117)
So what is the "official" status of Stanislaus acc to CGF: "time to apply" or wait because the Right People still in discussions w/the SO?

We suggest holding tight until our efforts resolve.

-Brandon

Kid Stanislaus 12-19-2010 9:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wildhawker (Post 5473276)
We suggest holding tight until our efforts resolve.

-Brandon

I've taken my class. Are you saying to hold off applying until further notice?

wildhawker 12-19-2010 9:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kid Stanislaus (Post 5475629)
I've taken my class. Are you saying to hold off applying until further notice?

No. Those who've volunteered and I contacted should proceed. However, we would like to contain this effort somewhat until it fully resolves.

wildhawker 12-29-2010 12:38 PM

Everyone who participated will be receiving a letter. Please scan and email it to me ASAP and notate if you are a Turlock resident.

-Brandon

followingtherules 01-08-2011 9:29 AM

FYI, I received an email from the Madison Society that says the SO did not require a member to be rejected from Turlock before applying. Has anyone else experienced this, or have we received any responses that the policy change was made?

G17GUY 01-08-2011 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by followingtherules (Post 5578767)
FYI, I received an email from the Madison Society that says the SO did not require a member to be rejected from Turlock before applying. Has anyone else experienced this, or have we received any responses that the policy change was made?


How recent was the email? Can you post it?

This change is recent and there are reports of the policy change. You can always call the sheriff office and ask if you Don't believe it.

Posted 01-05-2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Geologist (Post 5563794)
I took mine through Madison Society; however, when I called the Sheriff's office to make my appointment, Connie told me that I had to apply at Turlock PD first. If I was denied then I could apply through the Sheriff. That was the new policy. Where in the PC does it say I must do that? I did not see that referenced in the policy either (Salute vs Pitchess). Guess we are just special in Turlock.

https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/...=298723&page=5

wildhawker 01-08-2011 12:25 PM

If the Stanislaus County SO is accepting applications "without prejudice", it's a recent change. We'll be asking volunteers to test this ASAP.

-Brandon


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