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-   -   The limits of rimfire? (https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=822253)

deckhandmike 09-12-2013 3:19 PM

The limits of rimfire?
 
With all the new restrictions on centerfire rifles coming down the pipe I was wondering how bad *** could you make a rimfire cartridge? I know nothing of reloading but I'm curious if a large population of people where willing to pay .50 cents a round for instance what are the limitations of the rimfire design and costs? How close could we get to .223 ballistics?

Whitefang 09-12-2013 3:21 PM

Read this

http://www.hickokfamilygenealogy.com...the_22_LR.html

njineermike 09-12-2013 3:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whitefang (Post 12295787)

Nice. Just an FYI, there's a section of highway 76 in Oceanside named for a CHP officer shot and killed from 100 yards away by a kid with a .22 who just wanted to see if the round would get that far.....

nastyhabts26 09-12-2013 3:41 PM

A .22 magnum is a zippy little round and will amaze some people.
Limitations are the wind speed, but we have made kills on rabbits out to 300 yards.
Not a lot but we have done it.

swifty 09-12-2013 4:15 PM

Rimfire cartridges have been around for many decades, in many different calibers. A simple internet search should be able to provide you with some options.

deckhandmike 09-12-2013 5:56 PM

Did a google search. Results were kinda vague. Sorry, .22lr is great but what can rimfire really do? Anything fast like a .17 with more weight?

'ol shooter 09-12-2013 6:21 PM

It will deter an attacker (real experience), and really piss off a Bear. Anything in between is a crap shoot.

midlife 09-12-2013 6:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'ol shooter (Post 12297436)
It will deter an attacker (real experience), and really piss off a Bear. Anything in between is a crap shoot.

Was the bear story real too?

CSACANNONEER 09-12-2013 6:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'ol shooter (Post 12297436)
It will deter an attacker (real experience), and really piss off a Bear. Anything in between is a crap shoot.

????????? Largebore rimfire rounds have taken big game and killed plenty of attackers with one shot.

LiferLance 09-12-2013 6:54 PM

I think CA may make a largebore rim fire a marketable cartridge. It would have to be similar to the 5.7x28 though so that rifle and pistol types could use the same round.

missiondude 09-12-2013 7:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LiferLance (Post 12297780)
I think CA may make a largebore rim fire a marketable cartridge. It would have to be similar to the 5.7x28 though so that rifle and pistol types could use the same round.

Until they fix the "loophole" and ban it when it becomes popular...:rolleyes:

deckhandmike 09-12-2013 7:05 PM

The 5.7x28 was actually the kinda round I was wishing for in rimfire.

thomashoward 09-12-2013 7:12 PM

Shot placement is still king

safety-1st 09-12-2013 7:14 PM

This will answer all your questions.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OUM1r_444CY

dangerranger 09-12-2013 7:33 PM

There are a couple of new rimfire rounds comming out and the re introduction of the 5mm remington. All of them are at the lower end of 223 bulistics. 17 winchester rimfire is the newest. DR

chad allred 09-12-2013 7:54 PM

I have no problem killing small game at 200 yards with my 17hmr....

coy80176 09-12-2013 8:20 PM

Good video...and kind of funny too
 
A few gems:

- one thing we've gathered here is a couple things...

- ...it will hurt your azz.

- if you get a hole in you that you weren't born with, you will die :D

postal 09-12-2013 9:34 PM

There is a big limitation on rimfire due to the strength of the casing around the rim. This limits pressure.

You can get pretty decent performance with some of the rimfire rounds out there... but nothing approaching moderate centerfire loads.

Also the obvious downside is that you cant reload rimfire.

As to the legislation and what you can/cant have/lethality... perhaps you should look at a modern black powder with sabot hunting rounds. I do expect it to pack a lot more wallop at distance than a rimfire. And you can reload it cheaply (except the price of the sabots)

G21Shooter 09-12-2013 9:55 PM

The most powerful rimfire round on the market currently is the 17 Winchester Supermag. It has 400 ft/lbs at the muzzle.

If a semi auto platform could be made that shot this round, think dedicated AR15 upper, it would be a potent gun for a rimfire at least.

SonofWWIIDI 09-12-2013 10:12 PM

Tagged. I'm interested!

glockman19 09-12-2013 10:16 PM

Israel snipers use .22lr to quietly kill.

6mmintl 09-13-2013 6:53 AM

Keep in mind .22s,l,LR are loaded with LEAD bullets and new laws are going to be coming down the liberal pipeline restricting shooting in public places (Public Ranges) soon.

Hunting with a .22 is now out.

Izzy43 09-13-2013 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6mmintl (Post 12302090)
Keep in mind .22s,l,LR are loaded with LEAD bullets and new laws are going to be coming down the liberal pipeline restricting shooting in public places (Public Ranges) soon.

Hunting with a .22 is now out.

Thought I was aware of all the new proposed laws. Which laws are in the pipeline to restrict the use of lead bullets? I know about the ones in the Condor Zone. Thanks.

MyOdessa 09-13-2013 11:26 AM

Old story, but I never seen it disputed for accuracy, except I did read same account, where she fired up to 6-8 rounds, reloading, one after another, from the single shot .22 LR rifle, possibly Stevens Favorite.

.22 LR FTW. :D

http://i312.photobucket.com/albums/l...pse68c890c.jpg

Quote:

On a spring day back in 1953, 63-year-old Bella Twin and her friend Dave Auger were hunting grouse and picking berries near Lesser Slave Lake in the Swan Hills of northern Alberta, Canada. As the story goes, they were walking an oil-exploration survey line when they ran into a humongous grizzly bear following the same line toward them. The two feared that if they ran, the grizzly would notice them and give chase, so they hid in a brush pile and hoped the big bruin would pass without any trouble.

Unfortunately for the bear, it was intent on getting its share of berries and came very near Twin and Auger. Frightened by the close encounter, Twin raised the rifle she was carrying and fired. Her aim was dead on. The grizzly was struck in the head and fell dead.

Bella’s bear was no ordinary griz. Its skull scored 26 5/16, placing it at the top of the list of Boone and Crockett world’s records where it stayed for many years. The bear currently ranks number 30 among the all-time records and still stands as the longest-reigning provincial big-game record in Alberta.


In the half century since Twin killed her record grizzly, many differing accounts of the incident have been given. However, all of them agree on one thing: little Bella Twin killed that 1,000-pound-plus griz with the humblest of all rifles—a single-shot, bolt-action, .22-caliber rimfire. With just one long-rifle cartridge, this petite Cree Indian grandmother finished off one of the biggest grizzlies ever documented and earned remembrance as one of the world’s truly legendary hunters.
http://catfishgumbo.blogspot.com/200...dmas-griz.html

dominic 09-13-2013 11:43 AM

The 22lr can bring down just about any game in north America. Saying that, as with any other round, shot placement is the key along with good tracking skills, since larger game may travel a ways before bleeding out. During the depression my father told us that him and his older brother fed an entire family of 12 with a single shot .22 and 12 gauge loaded with bird shot (and the occasional cut shell). If you don't know what a shotgun cut shell is, its a real old way to turn bird shot into a self-contained deer slug, but many say its not safe is not recommended.

command_liner 09-13-2013 2:42 PM

My recollection is that the Martini-Henry is rimfire.
How about a .557 rimfire? Is that good enough?

'ol shooter 09-13-2013 2:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by midlife (Post 12297483)
Was the bear story real too?

Absolutely, cross my heart. :D

chad allred 09-14-2013 8:49 AM

Wow...cut shells...learned something new there,never heard of them

rromeo 09-14-2013 9:30 AM

What about a non-traditional rimfire? It uses a standard boxer primer, offset in the case so now itis no longer centerfire.
The sticking point is indexing the primers, but it's not insurmountable. We're making a new cartridge and gun, so we can make changes from tradition.

coverme2 09-14-2013 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by njineermike (Post 12295819)
Nice. Just an FYI, there's a section of highway 76 in Oceanside named for a CHP officer shot and killed from 100 yards away by a kid with a .22 who just wanted to see if the round would get that far.....

That was not just "a kid with a .22 who just wanted to ser if the round would get that far......". He and he and his companions are documented gang members. They were seeking status with their gang. He and one of the three who were there are now in prison without the possibility of parole. As responsible firearms owners, read the links in the story...and prepare to be disgusted.

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loca...y-Son----.html

spamsucker 09-14-2013 12:26 PM

The original Henry rifle used a .44cal rimfire that was good for >1000fps with a 200gr LRN. Rimfire cases can handle pretty impressive pressures, some up around 30,000+psi.

CSACANNONEER 09-14-2013 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rromeo (Post 12312039)
What about a non-traditional rimfire? It uses a standard boxer primer, offset in the case so now itis no longer centerfire.
The sticking point is indexing the primers, but it's not insurmountable. We're making a new cartridge and gun, so we can make changes from tradition.

That would not fit the definition of "rimfire". But, it might not fit the definition of "centerfire" either.

dominic 09-14-2013 1:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coverme2 (Post 12312922)
That was not just "a kid with a .22 who just wanted to ser if the round would get that far......". He and he and his companions are documented gang members. They were seeking status with their gang. He and one of the three who were there are now in prison without the possibility of parole. As responsible firearms owners, read the links in the story...and prepare to be disgusted.

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loca...y-Son----.html

Thank you, the statement that he "just wanted to see if it would go that far" was bugging me to no end, like it was an excuse for what this punk did.

njineermike 09-14-2013 1:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dominic (Post 12313416)
Thank you, the statement that he "just wanted to see if it would go that far" was bugging me to no end, like it was an excuse for what this punk did.

Not excusing it in the slightest. Just pointing out a .22LR can kill from a distance.

ogarcia_02 09-14-2013 1:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Izzy43 (Post 12304186)
Thought I was aware of all the new proposed laws. Which laws are in the pipeline to restrict the use of lead bullets? I know about the ones in the Condor Zone. Thanks.

AB 711 (Rendon)
http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/fa...201320140AB711

jakejake527 09-14-2013 1:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coverme2 (Post 12312922)
That was not just "a kid with a .22 who just wanted to ser if the round would get that far......". He and he and his companions are documented gang members. They were seeking status with their gang. He and one of the three who were there are now in prison without the possibility of parole. As responsible firearms owners, read the links in the story...and prepare to be disgusted.

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loca...y-Son----.html

I live right by that highway....sad story

rromeo 09-14-2013 5:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSACANNONEER (Post 12313246)
That would not fit the definition of "rimfire". But, it might not fit the definition of "centerfire" either.

I may be mistaken, but does"rimfire" actually appear in any law? Most things mentio. "Centerfire" and we are on our own to conclude that rimfire is exempt. While it may not be a rimfire as we know it, not a centerfire means the same thing.

chknlyps2 09-14-2013 7:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6mmintl (Post 12302090)
Keep in mind .22s,l,LR are loaded with LEAD bullets and new laws are going to be coming down the liberal pipeline restricting shooting in public places (Public Ranges) soon.

Hunting with a .22 is now out.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Izzy43 (Post 12304186)
Thought I was aware of all the new proposed laws. Which laws are in the pipeline to restrict the use of lead bullets? I know about the ones in the Condor Zone. Thanks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ogarcia_02 (Post 12313472)

This Bill has not been signed into law yet, we all need to contact Governor Brown (Call, Email, Fax) http://govnews.ca.gov/gov39mail/mail.php and urge him to veto AB 711 and all the other gun Bills that are on his desk now.

kkp 09-16-2013 1:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LiferLance (Post 12297780)
I think CA may make a largebore rim fire a marketable cartridge. It would have to be similar to the 5.7x28 though so that rifle and pistol types could use the same round.

Rimfire is not banned in CA ONLY because it is relatively innocuous. If someone was to start cranking out enough large caliber rimfire weapons that can cause serious harm (easier than you can with .22lr, at least), you can be darned sure the word "rimfire" would be added right back into to every law on the books, ASAP.

kkp 09-16-2013 1:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rromeo (Post 12315062)
I may be mistaken, but does"rimfire" actually appear in any law? Most things mentio. "Centerfire" and we are on our own to conclude that rimfire is exempt. While it may not be a rimfire as we know it, not a centerfire means the same thing.

I think it does appear in a couple of laws, but not the ones we're worried about. Because the most pertinent laws specify "centerfire", anything not meeting the definition of centerfire is inherently unaffected by those laws.

If it's not specifically illegal, it's legal. That's how our legal system works. You have to be charged with violating a specific law.


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